To not want to clean for a male client?

[AsdaTesco]

Ok, hear me out first. I put an ad on gumtree, Nextdoor app and Facebook. People started to text me saying they were looking for a cleaner. Great, one person texted me from gumtree on my number. I didn't know if it was a man or woman at first, found out later he was a man. Saying he was looking for a cleaner etc, anyway I saw his picture on whatsapp and it put me off, not a bad picture but it made me feel uncomfortable. So I didn't respond to him anymore.

Anyway two lovely ladies contacted me on the nextdoor app, I'm due to see them next week. But it got me thinking, AIBU to feel uncomfortable cleaning for a male client? What are other cleaners view on this? And how do you deal with it? Not saying I'm refusing to clean for a male client, but what can I do to feel comfortable about it?

As a woman I feel so uncomfortable and vulnerable when men respond to my ad online saying they need a cleaner, to go into their homes and not know what they're capable of. At least with a woman I feel comfortable. Someone else texted me today, but I don't know if it's a man or woman, AIBU to ask? Would you be offended?

Looking forward to hearing from you guys.

It is entirely up to you who you work for. We shouldn't need to be having this debate. You can turn someone down because you don't like their shoes. Some of the comments on here are shocking.

Similarly someone could choose to deny providing a servic someone becuase they're black, or...they wear a hijab. Women in burkas and niqabs make me feel incredibly uncomfortable, and I wouldn't want a strange one in my home. Would I deny them a service becuse of this? Nope. That would be pretty unpleasant behaviour if I did

This has to be the most ill thought out analogy I've read in ages.

Common denominator:- We are WOMEN. Black, brown or white. Covered up - or not. & as such we are all likely to be wary of being alone with an unknown man in his home.

Given the levels of male violence and predatory behaviour out there, and the minimising of its dangers, it would be silly not to be wouldn't it?

How can anyone even think race and attire are major factors in this situation as opposed to being a womans' safety concern? It shows just how casually 'othering' is done, that's for sure.
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DistrespectfulAdultFemale Do you really believe that turning down cleaning someone's house because he's a man is the same as someone being turned down on the basis of their religion.

Doubt the law would see it that way.

Having said that, I doubt the OP would want to work for someone who was such an ignorant bigot that they were likely to turn her down for that reason.

As someone who was sexually assaulted when I was younger by the father of a boy I tutored at his house, I can't believe the naivety of some of the posters here.

Have you never experienced sexual harassment in a workplace?

If you were internet dating, would you not trust your gut? Would you blithely arrange a first date in a guy's house without thinking?

If a guy makes you feel uncomfortable, trust your instinct. It's not worth finding out the hard way if you were right.

You should do whatever you feel ok with. What about taking someone with you the first time? And making sure you tell someone where you are going (with name and address)? I think if you are working alone rather than via an agency there is absolutely no reason why you shouldn't take steps to make sure you are safe, and to assess any risk and put things in place (eg texting someone after you have arrived at new client to tell them all is ok).

It’s completely different from the hypothetical scenario of the OP being rejected by a client on the basis of her religion. There is no body of evidence to suggest that Muslim women or women in hijab are a threat to anyone- no more so than any other woman. So discriminating against her for reasons of safety would make no sense. The same cannot be said for women who do not want to be alone with male clients.

I have a funny feeling that certain responses are due to OP mentioning that she wears a headscarf...

Mangled grammar...hopefully the meaning was clear. It isn’t unreasonable for a woman to avoid being alone with strange males. It isn’t bigotry.

A post upthread from a cleaning company owner regarding the messages about naked cleaning etc...that’s all pretty common anecdotally.

A friend recently advertised her ironing services online and had more than one message from men asking about naked ironing.

I have a client I'm suppose to meet on Tuesday for a chat, and see the house. I have no idea if it's a man or woman. We've never spoken on the phone, only texted. He/she lives in the same area as me, and I'm just gonna let someone know where I am just for safety reasons. I was gonna ask if they were male or female, but was scared it would look odd or they would be offended. Just gonna see how this goes tbh.

Have they not given a name?

Op, I don't think it's discriminatory, I think you are absolutely right to prioritise your own personal safety. You can pick and choose your clients according to what you feel comfortable with.

I wouldn't go into ANY male stranger's home alone. I wouldn't accept a lift from anyone I didn't know. I wouldn't go home with someone of either gender that I've just met etc etc. Some things are just common sense in terms of basic personal safety.

I was wondering this about Estate Agents. All the ones I've viewed homes with so far have been female and I was wondering how things work for them in terms of keeping safe, meeting strangers in an empty house.

I'd also agree that some posters can't see past the fact that you wear a head covering. Luckily we aren't all like that. Sorry you've received some horrible responses.

AsdaTesco, why don't you call up and ask them for directions of how to get to their house? Just pretend you don't know the area very well. Then you will know the gender.

You could always say when someone texts and you aren't sure of the gender, "Is there a convenient time when I could ring you to discuss what you are looking for cleaning wise and find a mutually convenient time?"

The OP could add

No Blacks
No Irish
No Dogs
No Men

to her advert?

The replies blithely tossing out 'helpful' analogies about 'gay females', being Jewish, being black etc. etc. are really pretty tone-deaf to be honest.

x-post with Eliza

Have you thought of telling clients you wear a hijab, certainly not condoning racism or religionism but some people might object.
maybe tell them your religion and say you would prefer to clean for women only.

Eliza, do you know what safeguarding is?

In response to the idiotic analogy with the "no dogs, no Irish etc." posters in guest house windows back in the 1950s.

We know there is a market for "naked cleaning" - that there are pervy men out there who want "cleaning with extras."

We know (ONS statistics on prisons, published yearly) that 90% of violent offences and 98% of sexual offences are committed by men.

We also know (through surveys in which men volunteer information about their own behaviour) that there's more men than you might think who commit sexual offences (just that most of them never get caught) - see, for instance, the work of David Lisak www.middlebury.edu/media/view/240951/original.

It is perfectly sensible for OP to be cautious. That's not to say that some men won't be perfectly fine (my dad, who's getting on a bit, employs a cleaner, who happens to be female), but OP is allowed to set her own boundaries as to what she's comfortable with.

Glad to hear you've found one client you're comfortable with, OP.

Another cleaner/cleaning business owner here saying you are absolutely right to stick with your gut instinct. I'm very wary of working alone in male client's homes. We do some but like pp they are out/obviously gay/frail etc. Never had anything happen but have rejected clients many times.

I wouldn't say it's because they're male I'd just say the times they wanted we couldn't do. I also turn down female clients sometimes who seem like they could be a pain in the arse. In my experience you can in fact be very picky with cleaning clients I highly recommend flyering for getting new clients.

Fuck all the pp saying it's discrimination from the safety of their own homes.

How would you feel if someone decided not too serive you or to provide a service becasue your hijab or your skin colour or sex made them 'feel uncomfortable'?

Yes, that's exactly the same because muslim women in headscarves are a very scary demographic, responsible for the vast majority of violent crime .... oh wait

Have you thought of telling clients you wear a hijab

Why?

maybe tell them your religion

Again, why?

OP if you worried about asking their sex, can you simply ask for their name? Surely that would give you the info needed in most cases. And no you are not BU, don’t do anything you aren’t comfortable with. You are in your right to choose your clients since you are self-employed.

If you are not interested tell him no I’m sorry I found someone else to do it. Normally I recommend trusting your gut feeling but I have hired a male cleaner in the past and he’s pretty professional and trustworthy and efficient too.

@ShadyLady53 I couldn't lie and pretend I didn't know the directions to her/his house, because I know exactly where they live.

The poster who suggested I should tell my clients I'm a Muslim/wear headscarf. To be honest the two ladies who contacted me saw my add on nextdoor app, and because I have a common Muslim surname (think Muhammad) I'd expect they would know I'm a Muslim? They CONTACTED me, I never texted them, so I'm assuming they're ok with the fact that I'm a Muslim.

@MysteryNameChange Thanks! This is exactly why I wrote this post, to find hear from other cleaners who's been there done that.

I'm quite interested in the kind of person who thinks that it's relevant that a cleaner covers her hair. This is the flimsiest whataboutery I have ever seen, RomanyRoots. Have you never seen a stock picture of a woman cleaning?

Funny thing, but people don't like their hair swinging in their face, falling in the bucket of soapy water, etc.