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Original poster

To think university snobbery must stop

708 replies

Staceystace · 30/08/2018 19:22

I was telling a friend about my nephew who is off to University. I said to her he is off to x uni to study English, she said oh I didn’t even realise that was even a uni. She then went on to emphasise how her daughter is off to a top 20 uni, she went on to say how she wouldn’t have gone if it was not a Russell or 1994 group as she does not think it is worth the debt. I just got the vibe she was looking down on my nephews uni. Aibu to think this sort of snobbery about unis is terrible and needs to stop. My nephew is not the most academic, but surely not everyone is capable of going to a russell group.

OP posts:
redcarbluecar · 31/08/2018 07:27

Agree with you OP, although there will always be snobbery when it comes to higher education. I find it cringeworthy to hear people refer to the ‘ex polys’ nearly 30 years on. Some of these unis have really good specialisms, and people should be able to make choices, based on their Level 3 achievement, interests and aspirations, without judgement. I agree that going to uni without interest & just for the sake of it is a bit of a waste of time and money, but that would be true of any choice made on that basis.

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 31/08/2018 07:30

@toomuch you do realise that times have changed since the 90's. I work at an 'ex-poly' and we work with the same employers and graduate recruiters as the RG uni's in our area. Attending this type of uni will not guarantee you a good job. Employers are more interested in what you have done with your time at university.

As an aside, we really need to stop using the term ex-poly. The vast majority of students who attend these universities weren't even born in 1992. The sector has changed immensely and you can no longer hold RG uni's up as the gold standard. Many unis outside of this group score far higher on student satisfaction, teaching excellence and graduate employability.

echt · 31/08/2018 07:39

I was around when the polys, a number of which had excellent reputations in their own right, were still polys. Graduates from the polys were referred to as "university challenged". Witty but cruel, and so mistaken.

Theresnodisneyending · 31/08/2018 07:49

You don't need "friends" that stuck up.

bellinisurge · 31/08/2018 07:51

I'm sorry your "friend" is willy waving about this.
But some universities are better than others.

toomuchtooold · 31/08/2018 07:57

Is there another term you would prefer me to use BlaaBlaa?

I'm perfectly willing to believe that there are some courses where a non redbrick, non Russell group university course will give you as good or better chances to get into your chosen profession. But I don't think that's true across the board - it's not what I've seen in the pharma industry, and while it's 15 years since I qualified 15 years ago, I do still see who's recruited and have taken part in interviewing people so I know that that hasn't changed in my industry.

Holidayshopping · 31/08/2018 08:00

But ‘ex-poly’ is a description, just like ‘ex-council house’. Some people may wish it wasn’t so, but it is accurate nevertheless.

JillCrewesmum · 31/08/2018 08:01

You could call them universities, which is what they are.

NameChangedAgain18 · 31/08/2018 08:06

At most RG universities the teaching of undergraduates is left to PhD students and other post-grads. The academic staff often do very minimal actual teaching

Complete nonsense.

AlmaGeddon · 31/08/2018 08:07

Of the Dcs who are my kids cohorts who got the plum graduate trading jobs in big companies they all were personable and sensible types - so it's not just exam results. These were engineers -possibly not the types to be game designers etc. But what these big cos were wanting.

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 31/08/2018 08:11

How about just calling them what they are.... universities 🙄
Of course quality varies across the sector, nobody will dispute that. However, don't assume RG universities are automatically better because, believe me, that's not the case. I've worked in a wide range of universities and found that the teaching quality and support for students ( including career guidance) was far superior at the non RG unis. But again, that will vary.

You have only a snapshot of one sector..and a sector that isn't representative of the HE sector as a whole. Pharmacy is still predominantly offered by RG or red brick universities so of course you'll be seeing more graduates from those type of universities.

daisychain01 · 31/08/2018 08:16

Stacey your "friend" is being narrow-minded and delusional - no posh University will cure that. I wouldn't waste your effort trying to change her point of view. Not your problem.

theipadsavedmylife · 31/08/2018 08:19

When the graduate programme requirements is a 2:1 then it really doesn't matter what uni at that point. I have 3.0 from a top uni. Seriously I am very jealous that I could of got a first at a lesser uni.

Degrees aren't GCSE they are graded across the students in that course.

Of course a uni can open doors for you but not with a third Confused

DieAntword · 31/08/2018 08:23

@theipadsavedmylife my dad got a 3rd at Cambridge and he’s done alright out of it. Admittedly it was a long time ago and more people go to uni now.

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 31/08/2018 08:25

If you got a third at a 'top' uni I very much doubt you would have got a first elsewhere. They might not be graded like GCSEs but they are standardised and moderated internally and externally.

toomuchtooold · 31/08/2018 08:26

You could call them universities, which is what they are

Well that's true but it's not very useful in a conversation about the differences between Russell Group, redbrick and ex poly universities is it? If we were talking about whether it was unfair to say that apples were better than oranges, would it be helpful to refer to them both as fruit?

redcarbluecar · 31/08/2018 08:26

Some of these responses seem to assume that everyone achieves the same Level 3 results and then gets to choose from the full range of HE institutions, sometimes mistakenly choosing a 'lower status' university when they could have selected RG and improved their prospects. In reality, some people don't get the grades for the 'top' unis, many of which ask for AAB or higher, so those institutions aren't an option. It doesn't mean that they shouldn't consider HE at all.
A prospective employer will see a candidate's A Level / BTEC grades as well as their degree institution and result, and will presumably use all of that to form an opinion about their drive, skills, capacity for hard work etc.
I'm sure there are employers who favour / look down on certain academic pathways but I think the faux concern about employment prospects can be a smokescreen for the sort of snobbery exhibited by OP's friend in the first post.

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 31/08/2018 08:31

@toomuch but 'ex-poly' is the only term that's used in a derogatory way to denote lesser quality. It's unfair because it's simply not true.

Differentiate by either using their mission group or individual names.
Choosing a university simply because it's RG or not isn't a great way of making such an important decision.

JillCrewesmum · 31/08/2018 08:32

God yes, the faux concern. And the suggestion of apprenticeships instead, as though there are thousands out there in all subjects.

If you do an English degree and do well, you can go and do a Pgce and become a teacher. It doesn't matter where you go to do this.

JillCrewesmum · 31/08/2018 08:33

Why do you need to differentiate? Just say Aberdeen or Abertay, Oxford Brookes or Oxford.

redcarbluecar · 31/08/2018 08:41

We don’t need to say ‘ex-poly’ because the change happened in the early 90s and clarification is no longer necessary. The term tends to be used pejoratively and isn’t needed. If you want to know the status or reputation of a university, look it up.

glintandglide · 31/08/2018 08:47

There are just so many variables that determine success from uni and things have changed drastically. I went to an ex poly and am very well paid in a profession. It was the professional qualification which yielded this income, but I got that opportunity from my degree. I’ve had lovely friends in the sciences (academic, research, journals) who have expressed this view that it’s a waste of money to have a degree from a uni like mine. Their jobs are so poorly paid I can barely believe it sometimes, so I don’t understand why financially their degrees/ post grads could be viewed as a more worthwhile investment than mine.

I do wonder if maybe they don’t really understand my point if I’m
Honest

Chimchar · 31/08/2018 08:49

Can't delve in to this debate...I'm utterly clueless, not having gone to university at all! Wink

Can I ask, where do you find out about how well regarded a course is in terms of the industry it's in? My ds wants to follow a particular subject, which is available in his choice of a non RG uni. A few people have told me that it's 'the best' in his chosen field, but I'd like to research more.

Thanks.

theipadsavedmylife · 31/08/2018 08:53

@DieAntword I've managed and done well I'm 10 years on now but initially I found it hard as graduate programmes and teaching / lecturing weren't open options for me. Also no one celebrated my third, I felt ashamed too and didn't go to graduation ceremony. On your Cv you don't put your grade and if/ when people ask at interview it's horrible. Going to university is an achievement but you can't all get firsts.

BlaaBlaaBlaa · 31/08/2018 08:53

@redcar you are so right about the faux concern regarding employment. These people have often done zero research anyway.
The 'ex-poly' I work at has one of the highest employability figures in the sector and the graduate figure is higher than many RG institutions.