To think the deliberate targeting of disabled people is idealogical and reminiscent of the 3rd reich?

[malificent7]

Friends and I were discussing the current government's treatment of the disabled and I heard ANOTHER harrowing story. Her friends has multiple disabilities, cannot walk and relies on painkillers to make life tolerable. After her last assessment this woman was deemed fit to work and was told by a non medical professional (AKA administrator) that she didn't need medication. Her financial support was removed and now she has nothing whilst she stages an appeal.

The trouble is the government has scrapped a scheme which got disabled people into work. My good friend's sister has quite severe learning disabilities but was very happy in her job in a café until the government scrapped the scheme. Another thing we can thank Cameron for. She was devastated and wanted to work as it gave her self esteem.

So we have double standards here. We are being told to get jobs or loose benefits yet jobs are being cut.

AIBU to feel that humanity has learned nothing from history lessons at school and during a financial crisis we are keen to scapegoat others (disabled, jews etc.) Seems like most people don't want to help others as 'they work hard and why should they pay taxes?'

Someone will probably come along to say that Corbyn is an anti semite but the Nazis were anti disabled and wanted to squeeze them out of existence. So are the Tories. Is this an example of political gaslighting , cognitive dissonance or projection I wonder?

I think your attitude is pretty disgusting sen.

1. You work with disabled people, not 'the disabled'.
2. You can't be bothered to look up facts, just blithely dismiss them as 'a laugh'.
3. This forum has some really bloody good help across most areas, including that mentioned.
4. It's a bloody good job your husband isn't a mod on here, these things need to be discussed. Anecdata does not evidence make.

As kindly as possible to sen parent, if you are working with people as severely disabled as your son, you may well not see the bigger picture of people with chronic illness and cancer, who don't meet ridiculous arbitrary criteria because they are able occasionally to walk the length of a bus, put on a hat or make a hot drink

Did you happen to miss the MANY reports of AMPUTEES and PARALYMPIANS losing their higher rate for not being disabled "enough"

Actual Paralympians who have to be disabled "enough" or they wouldn't qualify to compete.

How was this ever published ????
I'll give you a clue: Mumsnet mods = Labour supporters. Majority of Mumsnetters = Labour supporters.
Sad but there you have it. Meanwhile, in the real world, people (like the ones you know Sen) carry on getting their benefits except when they come up against the sort of crappy people that exist in every single aspect of life.

Facts re labour budgets being. "better" ? Wait, didn't they fuck up the entire country ( several times ) Dunno how old you are but look up the fact about the international monetary fund having to cap our borrowing.

You do not want to give me advice re the disabled, luv. You are not worth my detailing all my experience is both a paid and voluntary capacity. And certainly not as a mother.

This whole fucking thread title is all bleeding anecdotes about " My friends second cousin once removed auntie. "

sen. I'm 60. I'm disabled. I have disabled children. I probably know as much as you do, in both a paid and voluntary capacity, too.
As for facts and figures, they're freely available and promulgating the myth does your (somewhat disjointed) argument no favours.

You work with disabled people, not 'the disabled'.

Lets not fall out over what some the correct terminology. We know what SEN means.

@senmumoftom there also have been plenty of first hand accounts of people being denied their benefits.
Just because it wasn't your experience doesn't mean it wasn't theirs. Shouting at people and insulting them won't make them listen to you

I met a lady last week who had metastatic cancer but wasn't terminal enough to get PIP under special rules ( 6 month prognosis). Her cancer had spread to her bones and lungs but was very slow growing and she didn't meet any of the Pip descriptors

She must have met the descriptors but something has gone wrong. Im surprised her MacMillan team didn't advise her. She should have a form from her Consultant, a quick phone call and her claim be fast tracked. She should have been awarded her claim in full with two weeks.

SENMUM wasn't saying others should have the same experience but the process should not be likened to the Nazi regime.

I think SENs experience with her son carries more weight then "I met someone last week..."

I too have been turned down before. I won on appeal. The fact is that both the European Court of Human Rights and Amnesty have stated that the UK is failing people with disabilities and is breaching human rights rather clearly demonstrates that there are serious flaws with the system as it stands.
With regard to comments about the Nazi regime; again, slowing down, looking at the history, and then making a judgement might perhaps be more helpful than the knee jerk reaction of 'oh my god you can't say things like that'. But actually, people can and do say things like that and it's a perfectly legitimate argument to posit.

OP you and some of the other posters on here are talking rubbish and lies. Do you actually know anything about the 3rd Reich? I think we would have heard if the government was systematically exterminating disabled and mentally ill people. Go and learn some history before comparing now to then.

Terminal cancer sufferers are automatically entitled to benefits so that's wrong too. You actually do you and your cause no favours by posting such exaggerated nonsense and putting in long words like "political gaslighting" and "cognitive dissonance" doesn't make sense or make what you say true.

Go and learn some history before comparing now to then.
I do know quite a bit about the history. I changed career at 35 and am a retired history lecturer. I stand by what I said, because I am aware of the history.

Despite people on here screaming about how the system always works and how wonderful it is real life experience has shown me that actually this government wants disabled people to just go away and die quietly so they can save money. Not one person I know got the correct award first time and it took various levels of appeal to get the appropriate award (evidence met descriptors in all cases yet lower or no award was given). The most recent example is an autistic person with mh issues, peg fed and wheelchair user unable to walk or stand much at all with a zero mobility award despite an evidence pack from 3 medical professionals. They did award on care, lower than the descriptors, but due to a 'computer error' haven't paid out. Three months down the line despite advocates chasing still no money whatsoever.

As for Godwin's Law he himself cancelled it

Don’t think my last msg posted.

The Third Reich murdered disabled patients in their beds whilst in hospital. Are you seriously comparing our govt with this behaviour? Come on.

I don't understand how that lady can be acessed as fit to work. They seem to make it up as they go along, I'm all for accessing people to be honest - I think it's only fair to ensure everyone claiming is deserving but some conclusions are just nonsense when you compare them to who is allowed to stay on benefits!

My MIL neighbour has been off sick for 15 years with a bad back, yet he goes out a few weekends a month drinking, they go on holidays, we even see him over the fence washing his large pool (bending down and jet washing). I could understand if they told him he is fit to work, he could do a desk job after all - despite being unemployable after so long out of work.

Another lady is a friend of a friend. She's been off work on sick benefits for over 20 years. Tragically her son died when he was just a toddler and she was given benefits as she has been deemed unfit to work due to depression. Again, I could see how she could also be told her benefits could be stopped. What happened was awful but is it so awful you get free money for life with no expectations to work -ever? She's since had 2 other children and lives her life like anyone else, going out and enjoying trips away.

Having just got back from Berlin, and having studied Russian and German history at GCSE and A'level, this makes me so sad.
The Tory's, their total disregard for the disabled and their actually quite clever - specific target of stopping people getting the old DLA and new PIP, is just so very wrong.

So you just got back from Berlin................? And you did a GCSE? Can you explain further ? And you jump from that to the Torys being very wrong ?

@RebeccaBunchLawyer do you think they just went in and did that on day one? Do you think they carted people off to camps to start with? No. They made life more difficult for their classed undesirable groups, created an atmosphere of resentment about those groups in the wider population them they were able to kill them off with no fear of opposition.

These tactics are very familiar to those seeing them. Channel 5 documentaries on benefits, anyone? Rise in disability hate crime?

My friend's daughter has complex needs, she is 16 now and has just finished in a special school for pupils with severe learning difficulties and complex needs. She uses a wheelchair, has limited speech, cognitive impairment and is doubly incontinent. All of her needs are well documented and she has had a statement of educational needs for the last 12 years!

She had to attend the jobcentre last week for a work capability assessment.

The world has gone mad! I'm all for cracking down on fraud but the current treatment of disabled people needs reviewing.

Well I think it must be very obvious that I think this thread isobscene.................particularly the OP final offensive comment......"The Nazis were anti disabled and wanted to squeeze them out of existence . So do the Tories. "

So I'm done with all the witty repartee and will be bringing this obscenity of a thread to the notice of some Jewish groups. Think they'll find it a fair and well thought out comparison . No ?

Well done , Mumsnet for your handling of such a sensitive subject. Stick to your strengths and post threads about MILs from now on.

This thread makes me so angry !

I have a thread in AIBU about how much I’m struggling with my illness and not being able to work - but the “disability specialist” for the DWP decided I didn’t score enough points to keep my enhanced rate of care so I lost it .

It’s going to be over a year until my appeal is lodged / heard since my review.

The person who assessed me openly admitted they had only heard of my illness but didn’t know much about it

Yet, this person was able to decide I wasn’t entitled to PIP .

It’s horrendous and I dread to think I might have to claim for ESA soon

Jesus fucking Christ @senmumoftom who died and made you judge,jury and executioner? Get over yourself will you?

I have to agree with you, senmumoftom.

This thread is obscene, and I concur that many Jewish groups would be devastated at the comparisons being made here.

I too work with people with disabilities and hear cases on a weekly basis of people failing PIP assessments. Many win appeals bit they take on average 9 to 12 months. A long, extremely stressful period of prolonged and severe hardship.
I worked with 1 family recently where the son was on high rate for care and mobility, completely failed at assessment and then won it back on appeal. He has a severe life limit your illness. How can that be right?
I don't really deal with people with terminal illnesses but I am sure I read that the issue is if people outlive the original prognosis or if they have a terminal diagnosis that is longer than 6 months?

Aktion T4 wiped out huge numbers of the disabled in Nazi Germany, and disabled people are dying quietly in their thousands right now.

The most glaring societal similarity is that it we are being conditioned into thinking it is normal and unavoidable when disabled people die - in our contemporary society, that's due to poverty, unable to access benefits and support.

The end result is still the same as the Aktion T4 project. It's at a slower pace, and the methods are different, as is the motive behind it - but the conditioning to what is happening - to the very real misery and death of disabled people, is very similar.