To think that I should be told if my daughters girl guiding leader is actually a man.

[Angryresister]

Apparently it is policy now to not give parents information about male people who self identify as women ,as leaders, or the information that a boy will now be part of the group. This goes against all safeguarding procedures and there will be a major scandal when dangerous preditors take advantage of this policy to get to access girls . The organisation is also sacking volunteers who raise questions. There seem to be fewer and fewer girl only activities available these days

Girls and boys can share tents in Scouts.

Really? I was unaware of that - it's certainly not the case in DofE & Cadets.

I wouldn't be happy with that either as a parent or a leader personally.

The info on scout sleeping arrangements is quite far down this link. I think it's nuts personally but at least parents are informed I guess. Unlike GG parents who think they are sending their girls on single sex trips.

members.scouts.org.uk/nightsawayfaqs

@sanluca Room sharing has ALWAYS been GG policy and it has been safe because GG has been single sex.
It's been necessary because GG is a low budget organisation that is, in some low income areas, the only affordable extracurricular activity.
So if it's a choice between a sleepover in a church hall, or no sleepover, we have them in a hall with everyone together.
Several people have been saying "oh I never knew this, oh that's shocking" but it HAS been policy.
If it's not a policy you like, then really you should have removed your girls from the start.

The Nights Away Permit holder has the ultimate responsibility for the event so it will be their decision. However, this decision must take into consideration the views of the young people and the views of the parents, and give the parents the opportunity to voice any concerns they may have.

That's essentially allowing the local leaders to make the decision. I'd be interested to see how many actually allow it though - and then how many get the permission from all the parents involved.

I personally wouldn't allow mixed sex accommodation (tents) on any of our expeds. It's a very small space and people are literally on top of each other when changing etc. It's awkward enough for the same sex half of the time....

we have them in a hall with everyone together.

That's a totally different scenario to going away in tents though - on a camp there are between 1-6 people in a tent, you can't see what goes on & they're literally on top of each other. The staff have their own tents & are not in view of the participants and vice versa.

And I don't get why transgenders insist on barging into female-only spaces, where they know they will cause distress, and the whinge about 'bigotry'.

Shhhh Lily Madigan will hear you and try to join the guides.

But I think tat is exactly the point, it gives them power and attention.

A recent cub camp that my DS went on was mixed sex sleeping. It was clearly stated in the letter asking us for permission, and I double checked with the only girl (who is a friend of my ds) and she was ok with it, as were her parents ( who know all the children who are all under 10). I also asked her afterwards how it went and she had been given the choice at any time of sleeping in a separate tent.
So in that case I suppose it was ok. I wouldn’t be comfortable with it over 11 though.

Guides is aged 10-14 so completely inappropriate for a 10-year-old girl to be sharing with a 14-year-old boy (who says he’s a girl), without parents’ knowledge or consent.
Girlguiding executive leadership need to get back into the real world.

Shhhh Lily Madigan will hear you and try to join the guides.

Of fuck, don’t give Madigan ideas! I wonder how the volunteering at the women’s shelter is going? 😆

Girlguiding executive leadership need to get back into the real world.
I wonder if the organization received some sort of financial incentive for this madness

I'm about to be blocked on twitter because asking someone why they want to join girl guides is 'transphobic' and the same as shouting 'penis' at people.

I thought it was quite a reasonable queston.

one day there will be a terrible crime and then 'lessons have been learned ' Remember the rapist id,ing as a female , getting to a female prison and then assaulting and raping females. Who would have thought it

'lessons have been learned

given current climate I seriously doubt it. It will be said "that wasn't real trans" or "girls should get over it for the sake of diversity"

Drspouse, I think you misunderstood me and I probably misunderstood you. In hindsight I think that you were pointing out that GG policy is that sleeping arrangements can be shared. I thought you were saying if people minded sharing with the opposite sex, they should stay home.
So we agree: sharing is fine when it is single sex, not fine when it is mixed and certainly not when it is older male, no matter how anyone 'identifies'.

Yep, we agree. But many people on this thread are saying "but nobody shares with leaders anyway" and refusing to believe me when I point out policy. So forgive me for lumping you with that group!

The point of secrecy is deliberate. They know very well there will be objections. Its a point that you don't get to raise objections.

I've always taught DS that the only 'good' secret is a surprise birthday party, and that anyone who says 'this is our secret' to a child is not to be trusted (so come and squeal to mum!).

DopeyDazy unfortunately no lesson has been learnt there. There is currently no move to change the policy, and a move to debate it in parliament was blocked by the speaker of the house. Therefore one can only conclude that the relevant authority don't care if more women prisoners are assaulted/raped by males who identify as transwomen.

because...

1. no men affected
2. incarcerated women have no say

Helen Watts on R4. Followed by Susie Green. About 1.30, WATO. Helen did well, I thought.

I thought that Susie Green was excellent, really made some good points. The ex GG leader's argument of transgirls make people uncomfortable was pretty piss poor I thought.

You know who she is, right? And the wider picture here? Why should a trans girl (remember this is a boy child/teen who thinks he feels like a girl) have priority over a girl?