To ask if anyone has a vile 13 year old DS?

[Marie0]

Sorry to post here - extra traffic

I suspect my DS 13 may have ADHD. We are awaiting an ed psych assessment and are also waiting to see Cahms.

He has control issues and his anxiety is masked with angry outbursts.

School are trying to support him by tweaking his timetable so he only has lessons with teachers he gets on with (he has a massive problem with authority and therefore there is a clash when teachers try to control him - he is always sent out for being disruptive). It has recently come to light he has 'a learning difficulty' - will get more details when I meet with school soon.

He is aggressive and smashes things up in the house and has been violent towards me and DH, on occasion we called the police and he wasn't phased at all when getting a 'telling off'- maybe next time we should press charges so he can spend the night in the cells- although I feel torn as he is only 13 and I really don't want him to have anything on record which may impact his future.

He has just thrown my clothes airers across the room because he couldn't find his jacket quick enough as he wants to go out.

He doesn't respond to 'normal' discipline methods such as taking his stuff away and grounding him. He can't seem to grasp consequences despite continually re-inforcing boundaries.

Don't really want to go down the route of medication.

I don't react to him in when he's in a rage and I do try and talk to him when he's calm but he just doesn't want anything to do with me, just tells me to 'go away'.

Anyone relate to this? Really interested to hear from any one who may have experience? Really want to help him but don't know how he's only 13 :(

Many thanks
Marie

My DS who is ASD (11) generally will talk to me freely but won't talk to anyone else apart from his sister. If I know its a difficult thing to talk about for him I start with general chit chat about something I know he loves to talk about (animals) then ask neutral questions about what I want to ask and that works with him. If its something really difficult I have in the past resorted to inventing another boy with the same issues as him, say I've been asked for advice on MNs or similar, and asking him why the boy is behaving like that and what he thinks should be done. He always tells me though at 13 he may suss that one.

Get him assessed and if it is ADHD then don't be scared of medication. There are so many horror stories about ADHD medication but for lots of people it's life changing.

ADHD, asd, dyslexia et al are closely linked so it is highly possible to have more than one. It is also genetic so if you have one child with ASD then your other child could certainly have one of these conditions.

Read up on parenting children with ADHD, focus on his positive behaviour (however small!) and look into an assessment.

Ear slaps

Thank you it’s very interesting what you say about it being genetic- I didn’t realise it was therefore more likely that a sibling would also have ASD traits / conditions.

I will read up on parenting a child with ADHD - even if he doesn’t have it or get a diagnosis soon I am sure it will be hugely helpful on strategies on how to deal with him.

I do try very hard to reward the good behaviour but it is of course very thin on the ground!

I find myself saying things like well done for bringing your plate down- and thank you for being so polite today- I struggle because I really expect him to do these things anyway, but clearly he can’t so I need to be patient and hopefully we’ll get there!

Penguins

Thanks - yes it’s getting him to talk which is definitely the problem- he obviously doesn’t feel comfortable talking with me. Sometimes he’ll talk to his dad- sometimes he’ll talk to his youth worker.

I don’t mind who he talks to as long as he talks. Must be so frustrating bottling up all his feelings because for whatever reason he is uncomfortable about opening up

https://www.additudemag.com/how-to-discipline-teenager-adhd-high-school/

Sounds super tough. I’d seek a referral to CAMHS and see where that takes you in terms of a diagnosis. He may have been really struggling all these years to hold things together and reached the point he can’t any more :( I’ve seen that kind of thing in my own son who has ASD

Thanks baked beans

Yes we have a referral to Cahms and he will be seeing an ed psych at school so hopefully we will get the ball rolling.

I think you’re right - looking back he’s always seemed to have difficulty in managing all his feelings and now he is like an erupting volcano- just has no control whatsoever- he poured a whole litre bottle of coke over me on Monday because I’d moved his sandwich from one side of the kitchen to another- I just laughed which made things worse but I didn’t know how else to react lol

I hope I can help him find some way to manage his feelings and behaviour- it must be awful for him as well as us - he can’t feel happy in himself with all this rage and anger

Sounds very like my son. He had always struggled with his behaviour at school but when he hit 13 it got 100 x worse. We went to a private child psychiatrist who was wonderful and diagnosed him with ADHD and liased with his school. He is now on medication on school days only which has changed his life (with no side effects). He said he couldn’t believe that the other kids had always found classes this easy!
Lots of things are still a struggle especially morning and bedtime routines and he needs a bit more support than a NT child but I would completely recommend medication. There are lots of them and if they don’t work or there are side effects then you just stop. Good luck and I understand how hard it is.

@ Hotsauce - your advice on page 4 about keeping home as the place they want to be, was really really helpful. We are going through a very similar situation to the OP, but our DS is only 7 years old. Currently waiting for assessment for ADHD/Autism. Reading this thread about behaviours at secondary school have really worried us, as our DS is already out of control at school and at home....everything escalated so fast within past 6 months. Already showing many of the anger, frustration, aggression, defiance examples given here by others. So worried about his future when he becomes more independent - how we will cope. So your advice and story was reassuring for us - thank you.

@Marie - good luck with your own situation with your DS. Hope you get the right support to help you. Glad you posted about this, as reading about your experience and those of others sharing in this thread is so helpful to those of us in a similar position.

Oppositional Defiancy Disorder maybe?

Dreaming - yes ODD does spring to mind - I feel he has traits of many bits of the Autistic spectrum but some are really subtle so not sure if it would warrant ASD e.g he’ll go mad about labels in his clothes which I’ll cut out - this of course could be seen as a sensory issue which of course is a recognised trait of ASD. But it’s not a frequent thing - it only crops up from time to time which makes me think maybe he’s not sensory - the label just annoyed him at that particular time.

Again he’ll react to something that really annoys him like my car beeps if he hasn’t clicked his seat belt in as I’m pulling off. This could be seen as an ASD trait - but he could just be in a bad mood.

I find it so difficult to understand his behaviour as he is also unpredictable in his responses - although unfortunately the behaviours which are always there are the serious ones like the aggression, violence and refusal to conform and do as he’s told.

Hotsauce

sorry I hadn't replied to your post - i just read it properly - loved the bit about running down the street in PJ's holding your tits LOL this would be me!

Brilliant advice about keeping the home welcoming - I am currently doing that i.e ensuring his room is tidy and I have his favourite foods and drinks in.

Also showing him the right way is valid - yes they do like to be treated like an adult don't they even though they are just a child. I always ask his opinion and give him choices and am respectful towards him despite his terrible behaviour at times.

great advice thank you

OP, don’t worry about replying specifically to me you have enough on your plate!
Glad what I helped you and ByStarlight. I found reacting to DS’s temper freak outs not helpful, but what was helpful was saying stuff like, “you are just like me, DS. I have a temper and I always regretted it. Try to breathe slowly, come on, talk to me about how you are feeling” That’s easier when it’s someone else they are angry towards. I even remember getting him to do slow breathing with me when he was barely more than a toddler.
When it’s anger against yourself is more tricky. Don’t be sarcastic or laugh, however tempting. Don’t get angry back (well not outwardly anyway) explain why you are doing what you are doing along the lines of, “son, I am not going against you to be a bitch: I am on your side and this is why I am doing it...”. There’s nothing wrong with explaining your parenting rationale occasionally so long as it’s to get some understanding from them.
Even now I will say, “don’t do it; you are like me with a temper and you will always be caught as I was, will it be worth it when you swear at xxx/kick off at school/thump y?. Is it worth the hassle afterwards?”. Not exactly a “moral” stance, but gently explaining consequences in a way that they can understand.
They are like toddlers in a bigger scarier form and you are helping to join up their developing consequence and empathy neurones in their developing brains! Still little kids and they are quite toddler like in the lack of control over their emotions really. Thinking of it in this way really helped me deal with it.

My son has severe ADHD. It was apparent from a baby. There is a misconception that children with the condition are poorly behaved. My son is not like that at all and is in fact calm and well behaved. Having ADHD CAN cause anxiety, frustration and low self esteem which in turn, can contribute to poor behaviour but if you start by thinking getting a hold on ADHD will sort the behaviour out then you are approaching it the wrong way. CAHMS are a good place to start because they provide plenty of advice and strategies for children they see even if ADHD is ruled out. You can self refer but will need evidence such as backing from the school in the form of a letter for them to offer an initial appointment. Best of luck.