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AIBU?

To think conspiracy theorists are an infuriating mix of arrogance, stupidity and lazy thinking

401 replies

EmperorTomatoRetchup · 29/09/2018 21:37

Having thought I'll leave it, I'll leave it, I found myself arguing with a conspiracy theorist.

Christ alight these people are utterly lacking in any sort of critical thought. This tool was trotting out one of the most popular of the conspiracy theories - 911 as an inside job, Madelline McCann was murdered by her parents, moon landings were faked, Diana was bumped off by Mi5 etc. and they seemed to be impervious to any of the logical flaws in their argument, that researching a matter didn't mean watching YouTube videos made by fellow conspiricists spouting unsourced, unreferenced nonsense and claiming that non adherents were 'sheeple' buying 'the official line'.

To take the example jokingly referenced on another thread, the Paul McCartney is dead conspiracy theory, how many people coroners, doctors ambulance staff, Paul's family and friends, would have had to be bought off in order to allow him to be replaced by a lookalike who could be trained to speak, act, play musical instruments left handed and pass for one of the world's most famous men in the full glare of the media . In 50 years not a single person involved in this dastardly plan, not a single one of this vast army of people cooped into it has blown the whistle despite their being unparalleled financial rewards for doing so.

No musicologists have detected a change in composition or playing or singing style. No one asking what happened to the bloke who became fake Paul', might their family not be curious as to why their son/brother disappeared off the face of the earth in the late 60s.After going to such extraordinary lengths the Beatles so desperate to cover up this audacious act, left a series of clues in their songs as a signal to their fans.

AIBU to think that this combination of scepticism, lack of critical thought, logic, probability twinned with overwhelming arrogance is infuriating and wonder how I should deal with these fuckers in future? Especially when any attempts to point out the flaws in their arguments are taken as signs you are one of the sheeple or a Co conspirator.

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glintandglide · 29/09/2018 21:39

To be fair, you’re taking about a lot of very poorly people too

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ColdNeverBotheredMeAnyway · 29/09/2018 21:44

I'm fascinated by a good conspiracy theory... but I favour the Occam's Razor approach to most of them - the simpler explanation is probably true.

Paul McCartney... why would they bother?

The others you mention... well there are motives for conspiracies in all of them, so I do wonder sometimes... and I suspect there's a lot we don't know about but hmmm.

As for your question on how you deal with people who peddle this shite in the future... you don't. Just smile and nod....

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EmperorTomatoRetchup · 29/09/2018 21:44

Yes fair point, of course I don't include people who are ill in this.

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KlutzyDraconequus · 29/09/2018 21:44

Try the FlatEarth people.

So much evidence to say we love in a globe, tmyet still they deny it.

But it pointless arguing with them.
You can't argue with stupid.

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EmperorTomatoRetchup · 29/09/2018 21:46

You can't argue with stupid.

But it isn't just stupid or ignorant, but in the case of conspiracy theorists actively setting yourself up against the evidence.

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ChocolateOrIDie · 29/09/2018 21:48

You don't have to argue with them. If you don't agree with someone's opinion then politely walk away - it's not hard is it.

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MaisyPops · 29/09/2018 21:49

On some of the things you mention (one of them being a MN banned topic) I don't think it's wrong that people ask questions or explore alternatives to the simple repeated narrative. (For example, it wouldnt be unreasonable to ask questions about the communication between security services and who knew what pre 9/11. It's not unreasonable for people to hold a view that someone's social background might affect how their actions are viewed etc).

The move from reasonable cricitcality/healthy scepticism to conspiracy is a complex one. I do think people who are drawn to conspiracies though seem to have this view that somehow they have insider knowledge that a whole host of global experts couldn't possibly have. It's all a bit God complex-y to me.

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HollowTalk · 29/09/2018 21:50

I remember someone at work saying they thought MM was killed by her parents. I said, "I wouldn't know where to bury a child in my own home area, in a place that nobody would ever find, without transport and help, and when I was devastated by loss. How do you think they did that?" She said, "How should I fucking know? It's the truth, though. You can tell by looking at them."

Hmm

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MaisyPops · 29/09/2018 21:58

HollowTalk
Not to be a thread police, but MN seems to have form for deleting almost anything regarding that case. It seems to have a particularly good set of legal eagles to shut down discussions or references to anything that isn't gushing support.

Only saying this in case others turn up discussing MM and an otherwise interesting thread about conspiracies ends up going poof.

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ToPlanZ · 29/09/2018 21:58

It's ironic that the people who buy into these theories are the 'sheeple' who actually can't think critically enough to realise they're being had.

"Never argue with stupid people, they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience"

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foggydown · 29/09/2018 21:59

I like to keep an open mind to these things.
Many are ridiculous but I believe some may have an element of truth to them.
Looking through the history of conspiracy theories shows most won't be true but there has been some horrid and scary ones that have been found to be true. Such as MK-ULTRA and in 1960's the Canadian Government developed a 'gaydar' machine to use on its militarily and civil service.
But most are made up crap.

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abbsisspartacus · 29/09/2018 21:59

9/11 there were threats/internet chatter etc but nobody thought it was a credible threat

MM well I can't comment so much doesn't add up but if there was someone looking at my life they would be confused too.

Moon landings how the hell is the flag and footprint on the moon visible from earth if no one has been up there?

Flat earthers are mental have you seen American preppers? One woman said she couldn't travel with her cats so she was going to shoot them and get more later fucking nutters

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Notquiteagandt · 29/09/2018 22:05

I respect anyone who has an opinion and think its good to be open to ideas and not take everything we are told at face value and believe it. How ever its important to be open to others opinions etc

Where as most conspiricy theory'ists (is that even a word?) Seem so closed mind and stubborn that their idea is the one and only. Where in reality small elements of each theory may in fact bare some weight.

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YouWereRight · 29/09/2018 22:15

I like some conspiracy theories, from a 'how did you get to that conclusion', rather than a 'this is deal's stand point. I'm fascinated by the tiny specs people can pick out. And when things are done to obviously get people talking, like Denver international airport.

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GunpowderGelatine · 29/09/2018 22:24

I'm rather fascinated by conspiracy theories, although I think things like believing MM was killed by her parents is just a belief rather than a conspiracy theory.

The only one I truly believe is that Dr David Kelly did not commit suicide.

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madeoficecream · 29/09/2018 22:27

I think some people have had difficult lives and find it difficult to trust other people.... I think some of those people can be fine if they actually know someone or have face to face contact with someone... but then they get suspicious about nameless faceless corporations/governments/the illuminati!!! Its not a rational thing that can be argued against in my experience... its a deep mistrust of the universe in general.

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MaisyPops · 29/09/2018 22:30

GunpowderGelatine
I must admit I've toyed with that idea about David Kelly. It all seems a bit... neat.

I wouldn't say I'm a conspiracy theorist on it but I wouldn't be surprised if in 50 years (or however long is left until some of the evidence becomes declassified) if evidence suggest it wasn't a simple suicide.

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GunpowderGelatine · 29/09/2018 22:33

I agree Maisy it's so terribly sad but, given what we know about Iraq now and the lack of WMDs, I'd be amazed if it were true

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RedneckStumpy · 29/09/2018 22:39

Some are plausible, some are not.

I think the inner workings of governments are much darker than we are lead to believe.

One I believe is that Dr David Kelly was killed by MI5.

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trumptrump · 29/09/2018 22:41

Jimmy Seville was a conspiracy theory that was laughed at... the only forum that hosted discussion on him was the David Icke forums.

It's funny how things turn out...

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blackvelvetband · 29/09/2018 22:45

I love a good conspiracy theory.
Take them with a pinch of salt too though, but some of the stuff they uncover should blow your mind.
Check out 'those conspiracy guys' via the podcast app. I love listening to them!

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blackvelvetband · 29/09/2018 22:46

Dr David Kelly absolutely did not Conor suicide. I'd bet my house on it

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blackvelvetband · 29/09/2018 22:46

Also.., osama bin laden.... burned at sea. Yeah of course he was 🙄

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blackvelvetband · 29/09/2018 22:46

Commit suicide not Conor obvs

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MarcieBluebell · 29/09/2018 22:51

I don't think the conspiracies you've mentioned are that bizarre.

I definitely think there is information that is kept from us. Not everything is simple. I don't think all conspiracies necessarily lack all critical thinking.

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