My son was assaulted at school and I don't like how the school handled it. But AIBU?

[ButAIBUtho]

My son is in year 7 so only a couple of weeks in.
Two things that could alter my reasonablility in what happened today
1- we're fresh out of Primary school, perhaps this is the norm for secondary school
2- I was horrifically bullied at school and beaten up regularly, I've no doubt this makes me extra jumpy with issues of bullying that may arise.

Today I get a phone call from pastoral at 1pm. They say my son has been punched in the face after he got into a 'fracas'. But they put ice on it and he's gone back to class.

That's it.

I ask is he ok? What happened? Who did it? How did the fight start? Is he ok to walk home? Will it happen again? How old was the kid?

They say they don't know. They just deal with first aid and to call his house.

I'm panicking because DS is a really gentle soul and quiet, least aggressive child I know and his kindness has always been pointed out by teachers at primary (again false sense of security?!).

So I'm calling the school for over an hour trying to get through to someone to find out wtf happened, and is my kid ok? I mean, aside from the ice on the cheek?!

Someone finally calls me back about 2.15pm, I ask what happened? They said they just spoke to my son and he got into a fight and the other child hit my son in the face, but they will get statements from everyone and find out what happened.
I asked if it would happen again? Is my son ok to walk home? Who is the other child?

They can't tell me who the kid is and they are going to investigate it.

I ask them if I can come and collect DS as I still don't know if he's ok (I wouldn't be if I'd just been punched!) and they said yes.

So I go down to the school, see DS waiting for me. I ask to speak to someone about what's happened.
In the mean time I talk to DS, I can see the bruises on his face (I've since taken photos) and ask him what happened.

DS was with a friend, child X called friend a pussy. My DS said "why are you calling him a pussy?"
Child X asks DS if he wants a fight? DS said no, Child X swings and DS. DS pushes him away, Child X falls down. He then gets up and punches DS 5 times in the face, a teacher pulls him off.

The friend DS is with has a black eye, earlier in the week Child X punched him and he's got massive bruising (DS says "worse than mine") and it looks terrible.

Half an hour passes and a woman saunters over. We go into a room, and she says "what do you want to know?"

I say I wanted to know what happened. DS has since told me, he also told me another child has been hurt. What happens next? Will the kid be punished? Will DS be ok to walk home safely in future?

She says "well first of all, your child got himself involved with this altercation. And I'll get statements from the adults who witnessed it to find out exactly what happened."

She's really rude and defensive with zero people skills. I'm feeling myself getting a panicky frustration and anger (I expect I was BU?!).

This conversation goes round in circles and I get absolutely no answers. I don't know how the child gets punished, I don't know how they stop it happening in future, I don't know if he's ok to walk home alone or if this kid is going to do it again.

All I know is they'll be getting statements.

I ask how the child will be punished? She said it depends what the statements say and what your son did.

She did admit that one of the teachers statements married up with what my son had said.

She was rude, abrupt and accusatory.
As I left I said she needed to work on her people skills. She said "I could say the same to you."

I walked out and just sat in the car and cried.
I'm a nurse if a child is hurt and a parent is irate, I do my best to calm them down and help them. That's my job.

Today my child was hurt, I wasn't reasurred in any way shape or form (on the contrary, the kid has form for assaulting children) and I've know idea if they contact me to discuss it further or what the fuck happens.

I'm just baffled. Is this normal for secondary?!
Is this how it is handled?

He was repeatedly punched ffs.

Perfectly1mperfect I’ve been defending OPs son since the first page, I never once suggested he shouldn’t be protected. He should, any child should.

But it’s not a solution to just boot the other kid out, even if that school isn’t the right environment for him. He needs support to recognise and change his aggressive and violent behaviour now, before it’s too late.

communication should still go.

Form tutor
Head of house/year
Head teacher
Governors
County/LEA/Academy CEO

However if you are making a complaint about a member of staff you can email the head first then governors etc.

YeTalk - im not upset at all. I know for a fact serios assaults do get treated seriously. Its my job. Again, not upset, but stating a fact.

MrMeSeeks

The police are often reticent to take up complaints like this.
As an added issue it also hampers the school investigation as it has become an official police matter.

The system is really fucked up.

LokiBear there are parents and teachers on this thread who would disagree. Maybe they are (rightly) treated seriously where you work, and that’s great, it’s how it should be.

But this thread makes clear that it’s not like that everywhere.

You can not equate an adult assaulting another adult with a child assaulting another child. It isnt the same

why?

If the school don't deal with it appropriately report it to the police, the boy is above the age of criminal responsibility and punching someone 5 times in the face is not a schoolboy scuffle its assault.
If he regularly hits out be needs to be stopped or authorities should be looking into why he has that behaviour.

Coldrain if you've "spent decades unpicking this sort of situation with parents" then you should be able to quite easily decipher

"Child X asks DS if he wants a fight? DS said no, Child X swings and DS. DS pushes him away"

even if OP did miss a word or two. It's not rocket science after all. The other boy swung to punch OP's son, who pushed him away. That means child X started the fight. Quite obviously.

But this thread makes clear that it’s not like that everywhere.

The state school system, whilst not perfect far from it, at least allowed parents real systems to report poor schools to. With the birth of academies the gulf just gets wider as a lot of the management of these trusts (not necessarily the schools themselves) don't give a stuff.

If the school don't deal with it appropriately report it to the police

Agreed, and I would do the same.

BoneyBackJefferson
We are a large secondary and have a deputy plus assistant heads.
The deputy is the official deputy and steps up when the head is out.
The assistant heads all have a specific area e.g. behaviour / pastoral and safeguarding / progress / teaching etc.

At our school it would be:
Form tutor / class teacher (depending on issue)
Head of year / head of department (depending on if it's pastoral or academic)
Relevant assistant head
Deputy head or head
Governors

So in a situation like the OP, it would be head of year and assistant head dealing with it and following it up, admin staff tend to be the ones on call for first aid. The investigation would usually be done as soon as the staff were available to follow up, both children involved would be isolated pending investigation (to prevent escalation rather than to punish / it also stops the rumour mill going wild with people deciding who is on whose side).
Having taken statements, reviewed CCTV if needed, spoken to staff then a decision would be made and then parents would be called in for a meeting with a senior member of staff.

Well I'm speculating here, but if she's the behaviour and safety specialist it's possible she didn't follow through properly on the previous incident and was feeling on edge. It doesn't inspire confidence though.

Assistant is beneath a deputy.

YeTalkShiteHen

Sorry if I offended you, I know you weren't suggesting that.

There are some boys in my sons school who cause trouble and they have obvious issues at home etc. But some of them come from good homes and are just rebels without a cause. They are just showing off to try to impress and they make others kids lives miserable. The school have tried to help but to have a reputation as being 'hard' seems to matter more to them than anything. Although I don't like kids just being written off, my priority has to be my child's wellbeing and sometimes these kids just don't respond to the schools help.

Hopefully in the case of this incident, both kids will be able to move on from it and be successful at school.

It isnt the same because a 12 year old child doesnt have the same emotional understanding, empathy, impulse control as an adult.

LokiBear
But we aren't talking about a child who was unable to control impulses, got annoyed and flipped. We are talking about a child who by all accounts has started trying to provoke another child by insulting him, then challenged him to a fight and then after w failed attempts to start a fight took a swing for the OP's son.
That isnt lack of impulse control. It's calculated aggression and violence and it has no place in a school.

As a secondary teacher, I’d say you don’t sound U actually.

Schools can become defensive in the face of angry parents but most teachers completely understand that of COURSE a parent is going to be concerned if they’re told their child has been injured in a fight! I would have thought that a school would anticipate the questions the OP asked (is my kid ok, can they walk home alone, should I come in) including who was it with and what has been done.

OP appreciated that the school can’t comment or make judgements about punishments until statements have been taken (though it sounds like the staff member in question wasn’t much of a calming influence!) and information sifted through. I would have thought that if this was indeed a second offence then the pupil calling the friend a pussy/swinging for/punching would or should be at least excluded if that’s something the school does (maybe check the anti-bullying/sanction system on the school’s website to see if they’re doing what they say they do in these situations?) Maybe they don’t do that to Y7 if they’re brand new to the school but they certainly shouldn’t get away with it.

It may be the child in question has issues at home that the school is working with him on - it doesn’t excuse his behaviour but may be a reason behind it and why the school maybe aren’t taking a route of exclusion.

I wouldn’t have put a huge amount of the blame on DS - will he be punished for pushing someone who was swinging for his friend who was being called a pussy? Obviously he can’t go around pushing people on a regular basis for no reason but I would be wary of discouraging him from sticking up for others ever again if it looks like they’re about to get battered. It sounds like he just reacted to the immediate situation. “The only way for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing”. Maybe you could argue that he was “getting involved” but at least this kid saw that there are people willing to stand up to him. Getting a teacher is a good idea - it sounds like there were a few around so that’s good!

I hope all gets resolved and it doesn’t put DS off school, that the bruises heal quickly and that he’s not affected in the long term!

MaisyPops

I do believe you.

We have 2 senior assistant heads two assistant heads

one of the seniors steps up when the head is out on a rotation.

Perfectly1mperfect sorry I didn’t mean to be abrupt, I totally get what you’re saying. My priority would always be my child too, it has been in the past, when I had to involve the police. I think schools are in a no win situation, and there could be other issues at play (home life, abuse, SEN, struggling to fit in/cope with new school) which could be identified and worked with to help protect the children he’s hurting if that makes any sense.

Ach it’s just a shit situation all round really isn’t it?

I would report it to the police. And I wouldn’t let the school to deal with it on an internal only basis.

The school will never tell you what punishment has been meted out to the other child for data protection reasons.

You are entitled to ask what steps they are putting in place to keep your child safe.

And you need to tell your son to keep his gob shut and if his friend is in diffs and it looks like it’s escalating go and find an adult, not slabber. I’d bet the other child says he hit me first (which technically he did).

OP - I think it’s really good you’ve reiterated to your son not to get involved in anything physical. And it’s nice that he was sticking up for his friend.

Unfortunately, Year 7 boys (and normally I’d say there is another couple of weeks of honeymoon with them) are in the middle of setting their pecking order, much like the monkeys in the zoo. To girls who operate in more of a flat structure, this is a bit alien, but boys have a very clear hierarchy within their “packs”. If you ask them who is at the top and who is the next one down etc they all know.

When the boy called your son’s friend a pussy, he was trying to show his tossy friends that he has a higher status than him. The kind of 11 year old that says that is the kind of one who is used to being offensive and unpleasant towards others to get what he will feel is “respect”. So when your son said “why are you calling him a pussy?” that was from the aggressor’s side, a challenge to him that he then had to “defend”. As soon as those words left your son’s mouth the writing was on the wall. The aggressor was never going to a) apologise b) ignore that or c) explain himself, which are the only 3 possible verbal responses to that question.

Not knowing your son, I can’t be sure if he was being brave and retaliating by asking why he said that to defend his friend, in the knowledge that it was likely to provoke a hostile reaction, or if he genuinely thought he could resolve it verbally. He may not even know himself.

My advice to your son in future would be never to ask someone aggressive why they are doing something but instead to say to the friend “don’t worry let’s ignore him” and report it to an adult if he’s worried.

I don’t think anyone can underestimate the stress and worry of Year 7 parents and I think that while you probably came across as unreasonable it is understandable given how you were upset. No your son should not be punched. But he should be able to avoid that in future by not getting involved verbally with hostile situations.

The fact he only pushed him will mean the school can take a lot more action against this boy.

Things do settle down with them so don’t worry.

I hope this helps you and that you can both have a relaxing weekend.

Cut op some slack. He ds just started senior school so op is inexperienced in the new school culture.

I hope he’s ok and that he gets over this. Do not expect to know what punishment, if any, is given to another child.

The member of staff was lacking in understanding a new parent to the school. At juniors I found teachers more communicative. Secondary is a step change.

OP I think you are getting a hard time, I too would be upset if my child was assaulted. Whilst I agree with pp the school does need to investigate they could try and calm you down when clearly you're going to be upset/angry not escalate the situation.

I'm sorry this happened to your son