to think our children will not forgive us if we don't sort Brexit out

[HurricaneFloss]

DFiL voted Leave. He's not thick and he had his reasons but, to be frank, he's 80 and not going to have to live with the consequences long term. Especially, if the NHS don't manage to stockpile his multiple medications in the event of a No Deal.

AIBU to think we all need to kick up an almighty stink to ensure that our Government makes a deal that will protect our children's futures - even if that means remaining. Jacob Rees Mogg and his ERG buddies predict it could be 50 years for the UK to see the benefits of leaving the EU. That's too late for my DD.

Austerity has damaged enough lives, we can't let Brexit do more harm. It's no good shrugging and saying "Leave won". If this isn't sorted out there will be no winners.

No, of course not.

Neither Labour nor Tory will commit to what sort of Brexit they actually want
because both parties would split if they did

www.theguardian.com/business/2018/sep/26/uk-appoints-food-supplies-minister-amid-fears-of-no-deal-brexit
UK appoints food supplies minister amid fears of no-deal Brexit

MP David Rutley, an ex-Asda and PepsiCo executive, will oversee protection of supplies

If we get rationing next year, which one of the leavers on this thread is volunteering to tell every kid in this country why there is suddenly no food for anyone.

You getting this yet?

If we get rationing next year, which one of the leavers on this thread is volunteering to tell every kid in this country why there is suddenly no food for anyone
rationing means there is food, just restricted amounts. Just saying........
and the hysteria on here is hilarious. i really can't wait for March, I really can't;it's going to be so funny listening to the deafening silence of the doomsayers as they realise our world hasn't ended

Vandrew I don't think anyone is saying the world is going to end , or at least not in March , it is a finite thing so will one day go poof ! But the world not ending is in stark contrast to leaving is going to be the easiest and bestest thing ever in the whole widey world, which was Leaves premise during the campaigning and just after.

I think vandrew is volunteering.

rationing means there is food, just restricted amounts.

Well that makes it OK then.

And a five year old doesn't know the difference between no food and restricted food when the only god damn thing they eat isn't available.

And actually if food is restricted that much it could well mean no food at all for certain vulnerable people or if rationing is fucked up and food prices skyrocket. People in remote locations, mobility issues, mental health issues, people already in poverty, people with restricted dietary requirements, people on uncertain immigration status (think Windrush and Grenfell).

Yes hysteria. But frankly this government isn't filling me with confidence with its competency. The scale of sorting out rationing also involves planning and infrastructure to a degree which we do not have time for and the man power for. At the start of WWII we had both man power and organisation. Computerisation and outsourcing has taken us backwards in that respect.

I take it you won't be complaining come next April. Or stockpiling.

At the start of WWII we had both man power and organisation. Computerisation and outsourcing has taken us backwards in that respect
what absoloute nonsene. So you're saying that the era of computerisation would make rationing harder to organise than when everyone had a little paper book?

rationing isn't going to happen but you have to see that that theory is tosh.

Over two years to negotiate a withdrawal agreement with the EU and we still haven't achieved one. We need one to move on to trade negotiations with the EU, which we need to achieve in the transition phase if we get the WA signed off in the next few weeks.

You may be full of confidence in our current government Vandrew , I am sorry that I do not share that confidence.

OK think it.

I looked into the history of how it was done. We do not have the same infrastructure and our computer systems are incomplete in certain ways.

You obviously welcome rationing.

I can't understand what kind of balloon thinks it's a cracking idea and wants to test it.

Not nonsense at all: the Government realised that War was coming and started to prepare in 1938 before war was declared.

Contrast this with now, where the Government is messing around and can't even agree among themselves what deal they want to ask for from the EU. They have just got round to appointing someone to oversee food and drink scarcity. At this remember is when we were promised the easiest deals in history and that people would be rushing to do deals with us. If that were the case we would be looking at a glut of food, not making preparations akin to war time.

Outsourcing has certainly taken us backwards, in the sense that the Govt now passes the buck, whereas in the past they would commandeer resources.

I'm not saying I would welcome rationing ( obviously)( and it's not going to happen)
What I'm saying is that it's blatantly nonsense to say that organising such a thing would be harder in this time of computer systems. What exactly is your logic there?
It's just another example of the hysteria that everything is worse or is going to be worse

I've lived off rations in another country. It's shit. It's shameful we are even having this discussion.

You still need data entry, rationing card production, physical distribution, management of computer errors, maning of said computers, call centres for when things go missing...

The beaucracy of the civil service at the start of wwii meant that we were a lot more set up for things.

We also didn't have a lot of anomalies from people emigrating / being immigrants / temporary visitors here on business or pleasure.

Remember rationing screws business visitors and tourism...

And our culture of eating out. Which didn't exist in 1939.

Think about how many jobs that adds up to.

It's shameful we are even having this discussion

No, it's not shameful, it's hilarious hysteria

So you're saying that the era of computerisation would make rationing harder to organise than when everyone had a little paper book?

We had ID cards in WW2 (abolished in 1952) i believe the last attempt at getting these cost billions and had to be dropped & all estimates on our population are exactly that, we don't know who is here, its done on surveys.

Not everyone has a driving licence, passport or even a bank account and fraud would be a huge issue, even in WW2 the black market was big problem.

If rationing cannot happen, then you need to write to your MP demanding that this waste of government time and money is halted?

The UK leaving the EU is a world economic event, it will have known and unknown consequences, anyone thinking these will only be positive is an fool.

People seem not to realise that this is about the long term future of this country. It is no where we are in 2 or 5 years time, but 20 or 50 years. I believe that the EU is unsustainable in its current form and that we need to get out before we are dragged into the problems that will ensue in the future. There should have been a referendum on the Maastrict treaty and we should have had the option to leave at that stage, especially as the treaty completely compromised promises made to the General Public in 1975, when the original referendum was held. However that never happened and we are stuck with the unwieldy mess that is now the EU.

rationing screws business visitors and tourism...

Disagree, there could be opportunities in having a 21st C modern economy disintegrate in a matter of months, people will pour in to see the once proud Brits queuing for 4oz of sausages and egg powder.

I thought this said chickens not children.

It's shameful we are even having this discussion
I agree. Can you imagine and political party putting a policy in their manifesto that involved stockpiling food and medicine as that policy could result in shortages? Especially if said policy damaged the economy in every model tested by govenment/party..

Who the fuck would vote for that?

And our culture of eating out. Which didn't exist in 1939.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationing_in_the_United_Kingdom#Public_catering

Restaurants were initially exempt from rationing but this was resented, as people with more money could supplement their food rations by eating out frequently. The Ministry of Food in May 1942 issued new restrictions on restaurants:[23]

Meals were limited to three courses; only one component dish could contain fish or game or poultry (but not more than one of these)
In general no meals could be served between 11:00 p.m. (midnight in London) and 5:00 a.m. without a special licence
The maximum price of a meal was 5 shillings, with extra charges allowed for cabaret shows and luxury hotels.
About 2,000 new wartime establishments called British Restaurants were run by local authorities in schools and church halls. Here a plain three-course meal cost only 9d and no ration coupons were required. They evolved from the London County Council's Londoners' Meals Service, which began as an emergency system for feeding people who had been blitzed out of their homes. They were open to all and mostly served office and industrial workers.[24][25]

(that should appeal to Brexiteers. It mentions shillings .....)

What I'm saying is that it's blatantly nonsense to say that organising such a thing would be harder in this time of computer systems. What exactly is your logic there?

Then why did the Government not keep a register of those EU citizens coming in under FoM and throw them out after 3 months, if they weren't self supporting? As Belgium does. If organising the keeping of records is so simple. Or consider the Windrush scandal - OK that was paper records, that the Government chucked out, but if it's all so easy, why weren't they digitised for storage?

But rationing food doesn't sit easily with all the wonderful benefits that the Leavers promised would accrue immediately.

People seem not to realise that this is about the long term future of this country. It is no where we are in 2 or 5 years time, but 20 or 50 years

Total bullshit & i doubt very much you'll be saying that when this "short term" economic pain means you can't pay your rent or mortgage.

No-one can predict world events over the next 20 years, let alone 50! nor their effects on an individual economy.

The EU is showing no sign of disintegration, the euro is the worlds 2nd most traded currency behind the US$, the EU trading block is the worlds largest and though the EU may well evolve, Europe needs a strong voice that individual small nations just do not have.

People seem not to realise that this is about the long term future of this country. It is no where we are in 2 or 5 years time, but 20 or 50 years

Ridiculous. But I will tell my kids that this was the leavers 'plan'. Honey, things will be great in 50 years.