To be appalled at how most couples share childcare of a newborn?

[lmcc13]

I’m in a same-sex couple with my wife, together for 7 years and married for 2. We were delighted to add to our family four weeks ago when my wife gave birth to our beautiful baby boy. Becoming a parent, I’ve noticed lots of people (friends, colleagues and strangers) sharing anectdotes about their own parenting experiences. The thing that has shocked me most is how unequally caring for a newborn seems to be shared between the couple. We don’t have any other gay parent friends, so I don’t know if this is different in same-sex partnerships, but amongst straight couples it still seems the norm for the stay at home parent (exclusively mums in our social circle) to do the lion’s share of the work; during the day, in the evening and at night. I keep hearing “well of course if she’s breastfeeding, there’s not much you can do to help” and “well, I have to get up and go to work in the morning”. I find both comments infuriating! My wife is exclusively breastfeeding, and I am now back at work, but the list of things I can contribute towards raising our son is long. I clean and tidy the house, get shopping in, load and unload the dishwasher, change 95% of the nappies when I’m home (including all the night nappy changes), sterilise the breast pump when she expresses...etc etc. I’m up in the night every time the baby cries to change the baby, help my wife into the feeding chair, then later burp the baby and settle him back into his cot. And, like most of our friends and colleagues, I have an office job - I might be tired and incoherent at work occasionally during the day, but I’m not solely responsible for a human life! Unless the working parent drives, operates machinery or cares for others (nurses, teachers etc.) I refuse to believe that they can’t share in the exhaustion too. Very long rant, sorry! I think I’m just a very disappointed feminist to realise that parenthood seemingly transports many women back to be 1950’s. Why are women allowing this to happen, and why aren’t men stepping up more?

Good lord, I'm not for a minute suggesting exclusively breastfeeding makes you a martyr!

I don't believe the OP is, either?

Yes, being massively sleep deprived is good for no one. But, if you are so sleep deprived you can't teach a class, patently, you would be a danger to a newborn at home too. I do know some people end up in that situation because they have an exceptionally difficult situation with a newborn. But, on the whole, surely most people are not so sleep deprived that the SAHP is unable to parent safely and the WOHP is unable to do their job?

A couple of weeks ago I taught a summer school while in the middle of a virus that meant (excuse me, TMI) I couldn't keep anything down for several days and was too feverish to sleep properly. (And yes, I alerted the course organisers and took sensible precautions about trying not to pass it on). Doing that was much nastier than teaching when I'd been up with a newborn every hour or two. Life isn't perfect, is the point. But we get through.

And can, I'm sorry if you felt it was harsh, but I'm not sure what response you expected? 'Oh yes, everyone thought I was a good teacher, but now someone on the internet tells me she can't teach well without enough sleep, I realise I was bad'?

I bloody loved getting up in the night. Due to medication for a chronic condition I could not bf. And DH worked. .. I have fond memories of drinking rose and watching dvds and heading for bed when DS started to quiet down and DH would get up. We both thought the other had the worst of it.

Most people just muddle along, surely.

On my third baby and i have always worked on the premise that there's no point in my partner being up with me. Why do both people get up to be exhausted? He needs to be fresh for work and in the newborn days it's always been better to have one person with more energy to do all the rest of the jobs. When I'm back at work we work 50/50.

My dh was pretty hands on when my kids were born - youngest is 14 now.

Of course we get through when unavoidably sleep deprived. But what is the point of someone being unnecessarily sleep deprived due to feeling like they need to wake to offer "support" to a breastfeeding mother? When that mother doesn't need anything done to support her?

And I'd rather teachers were on top of their game, not vomiting, feverish and sleep deprived, if it all possible.

I'm with the 'no point both being exhausted' camp. I do all the night wakes because i don't have to get up as early as dp in the morning. When he is home he actually is more hands on than me with DS, so i can pootle off & catch up with anything i've missed. He will do the dishes or put a load on etc as & when its needed.

When i go back to work i will still do the night feeds purely because my job doesn't require quite as much concentration as his does. And he has a longer drive to work. But the housework etc is split & we shop as a family. Everybody does what works for them. The telling sign surely is if one partner feels hard done by...if both sides are happy let it be

I clean and tidy the house, get shopping in, load and unload the dishwasher, change 95% of the nappies when I’m home (including all the night nappy changes), sterilise the breast pump when she expresses...etc etc. I’m up in the night every time the baby cries to change the baby, help my wife into the feeding chair, then later burp the baby and settle him back into his cot.

1. Cleaning and tidying , shopping and loading the dishwasher are not childcare.

1. Most women don't pump and so therefore don't need all that sterilising .

1. Most women don't own a feeding chair let alone need hoisting onto one . I fed mine sitting up in bed . A burp was 2 pats and then they fell back to sleep .

So the only extra and relevant thing you're really doing is change the nappies .

I think people do what works for them. No need to be appalled.

Yes, I'd rather not be a vomiting teacher too!

But isn't the point that you are presuming your definition of 'unnecessarily' is the same for everyone? And that's just as bad as anyone else generalising from their experience, which is what many people object to with the OP.

You might not need anyone up with you in the night. But, others are different. There's a spectrum - from women who physically need help, even if EBF, because they can't lift the baby or whatever it may be, to women who are lonely and desperately need the emotional support, to people who maybe just feel a bit better for a cuppa and a chat in the middle of the night.

I get why some people might not like it, but to say categorically it is 'unnecessary' seems odd to me. One might equally say it is 'unnecessary for both parents to do anything for a baby, yet of course we do, because it's actually quite emotionally rewarding and necessary. Right?

I was interested to read your post, OP, because I am also in a same sex couple and am pregnant. We both work full time and after the baby is born I will be on maternity leave and DW will go back to work after a couple of weeks I imagine. Even though she is very helpful at home, I expect to do far more of the "housework", simply because I will be at home and she will be at work and (a) will have far less time at home to do things and (b) needs to be well rested to do her job.

I am prepared for what it will be like because I also have 2 older children (from a previous marriage to a man), and after ex-H went back to work I similarly had to do most things at home, for similar reasons. I don't think it's a gender issue, I think it is one of practicality. My DW is amazing and does loads when she is at home, but it stands to reason that if one of you is being SAHP and one is at work, the SAHP has to do more.

Interested to read other posts though.

Oh no LRD - I didn't think you were being harsh, it made me chuckle more than anything. And I wasn't for one second insinuating you were a bad teacher (sorry if it came across that way), just that I find it hard to believe that anyone is on their A game when they're very tired (ie newborn days tired). From my own experience of parenting/breastfeeding a newborn, after the first few days where husband and I were completely on edge we got into a routine that worked for us. That didn't include me needing him to be awake when I was. He slept throughout the night, I spent much of the first month cocconed in the bedroom with baby napping, watching Netflix and eating the food he prepared for me before he left. The OP saying she is appalled at how other couples parent their own children because they don't do it like she does is naive and insulting.

Don’t most people feed sitting up in bed, really? I can’t for the life of me see the point of getting out of bed to sit in a chair, particularly if, as the op’s partner seems to, you need help to climb into it? And out, presumably... (what sort of dastardly contraption is the bloody thing?)

What extra value could it possibly add?

That's a much more generous response than I deserved for snapping, can. Thank you.

It's really hard to know what you do because it feels necessary at the time, and what you really shouldn't have done. But I do think for us sharing the night wake ups was a really important thing at that newborn stage. It is personal.

No point both tried. Best decision i made was to ff fed dd. I went to bed at 7-8pm. Dh would bring dd feed and changed at 11am (i opened eyes but didnt wake if you know what i mean). Dh slept in spare bed. I did the 4am feed. Meant we both got slept and he needed to work. I could sleep on. I wasnt the only one who did this. Whatever gets you through the none sleep stage. Op the baby stage is the easiest time you get if you get the sleep. Trust me here it gets alot harder...alot. Its also more fun and ive never laughed so much but seriously baby stage is easy. Toddlers are sent to test you!

Well, yes, of course if the breastfeeding mother wants/needs help that that's not unnecessary or avoidable. But this assumption that (male) partners who don't get up to provide support for night feeds are automatically lazy/not equal is wrong. As is the idea that breastfeeding exclusively is somehow a sexist stereotype. It is something that only a female parent can do, it isn't something that can be divided 50/50. And parenting tasks don't each need to be done 50/50 in order for parenting overall to be equitable.

YY, I agree with that - providing unwanted help isn't 'help' any more.

I don't see why or how EBF is sexist. Am I missing this? The OP seems to be saying her wife is doing this?

I don't think OP is sanctimonious at all, most men are bloody useless in my opinion. It's properly santimonius to think your husband is the norm if you have a good one, it isn't the norm. I did everything and went to work in both my marriages and all my friends bar two have all had roughly the same experience.

@madcat you can't say most men are useless, they really aren't.

My brother is not useless he's a great dad/man, my husband is a great dad/man, I hope to raise my son to be a good man. You've written my.son off before he can even wrote his name haha!

In my friendship circle all the men they are married to/are in a relationship are not useless, this includes two same sex marriages one of which are adoptive parents.

There's no need to mass generalise one sex...

I was seriously ill after having our youngest. DH was given extra leave, because I was so sick, but due to the fact that I was unable to breast feed, we took it in turns, whoever was doing the night feeds went to bed earlier and got solid sleep, while the other did the last feed at about midnight. Then the night feeder took over while the other slept. Whichever of us that hadn’t done the night feed then got up in the morning to feed the baby and sort out our children for school. We kind of did the other jobs between us although I was limited due to my health. I don’t think there is a right or wrong to this. It’s very personal

Sorry but help my wife into the feeding chair wtf? do people honestly use feeding chairs?!

My experience of male partners is similar to my experience with dp. One is even a SAHD because it worked better for their family. Generalising that all blokes suck based on anecdotal evidence is silly

I wonder if the replies to your post would be the same if it were a man in a heterosexual couple posting?

Anyhow, I think you are right. Yes, you may be going slightly overboard helping getting into the nursing chair etc but I would have loved that support in the early days.

FWIW I used a nursing chair/fed in bed/co-slept

Bfeeding in the middle of the night or trying to settle a colicky baby can be very lonely.

Keep doing what you are doing op. As long as your wife is appreciating it and it’s not annoying her! 😂🤣

I agree with you.

Most men are entitled man children enabled by their wives to do basically sod all when they get home from work.

There’s that most men thing again... Based on a survey of two at most