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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think university snobbery must stop

708 replies

Staceystace · 30/08/2018 19:22

I was telling a friend about my nephew who is off to University. I said to her he is off to x uni to study English, she said oh I didn’t even realise that was even a uni. She then went on to emphasise how her daughter is off to a top 20 uni, she went on to say how she wouldn’t have gone if it was not a Russell or 1994 group as she does not think it is worth the debt. I just got the vibe she was looking down on my nephews uni. Aibu to think this sort of snobbery about unis is terrible and needs to stop. My nephew is not the most academic, but surely not everyone is capable of going to a russell group.

OP posts:
elena7475 · 13/09/2018 09:18

Is there charts on earnings after American's unis?

I have two more sons to think which uni to choose Smile

Cin3mama3 · 13/09/2018 12:57

Oxford, Cambridge I would consider the top in England. However, I think with costs escalating it may be cheaper for students to study abroad in future, possibly Europe Asia ?

ErrolTheDragon · 13/09/2018 13:30

There's some figures here:

www.topuniversities.com/student-info/student-finance/how-much-does-it-cost-study-europe

But for most students I presume unaffordable because they wouldn't be able to get a loan for either the tuition fees or living costs? And for most there will be the language barrier - though there are some courses in Europe which are taught in English.

And if you're thinking globally and in the same ranking bracket as oxbridge and the top London ones, then the Europe and Asia seems to be Switzerland and Singapore or Japan which aren't exactly going to be cheap places to live. I can't imagine it's feasible to get a place in the best Chinese unis.

www.topuniversities.com/university-rankings/world-university-rankings/2019

mathanxiety · 13/09/2018 20:25

Elena
www.businessinsider.com/colleges-with-high-starting-salaries-2016-9#-9
There are all sorts of tables of graduate earnings on the internet. The link is just one of several.

The overall trend is that the best bet is a STEM degree from a very well regarded university that is very techy, or a mid to upper tier public university, or the Ivy League, but virtually any degree from some universities will put you in a high income tier. This is partly because the requirement of a broad-based coursework for your first two years ensures graduates will have covered many bases and to a very high standard - so you see some graduates with history degrees going into finance, etc. thanks to math course requirements.

Apart from well known universities, some of the best earnings figures come from places like the Colorado School of Mines, Kettering University, New Mexico Institute of Mining and Technology, Stevens Institute of Technology, Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Carnegie Mellon - places under the radar of many prospective applicants outside the US (and maybe even within the US). Financial aid for foreign students at many of these more obscure universities will be limited.

Again for US citizens, the armed forces academies are the best bet for anyone because the undergrad degree is basically free. You do have to sign your life over to the armed forces for the duration of your contract though...

The GI Bill is another avenue to university in the US - the armed forces or National Guard pay on a sliding scale for university after varying amounts of active duty, and you get commissioned as an officer upon graduation. You are obliged to give up a certain amount of your time to training and military ed alongside your degree requirements. DS's roommate in his senior year (from a blue collar town whose parents were recent immigrants) was doing a degree in French on the government's dime and anticipating a posting to Europe upon graduation and commissioning. The roommate received a monthly living stipend.
The actual benefit amount will vary based on an individual’s total length of service. For example, those who have served at least 36 months or 30 continuous days prior to discharge for a service-connected disability can get maximum tuition and fees, a monthly housing stipend and an annual stipend for books and supplies. Those who have served at least 90 days, but less than six months, receive 40 percent of the maximum benefit. These benefits are payable for up to 15 years following a member’s honorable discharge or retirement from service.

Another aspect of the Post-9/11 GI Bill is the Yellow Ribbon Program. Colleges and universities that participate in this program contribute additional funds toward educational costs that exceed the maximums allowed by the Post-9/11 GI Bill. Institutions may set the amount they wish to contribute, which is matched by Veterans Affairs. This can be very beneficial for students at private colleges and universities, graduate programs or those attending with out-of-state status.
You can also transfer your GI Bill benefits to a spouse, children and step children.
www.todaysmilitary.com/living/paying-for-college

Another avenue is ROTC - Reserve Officer Training Corps. Basically, you sign up for ROTC, put in the time for basic and ongoing training and commit to active duty for anywhere from 3-12 years upon graduation, and you are eligible for scholarship aid that could make your degree free, and you are commissioned upon graduation too. Your contract to serve after graduation is legally binding, but you are paid for your service and you build your CV.
www.bestcolleges.com/resources/rotc-programs/
Ins and outs of ROTC.
www.rotc.armstrong.edu/LinksROTCSchbyState.htm
Some big names where you can do ROTC.

It's a huge pity that there isn't such a system in the UK.

It's worth noting that the history of STEM and tech education in the US in general was driven partly by the armed forces as they developed.

Stupomax · 13/09/2018 21:02

WRT how A Levels are perceived it was generally agreed (by the admissions team) that A Levels are more advanced than the standard US education to 18....which is why US degrees are a min 4 years rather than 3. Some said that A Levels would count as credit for year 1 and would mean that the number of classes that need to be taken would therefore be reduced. The time could be spent doing year 2 work. It's feasible for a UK student to complete the course in 3 years with a massive slog but they didn't recommend it WRT how A Levels are perceived it was generally agreed (by the admissions team) that A Levels are more advanced than the standard US education to 18....which is why US degrees are a min 4 years rather than 3. Some said that A Levels would count as credit for year 1 and would mean that the number of classes that need to be taken would therefore be reduced. The time could be spent doing year 2 work. It's feasible for a UK student to complete the course in 3 years with a massive slog but they didn't recommend it

Many US students also complete US degrees in 2 or 3 years because they already have college credits that they got through high school, or they test out of their first 1 or 2 years based on the courses they studied at high school. Some of them choose to study for the four years and get a masters because they already have so many undergraduate credits already.

DD1 who has not yet finished high school already has enough university credits to skip the first year of a degree - and it's not even something she particularly focused on. It's not at all unusual.

I think there is a misapprehension in the UK that US high school students all study at the same level, whereas in fact they study at many different levels. DD has been studying college level math for the last two years, which is totally normal in her school.

elena7475 · 13/09/2018 21:11

As much as it sounds good but military carrier is out of option . We don't have any connection to it and complicated background.
The rest of the things are to be taken into account. We have a year until DS's time to apply for uni

Stupomax · 13/09/2018 21:11

Scores needed:
SATs: students sitting this qualification will need to achieve a total score of 1,470 (out of 1,600). We do not require the optional essay in the SAT. Any candidates with a test date prior to, or including, January 2016 will be expected to have achieved the SAT Reasoning Test with at least 1,400 in Critical Reading and Mathematics and also 700 or more in Writing, giving a combined score of at least 2,100 (out of 2,400).

APTs (Advanced Placement Tests): grade 5 in three or more appropriate subjects.

SAT Subject Tests: 700 or more in three appropriate subjects.

Specific subject requirements: please check your course pages for details.

Blimey - I thought it would be harder than that.

mathanxiety · 14/09/2018 03:04

I think there is a misapprehension in the UK that US high school students all study at the same level, whereas in fact they study at many different levels. DD has been studying college level math for the last two years, which is totally normal in her school.

Amen to that. There are many, many misapprehensions. There is no such thing as a 'standard' American high school education.

Beginning about ten years ago my own local high school had to put on classes for students who had already completed calc III by the end of their freshman year. Students who have got to the end of the calc cycle so early can take classes on various math topics that engineering students do, as well as engineering topics, stats, comp sci, android app development, a course called 'advanced topics in computer science' for those who have done AP comp sci..

The range of courses offered is huge because the range of mastery of incoming students is very wide. There are freshmen taking pre algebra and others taking calc III.

Classes are made up of students from all four years.

Wrt the Oxford threshold grades/scores - I thought that too, Stupomax. I know many US students who could waltz into Oxford.

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