9 months on I am grieving for the loss of my son - he has gone NC on us

[birdladyfromhomealone]

I will try not to drip feed, but I am devastated that our son has chosen to cut us out of his life.
Every night I go to sleep thinking about him and wake up in the morning with a pit in my stomach.
I have spoken to him several times since Feb on his terms, when he will allow me to but he refuses to meet us, as he says it will just be another arguement.
Our DS met his DW at uni 11 years ago, she is from a different culture but born here.
For 5 years she kept our DS secret from her family, she had to go home EVERY weekend. Even though she was living with our DS, having a relationship with us, lived with us whilst they flat hunted, holiday's, meals out, staying over etc
She was treated very well by us and was one of the family. Me and my 2 DD and her used to go for spa days, nights out etc .
We all got on.
Then my DS proposed with my DM engagement ring .
A huge diamond with rubies,
We arranged to have it made into a solitare and the rubies into earrings.
This was a huge thing for me to pass on my DM ring, I wanted my DS to give it to her as we loved her.
After they got engaged she told her family and my DS was welcomed into their family ( she said it would destroy her family for her to be with a white man)
Her parents arranged 2 weddings one for their religion and one civil white wedding.
We felt like guests at our sons wedding.
We were told what to wear and how and when to behave.
The next day 40 of the brides family turned up at ours for lunch. We invited her immediate family only.
I told my son off and he got very emotional. I admit I was cross
After that things were never the same.
A year after they got married he gave up a city job in London to work for her father, moved 300miles and moved in with them.
He told us 3 weeks before he moved although they had been planning it for months.
They then bought a house just down the road so she still sees her family daily.
I bought them a surprise of some furniture for their new home, she refused to let the delivery driver take it off the van.
We then had a huge row as she said I disrespected her.
We have not seen them since.
My DH told our DS it had made us ill.
My DH has gone on antidepressants and I have been diagnosed with stomach ulcers.
Our DS reacted very badly to be told this and said he does not have a DF anymore.
Our 2 DD are stuck in the middle as they still see their DB and DSIL (once or twice since) but cant try to resolve this for our family as DS goes off on one if our names are mentioned.
For the last 11 yrs we have been a very close family, holidays, nights out, weekend breaks.
We are devastated by this but there is no talking to our DS he hangs up on us or ignores messages.

Amara - it cuts both ways. If you are accepting someone's hospitality and living in a country where dogs are family pets you ought to respect that - whatever your culture or personal beliefs. Nothing wrong with asking politely and in a respectful manner if the dog could be placed elsewhere.

The treatment of the dog (with whom the DiL would have appeared to live for some time without uttering a word, let alone warning OP in advance of her family's attitude) is just one element of this. How about turning up with more than three times the number of guests expected and catered for? How about demanding alcohol?

Given the outrage on MN over some minor infringements of etiquette, it's pretty rich that people are actually defending this on cultural grounds.

The fact that 40 turned up, the majority of who hadn’t been invited would unsettle most hosts and showed rudeness from the start. The dog could easily have been put in a bedroom without drama instead of the rudeness and bad manners shown to the host. Bearing in mind the dils family were horrified that their daughter was marrying a “white man” i think we can tell by that that they weren’t visiting in a good frame of mind, and the uninvited guests came along to intimidate and show their disapproval.

I guess when facing into hosting an intercultural event I would do my best to inform myself. I would also put my son's happiness first and for his sake put on as good a show as possible. And if people were rude I would ignore as much as possible, understanding it is a once off event with great significance for the joining of two families. A dog or a misunderstanding about guest numbers wouldn't be enough for me to jeopardize my family relationships. There is also an assumption here that the guests knew of the cultural norms, but they may not have and not everyone has a dog in the UK.

Despite all the misunderstandings I think the real problem was the mother's reaction to it and her embarrassing her son.

Her family sound vile from the way they behaved at your house

being of a different culture doesn’t give you the right to be rude

And how exactly is that going to help the OP?

She asked for help. It sounds as if she is more than capable of pointing out the failings of others and has already done this extensively.

The Op was in her own home, good manners shouldn’t depend on what culture you are from.

In some cultures (and ideally our own!) the host does whatever is necessary to make guests comfortable. Hospitality is the opening of your home and the bending of your culture to suit the needs and comfort of your guests. If you have bad guests, you hold your tongue and don't invite them back. Your own manners are nothing to do with their bad behaviour. We've lost sight of what good manners are meant to achieve in this country.

On the weekend of their own daughter's wedding when they were probably hosting family from their country of origin, I really do not think the DIL's parents should have been expected to think 'Oh, we are in England. We have to be English'. Even if they should have done so, they did not do so and the OP is not going to be served by sitting on her bottom licking her wounds.

The OP still hasn't said

• Why she expected not to feel like a guest at her son's wedding when she clearly expected her daughter's PILs to be treated as guests at their son's wedding.
• Why she felt she had the right to be 'upset' (aka fly off the handle) when her son moved next door to his PILs.
• Why she thought it would be helpful to present her DD with a large item of garden furniture in the middle of our coldest winter in years.
• How she expected her clearly conflict-averse son to tell his new family that they were not welcome in his family home on the day after the wedding.
• Why she chose not to apologise for anything until it was too late.
• What she plans to do about her anger issues.
• Why she has not tried to help herself by reading a book about the culture her son has married into - she could have avoided a lot of these problems by doing so.

Why the hell should the op think her dog is considered dirty anyway.

I didn’t say she should. I was turning someone’s frame of reference around and saying maybe this is another person’s frame of reference. And no, to you or I, my comment is obviously very different. But I’m saying for them it may be the same. You agreed with my next point. Different cultural references.... One cultural reference for some of ops guests (vile as it may be) is that dogs can be kicked - as they are considered dirty.

I totally agree that the people, who came sound dominating and intimidating. I’m saying that strange as it may sound they possibly saw op in a bad light too. Ie didn’t welcome the whole brood with open arms, let a dog run loose, expected to tell them when they could and couldn’t eat something - the cakes. Etc.

I’m not saying I’m right or wrong. They could be the most bigoted bunch of arseholes to hit the planet. I’m giving an interpretation of a possible culture clash, where 40 people had expectations, which were completely different from their hosts.

It wouldn’t surprise me from what I have read if these people act like this amongst themselves, not just with op and her dh. Cultural norms and all that.

being of a different culture doesn’t give you the right to be rude

And how exactly is that going to help the OP?

Isn’t this how threads always work, read back through, you could say the same about most of the others, someone comes along and criticises or doesn’t agree with what a poster said, so they then have to answer that person. The reason i said that was obviously in answer to a poster that had responded to something i’d said, so that wasn’t helping the op either was it, about how it wasn’t help helping the op? Have you mentioned it to them? But apart from that, of course it will help the Op. It reassures her that she hadn’t really done much wrong, it was the guests that were rude. Why would it make her feel better to say she was in the wrong whenever she clearly wasn’t, concerning the visit.

I think the way to approach the 40 people issue with DS would be to say something like, "I'm sorry, having a larger number of people show up made me panic, especially when they behaved so rudely but it was wrong of me to take it out on you"

Too late, OP's son isn't talking to her. What she's looking for is some help in dealing with the situation she's in now. All the rest is water under the bridge.

I'd love to hear your DS's version of events.

Okay I've read all the updates and while I think there were some missteps on your part the major issue sounds like your DIL's family and her.

If the DIL was a SIL instead I think people would be calling a spade a spade rather than excusing abusive behaviour as "cultural differences".

You see this with men more, they are lovely and friendly with the family and fiance until they get married then bam, his true nature of controlling abusive behaviour rears its head.

Sadly I don't think your DIL ever really cared for you and your family, you were just a means to an end, the long con. Once she got your son where she wanted him "trapped" then she showed her true colours.

It is rude to show up uninvited and if her family thought 12 invites wasn't enough they should have said so in advance.

I think her family was only willing to accept him on their terms, hence the move, the isolation from his own family, him giving up a good job (under pressure I'm sure).

The furniture thing is ridiculous, she pointed out that she loved x item, you bought the exact item as a gift then she throws a fit. It sounds like a set-up, she's known you long enough to know you'd likely buy it as a gift for them then used it against you, to turn your son against you.

I actually don't think the advice about adjusting your wills accordingly is bad, why give her and her family a chance to benefit from your passing via your son they turned against you.

also, they've been married over 3 years, do you mention to him a lot about her family all turning up on their wedding day? That would be one hell of an annoyance

OP, this sounds like a rubbish situation and I’m sorry for the heartache it is causing you.

It is clearly an emotive subject as can be seen by the range of answers you are receiving. Honestly it is hard for us internet strangers to give objective advice because we don’t know all the facts, and because there are honestly some horrendous and controlling MILs out there, as well as some cruel and controlling DILs...I think many will interpret your story according to their own experience and respond to you accordingly.

I do think the advice from a wise pp to think about whether you would rather be right than happy is apt.... imo it is worth swallowing down resentment for past perceived wrongs if possible to maintain the relationship, but easier said than done and not all wrongs can be overlooked in this way.

However from your updates it sounds like you have done this, and on this board you have been upfront in admitting you made
mistakes. I also understand that you have admitted as much and apologised to you son and his wife, right?

If that’s the case then if it were me I would write one final letter apologising again, regretting the hurt and distance caused, asking for reconciliation and leaving the door wide open.

After that I think you need to step away I’m afraid and wait/hope that he reaches out to you. Additional pressure from you is not going to help. Focus on the rest of your family and your health, don’t let fretting about it ruin the rest of your life. Hopefully he will come around. I hope he does. Good luck.

Could someone point out what exactly the DIL has done to be abusive?

The OP cannot find anything bad to say about her DIL's treatment of her son. There is no mention of aggressive, controlling behaviour from the DIL. The ranting and raging is all from the OP. In fact, the OP has ranted and raved more because the DIL was 'too nice' .

It is very odd that for 5yrs she went to her parents every weekend.

That perhaps was an indication of her relationship with them & that she would end up living close by.

Could someone point out what exactly the DIL has done to be abusive?

My thoughts exactly. The responses on this thread have become very much MIL vs DIL (and her family) whereas the person who decided to go NC was DS. Is he not capable of independent thought?

The ranting and raging is all from the OP. In fact, the OP has ranted and raved more because the DIL was 'too nice' confused.

Exactly where have I done the above???

I told my side of the story, I didnt rant or rave, I have never slagged off my DIL either

We had two main arguements but were also upset our son gave up a promising career after many years at uni to become his DFIL skivvy running him around collecting rent from HMO's. In fact we never even mentioned this upset to our son just the fact he was moving so far away and we wouldnt be able to see him as often as we did when he lived close by. Our DIL used to cook for us once a week.

All his friends from school , uni and his 2 DS's say he has alienated himself from them.
Its very odd he should do this to a once very close family.

I won't be commenting again but thank you to those that gave constructive advice, I sent him a heartfelt and sincere letter weeks ago and no response. So I will send him a 30th Birthday card and hope he contacts us again one day.

You have talked about multiple times when you were 'very cross' - something that sounds very like ranting and raving to me. I didn't say you've done it on the thread. You were never able to say that your DIL was rude to you - in fact, you've said she was too polite (smarmy). Unless she rolls over, she can't win can't she?

You've posted often on other threads complaining that your son doesn't 'understand why' you'd be upset about him moving 300 miles away to live next to his in laws. To which I would say, why not? Why on earth not? And don't pretend there aren't massive sacrifices to personal life for a well-paid job in the city. You know there are. You post prolifically about getting rich and staying rich - but what happens if your son has a different, more family orientated value system? You'll make sure he knows you've let him down, that's what. Which is the perfect recipe for driving your child away.

I very much doubt you have got unbiased information from a cross section of his uni friends. It is very normal not to see uni friends as often by the time you reach 30. And unfortunately, every time you lost your temper with him and forced him to pick a side, you drove a wedge between him and his sisters too.

I hope you'll get counselling. You need it.

I agree with mypoint to a certain extent. Your posts across MN are laced with anger - not only towards your DS/DIL but a lot of people, including other family members, many times over the very lightest of perceived slights. Control (or perceived loss of it) seems to be a common theme.
Please get some therapy to help address these issues. Your DIL may we’ll be difficult, her family may have very different expectations and customs to you, but don’t cut off your nose to spite your face.
Stop trying to control other people (you are, even if you’re not aware of it) and turn that inwards to moderate your (over)reactions to things. If you can become less reactive, calmer, and happier, maybe you can find a way forward with your son. But until you do that, I can’t see things changing I’m afraid.
Please get some therapy to address these issues in yourself - you cannot ‘fix’ things with your DS until you really look into why these things happen to you.

My friend/work colleague has problems with all her children. She is very controlling, minimises their feelings of hurt and upset in response to how she behaves and doesn't treat them like the independent adults they are. She dismisses it when they try to tell her.

She is driving them away but refuses to acknowledge her role in the estrangements. They have their own friends, partners, jobs, homes and children. She is not the matriarch that rules over them and she needs to realise that. They've grown up and left home.

They have been trying to set boundaries and she seems to purposely breach them. 'They can't tell her what to do', she says - all they are asking is that she visits them at their house at times suitable to them, before the children need to go to bed!

I find that when I delve more into her children's nastiness that there is always an underlying cause which I try to spell out to her. One daughter rejected the nursery equipment she'd got for them - but she didn't buy it for them - she bought it for herself. They'd got a scheme chosen that she was unhappy about. She showed them the pieces she liked. They were polite but non-committed (I read the whole text message exchange). She then went and bought them in the colour she liked. They made her cancel the order and she lost the deposit. She talks about how she was doing them a favour but they never wanted it.

I struggle to remain friends with her at times as she belittles their opinions and won't back down. They no longer want her to do any child care as she won't follow their rules with feeding or sleep. She is so jealous of their in-laws but they seem really laid back and just easy to get along with. They are stress-free.

When I read your first post, I really thought that you had brought this on yourself. However, having read more, I feel very differently.

Your DIL sounds like a right bitch. Her family also sound rude, with no manners, but you were expected to just lie back and accept it due to 'cultural differences' - sod that.

Your son is clearly being manipulated and controlled by her and the wider family but if he wants to be so weak and spineless then so be it.

I do not think you sound like a nightmare at all and it was predictable that you would get a hard time on this thread. It sounds like you have been generous, welcoming and kind and they have thrown it back in your face.

Your son is a disgrace IMO.

MyShinyWhiteTeeth
My mother is the same. Has an air of superiority regarding herself the matriarch and all knowing. She cannot stand that I may perhaps know more about her on certain things. She was very dismissive of my moving away to be with my dh as she would never have done this to her mother as she loved her too much. The fact the world has moved on and people have to go where the work is escapes her.

I should have added I don’t think op is anywhere like this. (Mind you my mother has got worse with age). Op is more like a kid in a sweetie shop, who has decided she wants rescue people, who don’t want or need rescuing and to do stuff and be the person for her son and dil on her terms, not theirs. To separate adults this comes over as controlling.

The dils family sound vile. But this was certainly exacerbated by ops reaction. And telling her she’s 100% right and they’re 100% wrong will not help her.