My grandad today asked if my almost 2yo is 'dumb' -

[GunpowderGelatine]

My son, who is 22 months old, doesn't say very much. Mummy, daddy, doggy, bye, hiya, etc. He tries with other words like "outside" but just says 'side' or 'tairs' when he means 'downstairs'. I'm not concerned, his sister was pretty much having conversations at this age but I know it's senseless comparing the two of them. DS is very alert, engages really well and takes an interest in most things and people around him.

My grandad, who is 84, asked me today if he was saying much. I was honest and said no but he's getting there. Then he said "Be honest with me now, is he...dumb?" (He has to think about how to phrase the last word).

WTAF. I said no and don't ever call him anything like that again. He thinks I'm being sensitive and that I need to take him to the doctor. AIBU to be upset or am I being defensive?

By dumb he just means special needs. That's just how they used to phrase it. By what you've said I would talk to your HV as while it could just be a bit delayed development, it could be a sign of something more.

By dumb he just means special needs.

No he doesn't. He means not able to talk because that is what dumb means.

That's just how they used to phrase it

No it really isn't.

Davisday, yes it is how they used to phrase it.

I grew up with it and clearly remember it. It isn't a phrase I would use now, but it was the phraseology.

The ignorance on this thread is staggering. Even when faced with the facts.

Oops I feel horrid now, always discribed a set of grandparents as deaf and dumb because that’s what my dad calls them and always has. Never occurred to me it was rude and I’m late 30s and my dads in his late 50s.
I don’t believe the grandparents in question would be offend either.

Davisday, what facts are you referring to?

It is a fact that in the UK the word "dumb" used to be considered to mean unable (or perhaps unwilling) to speak. It still carries that dictionary definition now, although it is no longer the accepted terminology.

Using 'dumb' to mean stupid is an Americanism that came from the German immigrants. Dumm is German for stupid and was adopted in US. Dumb in English mean speechless or unable to speak. If someone is deaf too, the term is a deaf mute. I would use 'dumb' to mean without speech and I'm not 84 (yet, lol!)

I am going to avoid using the phrase "struck dumb" in future, because I would now be very concerned people might mistake my meaning...

My son was language delayed as a toddler and it was a pretty serious issue for him. It had a negative effect on both his productive language and his ability to learn how to read. I'm not saying that's what is happening with your DC but I wish we had gotten some intervention earlier.

I would use 'dumb' to mean without speech and I'm not 84 (yet, lol!)

Well, so would I and I'm not 84 yet either (grew up in 50s/60s). I had no idea it was now considered non-pc.

That generation have had to radically alter a lot of language that was used when they were younger. Virtually nobody (thankfully) would dream of using the terms ‘spastic ‘, ‘Mongol’ or ‘cripple’ now because the accepted terms have been in place a long time and those once ‘correct’ terms all became terms of abuse.

Dumb is far less frequently in use as mutism - or indeed language impairment to the degree of being completely non verbal- are less commonly used.

Forget the insult and make friends with grandad. Your little boy sounds fine.

There was even a Deaf and Dumb Society and it wasn't considered offensive at all.

Indeed there was but the British Deaf and Dumb Association dropped the word ‘dumb’ from there name in 1971!

I’ve looked the word dumb up. Interestingly some old languages (Norse, old English, old Saxon) only used the word to mean mute whereas in old high German it exclusively means stupid. So it appears there was a fork in the meaning centuries ago despite the modern spelling for both being identical.

Consequently in British English dumb for mute is correct albeit now redundant due to the American influence on our language.

I'm only in my 40's and when I was at school we would say someone was deaf and dumb if they were deaf and mute.
We certainly did not use this in a derogatory way, it was just the term used so I honestly don't going your grandad was deliberately trying to be mean

Oh we are friends, always were, I've just popped to see him again with DD in tow before we go on holiday and cleared it up. He did mean non-verbal rather than stupid!

That’s good OP

My mum is in her 70's . She still says mongel and backward 😱.... I have a son with sn who she adores , it's just her age . I have obvs corrected her but it still slips out .

My parents are in their eighties and used to use the word mongol too. They have copped onto that one though and do now say Downs Syndrome.

They always did refer to learning difficulties, probably because my mother taught in a special needs school.

Oh, good, OP, glad all clear with your grandad, have a lovely holiday!

My grandmother is 85 and wouldn’t dream of using the word mongel. Probably because her youngest son died of Down’s syndrome related heart problems at the age of 4. She certainly wouldn’t say ‘backward’ either.
She was head nurse at a children’s hospital.

I remember my grandad searching for a word to describe my disabled uncle. After a long painful pause he settled on the word invalid.

Glad things are sorted with GD OP 😊 I’m 52 and I remember when dumb meant not able to speak rather than stupid. My DS hardly spoke before he was 2 but talked plenty after that age. You’re right to not be too concerned.

He’s 84 for fucks sake give him some leeway

He meant 'mute' as opposed to 'not clever', it was a common term used a generation ago, nothing to get upset about I'm sure he didn't mean to offend you, he's 84.