To think if my husband’s so adamant he doesn’t want more children....

[QueenofmyPrinces]

I’ve been with my husband for 8 years, married for 5 and we have two sons, a 4.5 year old and a 14 month old.

I would love to have another baby but my husband has said absolutely not, no way, and I have made my peace with that. He wasn’t too keen on a second baby to be honest but he did agree in the end so I accept that it’s my turn to take his wishes seriously now.

Anyway, due to a chronic health condition I have and medication I take I have never been able to have hormonal contraception (the pill, the implant etc) and so have had Mirena Coils since I first met my now husband.

I’ve had awful experiences with them, horrendous insertions and even more horrendous extractions and generally just having unpleasant side effects with would affect me each day.

I have asked my DH whether he would consider having a vasectomy so I don’t have to go through all of that again but he’s said no. I appreciate that it’s his choice to have surgery or not but I feel like after 8 years of contraception being my job and not enjoying the option I had but doing it anyway, I can’t help but think that if he’s the one who is so adamant that he doesn’t want more children then he should be the one to ensure it doesn’t happen?

He has said we can just use condoms and I agree but I asked what we would do if there was an accident with it and he said I would have to take the MAP. I asked what would happen if that didn’t work, or a pregnancy isn’t detected until later, would he just expect me to get a termination?

He went quiet then because what could he say to that?

His current reason for not looking in to having a vasectomy is because he thinks it will hurt

We are now at a standstill!

Any thoughts or advice?

Honestly I couldn’t stay married to someone who had this little regard for me. He doesn’t care about you, what you have sacrificed to have children and maintain contraception, he just cares about what he wants. I think this would sour the whole relationship. I’m so sorry OP.

It’s nothing as bad as he thinks

They get an injection into the ball sack to numb it. The doctor than makes a tiny insciscon and the uses a lazer to slice the tubes. Once the anaesthetic was working, dh didn’t feel a thing

I think a lot of PPs have made valid points but are missing a key issue here.

For him to refuse a vasectomy on the grounds that it will hurt after your birth and contraception history is just downright selfish!

You need to sit down with him and ask him what he is going to do about this attitude and how this is hurtful for you. It's a relationship issue first and foremost - the details of how to deal with contraception responsibilities if he carries on refusing - and there have been many good suggestions - is beside the point.

But like a lot of people have said, he’s well within his rights to not want a surgical procedure and especially if there are possible long term risks to having it done.

I just don’t know anymore whether IAMBU or not by hounding him to get it done when he doesn’t want to.

He accepts I don’t want the Mirena and isn’t telling me to do so why shouldn’t I accept that he doesn’t want the vasectomy and stop going on at him?

As has been said, I wouldn’t like it if it was the other way round and he was trying to force me to get something done that I didn’t want.

But he is forcing you into being solely responsible for not reproducing. You have to take extra precautions, you have to take the MAP or terminate if you do fall pregnant. He isn't prepared to share the responsibility with you. So while he isn't badgering you into a surgical procedure, he is laying a hell of a lot at your door

Personally I'd just stick to oral.

I'm sorry but I agree that his reasons sound selfish. It may be he is genuinely scared, which a chat with the GP could really help with. Going to the GP could still have him not wanting to of course, which is fine, but would at least mean he's happy to explore taking the burden from you after all you've already done.

Here's a starter for ten on research...
www.nhs.uk/conditions/contraception/vasectomy-male-sterilisation/

Yes it can have risks, DH lay in bed with a bad of peas on his nuts for two days but sex now is soooo much better, in part because I know I won't get pregnant.

Has your DH ever been present when they put or removed the coil?
Have you told him the REALITY of having a coil, the day to day pain etc..?

Because I’ve learnt that when you are chronically ill or have some pain everyday, you tend not to talk about it. You dint mention the day to day ‘niggles’ and inlymention what is bigger. The issue iwth that is that th other person actually has no idea about how uncomfortable it actually is.

So I would suggest a talk with him and to say that for the next few weeks, you are going to tell him every single time you are feeling uncomfortable because of the coil. All the side effects.
I wouod ask him to be present next time they put it out.
And I wouod ask him to remember how bad you were when you had your CS. The Not driving for 6 weeks, the pain etc etc but also that you still looked after a newborn (and the an older child). Does he think the snip will be worse??

There is a need for a big reality check to do there re his comfort vs his.

It’s nothing as bad as he thinks. They get an injection into the ball sack to numb it.

And that can’t be worse than me having had needles into my spine to numb the lower half of my body.

I guess I’d be fine with condoms but would have to explain to my dh that knowing I am done with hormonal contraceptives after having endured them for our family for years so no map, and I won’t terminate, he’s thought about it and can hand on heart go I understand you have had many difficulties and pain from taking on the contraceptives and giving birth, and it’s my responsibility now. I understand you won’t terminate, so an accident will turn into a baby. If that happens I’m sure we will be a beautiful family of 5.
I’d also honestly explain I’m struggling a bit with the relative selfishness of the approach to having some risk and pain and that he thinks it’s my job but he’s too precious for it, im really sitting here feeling a bit unloved.

Anything else or anything less honest and it would be no sex for me I think, because ‘they can cut you open and I don’t care but nobody gives me a minor operation’ just doesn’t stir the libido really.

You can have sex it's just with the use of condoms.

Personally I think contraceptive is both parties responsibility. Cycle mapping works if done properly just as condoms work and don't have issues when used properly.

But your both going to have to be adults about it and either abstain from if he doesn't want to wear a condom and you are mid cycle or realise that it comes with the potential. Same issue if having drunken sex etc.

I get the impression from you though that a lot of the resistance to trusting condoms actually comes from either not liking them or when you have had cases in the past when you've taken MAP because you either didn't use them or had operator error.

Get the family planning clinic to give your DH and yourself a refresher in putting them on and common failures. You haven't used then in a long time the classic failure is not pinching the end.

I used to do teach sexual health to uni students and was always amazed by how many would get it wrong or come out with statements like we start having sex then he will put it on...... Just a quick reminder male natural lubricant can also contain sperm.

You are not forcing him to have it done - you just need to make it clear as others have said that you will not have MAP or abortion should condoms fail. Because that really would be you being forced to do something which is potentially dangerous and damaging to both physical and mental health.

And you are both being massively naive about the effectiveness of condoms!

It's not a question of you saying "you MUST have a vasectomy" . The conversation goes something like this.

I don't want to insist on you having a vasectomy, it's your body, your choice. However, you need to know how upset I am by you not choosing freely to have a vasectomy when you know what I have been through. It feels like you are prioritising you own well-being over mine in a massively disproportionate way.
When you love someone, you put their interests first and I am asking you to be prepared to make this sacrifice for me, in the same way as I would make sacrifices for you. So, how can you reassure me that you are committed to my wellbeing not just on this issue but in other areas as well, if you are not prepared to do this, as a solution to a problem we face?

And you are both being massively naive about the effectiveness of condoms!

As in they’re more effective than I give them credit for? The general opinion on here is that condoms are a pretty fail safe contraception where I always thought they werent.

No! As in they are LESS effective than some are making out. I have good friends - they are both medical professionals and very responsible so no danger of them not using condoms properly. Their 3-year-old is a result of condom failure.

No! As in they are LESS effective than some are making out.

One of the times that I had to use the MAP was a condom failure. It was with my boyfriend of 6 months and had been using condoms throughout so felt quite confident in our ability to use them. However, when he withdrew the condom was torn and about the top half of the condom was still inside me. People keep saying that mishaps are the results of user error but that isn’t always the case. Sometimes they just fail.

I had a similar conversation with my dh. Except vasectomy was his idea at first. We use condoms and I completely understand your worries about it resulting in pregnancy. Every month I have a little panic in the back of my head.

In the end I told him I couldn't take the stress so I would get sterilized. He immediately said no, it's much more invasive than a vasectomy. He's booked in for the op at the end of next month.

We'd both love another child, but we know we can't afford one so preventing pregnancy is our only choice. I agree that vasectomy is a much more permanent outcome but I can't take the responsibility any longer - I've taken that responsibility on for the last 20 odd years, so now it's his turn. Like you, op, I can't use hormonal contraceptives.

My hubby wasn't real keen because he was scared it would hurt too - I had two very long labours..... think days of contractions rather than hours.... with both ending in C-SECTIONS so the pain factor kind of flew over my head lol - ,

yes there are a minor percentage of men who have ongoing problems (as there is a minor percentage of women who will have everlasting problems due to pregnancy or child birth) but I cannot use any form of contraception and we have used condoms in the past..... he doesn't like to.

We didn't have any other options except for condoms or vasectomy, he had the snip, a couple of days late was back to normal apart from a little twinging pain around his testicular area that lasted a month or so and then has been fine since. It has been almost 18 months since he had it done and he doesn't regret it one bit.

Your husband is allowed not to want kids and also allowed not to want to have the snip, no matter how daft his reasons, you cant dump this responsibility on him anymore than he can't dump it on you.
You're obviously limited to contraception your self and have your own reasons fore not wanting to use your only choice which is fair enough.

I would say your only choice is condoms or you either take the risk or keep your legs crossed. NEITHER OF YOU should be forced in to anything you will resent or disagree with no matter how daft or genuine the opposition is.

If its ok for your to take the responsibility its ok for him to do so too, the do one of the above.

The problem is that he is dumping responsibility on her, by choosing a less reliable method (condoms) over the other option available to him, and telling OP she'll have to take MAP she doesn't want or potentially choose between an abortion and carrying a child he doesn't want.

If your dh is particularly squeamish he could have the vasectomy under general anaesthetic in a hospital - mine did. I’m not sure I’d want to have sex with a man who, having watched me go through so much pain wasn’t prepared to ‘take one for the team’. It would be different if he was undecided about future fertility but just not wanting the discomfort seems selfish.

1 in 10 have long term pain with about 20% of those being life long it is NOT a smple risk free operate and i dont mean a little pain delt with paracetamol or other low level pain killers

The statics are eadily googleable yes yes pregnancy can cause that sort of thing too. But does condoms and morning after pills do so?

I would say your only choice is condoms or you either take the risk or keep your legs crossed.

Keep your legs crossed?

And if the OP and her DH, 'take the risk' then who actually is left to sort it if she does get pregnant. It's not her DH is it?

Obviously you can't make anyone do anything they want to, but I look pretty dimly on anyone who insists they don't want more kids but is perfectly happy to watch the person they love continue to carry the entire contraception responsibility, including pumping themselves with artificial hormones, having to take the MAP or having to have an abortion. All of those things can 'hurt' by the way, if the pain is what he is worried about

OP you seem to be going around in circles!

I would also say your past condom failure was operator error or storage.

Go onto this website which has charity links for an interactive tool
www.nhs.uk/conditions/contraception/which-method-suits-me/

Obviously you need to have further discussions about this encouraging everyone to be honest about their feelings but it is his body at the end of the day. I'm a bit disappointed at the number of pp on here advocating for the use of coercion to get someone to have an invasive surgical procedure.

@worridmum
*1 in 10 have long term pain with about 20% of those being life long it is NOT a smple risk free operate and i dont mean a little pain delt with paracetamol or other low level pain killers

The statics are eadily googleable yes yes pregnancy can cause that sort of thing too. But does condoms and morning after pills do so?*

These statistics have been disputed and there is growing body of evidence to suggest the figure is closer to 1-2%.

Whilst condoms are pretty effective when used perfectly, people generally don't use them perfectly and in reality OP would probably be looking at an 18% chance of experiencing a contraception failure in any given year. The morning after pill is only 95% effective even when taken with 24 hours following a contraception failure, it's effectiveness decreases rapidly over time. Obviously this is all dependent on OP realising that there had been a contraception failure in the first place which isn't always obvious.

Basically I think over OP's remaining fertile years she is quite likely to fall pregnant and be in a position where she is forced to choose whether to have a termination she doesn't want or a baby her husband doesn't want.