To think I’ve accidentally brought from someone dodgy??

[sorryimgettingemotional]

I went to view some Pomeranian puppies a few week ago and put a deposit on the one I fell in love with. Everything seemed legit, the guy selling them answered all my questions and was happy to be paid by a bank transfer so nothing rang any bells.

Since then though I have found another ad for a completely different litter of Pomeranian puppjes, I’d found my puppy I wanted by then so usually wouldn’t have looked but something was telling me to open the ad but now I wish I hadn’t as i can’t stop thinking of the worse case scenario.

When I opened the ad the rug stood out me and I couldn’t work out why until I realised it’s the same rugs they had in the house when I viewed my puppies, the more I scrolled through I started to think it’s actually the same place! Then I done a little digging and found out the person who I went to see and the person posting the ad have the same surname! The puppies will also be ready to leave within only a few days if each other.

Now, there is a reason why it may just be a coincidence (??) When I say house, they actually lived in some fancy kind of mobile home in a place where there are hundreds of the same kind of mobile home so it’s entirely possible that the inside would have have the same sort of flooring and kitchen and as they’re related they also had the same rugs and dog bed.

I am just not sure though. Have i been completely oblivious and too trusting and brought from someone dodgy? :( How do I even go about finding out. I pick my pup up on Friday so I just do not know what to do now!!! 😫

I have 4 dogs all since 8 weeks old and a lot of people have mentioned rescue homes. I also have 4 children and won’t rescue as the knowledge of the dogs background is limited. There may be noises and actions that trigger a bad memory for the dog which could cause aggressive behaviour. Puppy farms also rent and furnish houses to sell their pups from and forge paperwork to make them look legit.

I just don’t see the average person as going to that degree to get a pup

They don't. That's the problem. Only decent people who want a well-bred dog and are prepared to research and wait are the ones who "go to that degree" to get a puppy.

Again, which is why there are so many dogs in rescue.

I don't think normal pet owners should be breeding their dogs! They have no idea what goes into breeding properly and that's why we end up with loads of dogs in rescue, and the rise of so-called "designer dogs" - because anyone can go out and breed two random dogs and call the resulting offspring a "cockapoo" or whatever and sell it for thousands of pounds. Nothing to do with animal welfare or improving the breed and all about making a quick buck out of the family pet.

Why would you want to breed your pet? It's dangerous for the bitch and they don't get anything out of it - they don't feel broody or crave having a family, that's us putting our own feelings onto the dogs. I would bet most people who breed "for fun" don't have the right knowledge or experience behind them to do it properly. And none of the parents will be properly health tested either.

Why don’t you get your DH to contact via the other ad and see if it’s the same people? Put your mind to rest and see whether you can still get your pooch.

yes isnt it fun o hate br4eeders sorry if that offends anyone but i do

its purly for their own benefit not the dogs-yes lets get you pregnant its good for you

bollocks

*i hate

People who breed a litter of puppies ‘just for fun’ - where are those dogs now? Will you take them back at any stage if they have problems? Are they in puppy farms? Are they in rescue?
Bringing new dogs into the world is a massive responsibility.

I’m so sorry OP that this may have happened to you. As for all the other posters slaying you about buying off a puppy farm it’s actually HARD to tell. I’m sorry but when buying off a rouge breeder they will do EVERYTHING possible for you not to notice. I’m saying this from experience. I helped out a lady who was mass breeding Bengal kittens. I mean these cats half were feral, most had cat flu or other problems. One day when I was there aovely family came over to see a kitten. Before arriving she chose a suitable litter (no illness), grabbed the mum and dad, cleaned the place and hid all other cats. From the outside this would have looked like a batty old lady just selling her kittens. These cats went for £500 each. She hid her trade so well, she had a champion cat, who she bred from for £2k. RSPCA just couldn’t touch her as she hid cats or outsourced them on inspection days. It took me going in and taking photos undercover for a month. A 3 hour statement with the RSPCA. Then one day they turned up in announced and took all 72 CATS (I knew at one point there was well into the 90’s). It took them a whole day to remove these cats. She only got a years released bail and no ownership of cats for 5 years.
So all I’m sayi is you don’t know EVER who you are buying off even those registered and high up in the animal world can be fake. X

An ordinary pet owner shouldn’t be breeding from their pet. It requires too much expertise and commitment.
And it’s not easy to avoid being duped. But you can. I knew my breeder from before she had puppies. I went through the breed club. I visited her home. I was home checked. I signed a contract and saw evidence of the relevant tests. (NOT a health check but things like heart testing for parents and liver shunt for pups.) I spent ages researching about the breed so I knew these tests should’ve been done.
Most people CBA. They want a cute puppy and they want it when it suits them. They’re not prepared to wait. It HAS to be at the start of the summer holidays (for example).
It’s the dogs that suffer.

Wolfie - I wish everyone cared more. Even the justification of it on this one tiny thread on Mumsnet makes me feel sick.

@Sadbri surely the clue for OP was that she found the puppies through an ad online?

That's the biggest giveaway that the situation is dodgy. Decent breedere don't advertise their puppies on Facebook/Gumtree/Pets4Homes. If anyone is doing that, then at best they're a backyard breeder who just wants to make money from the family pet, or at worst it's a front for a puppy farm.

PLEASE STOP BUYING PUPPIES AND OTHER ANIMALS ON THE INTERNET.

And today I met someone who was going to breed a litter to “balance out” the dog’s hormones.
Bring back a dog licence. Make it like a driving licence. You don’t just get it. You have to earn it.

Report the breeder to your local Trading Standard they along with animal control licence dog breeders and kennels. If the breeder is not in you Trading standards are they will pass you complaint to the Office closes to the breeder, they may already be aware of these persons and the more information they can get the easier it is for them to act. If you do decide to collect your puppy, she should be micro chipped - take her to your vet before you take her to your home just in case there is a problem and it can be sorted out quickly.

@adaline not always the case. Rogue breeders can even come from registered places. My point was that no matter where you buy from you can get breeders who are in it for the money only and have no regards for the animals.

No of course not always - but no decent breeder will advertise their puppies on gumtree!

I am a pet owner who breed my dog, and I would like to point out she was tested more than some breeders did. As well as relevant health tests she was breed surveyed too. I listed mine on pets at home was only 1 litter I planned so no point setting up website etc. All puppies sold where KC Reg , microchipped etc even 1st vaccinations which I actually have mixed feelings about now as most of the puppies I sold had to be vaccinated twice by their owners VETs as they said the first did not count as they used a different make etc. Hence why some breeders do not get the 1st vac done. My dog came with no vaccinations.
Just because a dog comes with endorsements for breeding does not stop people doing it, it just means you can not register the puppies. From the litter my dog had 1 has qualified twice for crufts is a blood doner and training to be a pat dog, 1 is training to be a therapy dog for a wee girl. 1 is being trained by the police and a couple of others are very happy just being pets. I had no waiting list as was a one off had people come to me afterwards wanting to be put on one but told them once was all I would ever put my dog through.
The price seems high but if you compare £4,100 for them 3 pups to £10,000 plus for large breed dogs who have 8 to 10 pups. Some main breeders would not even return deposits also they breed their dogs 3/4 times. I agree you really need to do your homework as mum is KC go on kennel club look up her health history hip score etc will be on there. Google the phone number if puppy farm you might see other breeds being sold connected to the number.

Lynz - why did you breed a litter?

If a puppy buyer breaks the terms of the endorsements, the breeder can take them to court, so although not enforceable in that way, they can end up in court, which is enough to put most people off. It's a piece of paper, there's no excuse for not endorsing.

If you were well known in the breed, you wouldn't have had to advertise. People would have known about you and your puppies. What are your show results like? How do you know your bitch and the stud were exemplary examples of the breed?

I'm actually sick of this.
Just stop breeding your pets, and stop saying you're not doing it for money. The puppy trade is all about money. I know many, many people who have bred their pets and are delighted with the cash it brings in.

Why was this so called breeder living in a caravan? With the money from a couple of litters they'd be well on their way to a nice house deposit. SCAM SCAM SCAM. Why was the dad not KC registered? He was probably a pup from a previous litter.

Decent breeders will not sell you a pup that has no microchip, no vaccinations ( or at least had a discussion about it). They will not sell you a pup that is 6 weeks old, has guardia, has worms, is crawling with fleas, has kennel cough, parvo or hepatitis. They will not tell you that the (non existent) KC paperwork will be sent on. These are all genuine situations I have been told of in the last few weeks and the morons buyers still believe they bought from a naice breeder.

I think rescues need to stop only allowing basically retired people or those who work from home to adopt. The overly strict criteria mean that people are going to less suitable routes to adopt eg Romanian rescues.

A friend has been stung big time by one of these recently. The contract states no known medical issues. The dog is on three legs when at a run. The vet says the operation to fix the issue ( multiple x rays taken at over £300) will be about £3500. The rescue is pleading poverty, despite charging over £300 for ‘releasing’ the dog.

And yes, your average pet owner should definitely not be breeding their pet. No bitch needs to have a litter, that’s a total fallacy. This bollocks about letting your dog experience having a litter really fucking pisses me off. Such shite. Dogs may change temperament once used as a stud. And unless an owner then donates the resultant puppies, of course they’re doing it for money.

@adaline and @Wolfiefan I get your passion about this topic, but people calling for dog licenses, prison sentences for puppy farmers etc, who's paying for that?

Where is the resource coming from?

Rescues will very rarely rehome to;

• families with young children
• people who work
• people who have cats or other dogs

I wouldn't want a rescue unless it was a tiny pup, as I'd want to know the behavioural history of any adolescent or adult dog. But every litter I see on adoption websites is reserved as soon as it's live. Not everyone has time to bloody volunteer to get in line to be first for a pup.

The mid-line between £2,000 KC reg bloodline champions and puppy farmers, is family, one-off breeders. Without these people, KC reg gene pools would be so restricted breeds would have higher health concerns than they already do- look at King Charles spaniels, a stunning and lovely tempered dog, ruined by a miniscule gene pool. Would you really have that again?

The mid-line between £2,000 KC reg bloodline champions and puppy farmers, is family, one-off breeders

Actually, it's not. You'll more often than not find that the decent breeders are way cheaper than "one-off" breeders. In one of my breeds, they can be found on Gumtree for £1200+, yet the very reputable breeders I know charge £750 for a dog with fully health tested parents, KC reg and endorsements plus the usual flea, wormer etc.

People who breed from their pets are the ones charging extortionate prices as they copy the prices on Pets4Homes etc. They know they can get that money from stupid gullible people so they do.

Plus, they cross dogs and charge more for them. They're mongrels. Ridiculous.

Your comment about gene pools is off too. Decent breeders are constantly trying to improve the health problems and lines of their chosen breed, because they care passionately about their breed. For a lot of them, it's their life's work. It's the puppy farmers and "one off" breeders breeding their crappy dogs that cause the problems. Reputable breeders try to breed the problems out. They also spend the time researching genetics, importing excellent examples of the breed to use to eliminate certain issues and widen gene pools. One off breeders and puppy farmers don't do any of this. They just want a quick buck.

Surely all this isn't rocket science?

I have a KC reg wolfhound from a reputable breeder. She didn’t cost anything like £2000.
But I went to the breed club/society. Made contacts. Asked around. Did my research. I avoided a pup with dubious parentage, health or background. I know where her parents are and what sort of life they live.
Family one off breeders? People who want to make money from their pets and don’t have the necessary expertise.
People who are serious about breeding will import dogs etc.

Many rescues won't rehome to people who work full time or have young children. Why? Because they are sick and tired of picking up the pieces - endless six month old puppies who have been left alone from eight weeks and now have food issues and are not socialised, older dogs who have been left for 10-12 hour stretches every day and now have separation anxiety, puppies that have been bought a present for a child who lost interest afterI a few days and was chucked outside. I see this day in, day out.

And that is understandable but does mean that when people urge you to ‘adopt not shop’ most people aged between 20 to 65 cannot.

The other thing to consider is that life can change in the blink of an eye. People without children can have them; people who are not working may find finances force them back to work.

Loving, responsible people consider their dog part of the family and act accordingly.