To be not looking forward to NYC holiday

[Kakamora]

Because of a post I’ve just seen about servers complaining they’ve had a tip that doesn’t reflect what they spent on food.

Yes I know that tips top up their wages but I want to take my mum on some pretty fancy dinners while we’re there and just because I spend $100 dollars which I’ve saved up my minimum wage money for, I don’t see why some server thinks that’s entitles he to a $20 tip because I’m spending a lot of money.

It is annoying me thinking I will have to save around an additional £150 for tip money. I always tip, but I don’t think waitresses here in the U.K. (which I am part time, think that spending £100 you know people have budgeted for warrants an expensive tip

Would you tip in a cafe or Starbucks?

It's a horrible system in the US, it feels like something that should have died out generations ago. They have such weak employment laws, that's just how it is.

Do bills add on a tip and tax? Or do you have to calculate the tip yourself?

Bills reflect price of meal/drinks plus tax but not the tip. This amount is up to you to determine.

Calculating the tip yourself is as easy as figuring out one fifth of the cost (before or after tax, whatever you wish) or figuring out one tenth and then doubling it (for a 20% tip). Or just use your phone calculator.

If that's how you feel about tipping and screwing with some ones livelihood, stay home or eat at subway.
Most of these servers couldnt dream of taking a trans atlantic vacation, too busy staying alive, paying health care, day care, rent etc Most work 2 or 3 jobs just to make ends meet, or are paying their way through school.
Dont stiff them. Your minimum wage job is way more than their server pay and still got you a trans atlantc vacation. SUCK IT UP AND TIP them or keep your tight arse at home [theoldtrout01876]

THIS^^ X 1000.

UAEMum, the servers may not 'starve' but they may not be able to afford both rent and health insurance - maybe one or the other. They may not 'starve' but they may end up putting their tax bill on a credit card with maybe 18% interest. It is the law to pay taxes and also to pay for any medical treatment you may need. And you get turfed out on your arse if you don't make rent.

The tip you leave gets shared out among the wait staff and the busboys and the sous chefs and the washing up guy in many restaurants, so even if you think your waitress sucks, spare a thought for the poor busboys and the staff you never see who also depends on your view of 'customs' and 'laws'.

Tip what you can afford and enjoy your trip

Factor in the tip when deciding what you can afford.

And you don't need to carry cash around, worry about the different denominations of paper money, or leave a pile of money on the table either - most places that take a cc will give you the bill and you can fill out a tip amount and the total on the bill. There is often a line left for a tip and another for the total.

It isn’t my fault that they can’t pay their citizens properly
'They' do in fact pay their citizens. The people receiving the service pay for it. You should pay too.
If you want everything to be exactly the same as it is in your neck of the woods, stay home. If you want to be the cheapskate who expects the kind of service that decent establishments provide and then not pay your server that is up to you. And it's so ironic that you are contemplating stiffing the servers basically to show off to your mother how much you can afford to spend.

Apparently Americans traditionally like to see what they are paying for, so they like the item/food, the tax and the cost of service to all be separate. I've met Americans who are shocked that we just pay a lump sum and don't think about how it's divided up.

Americans get to vote on the local taxes. Therefore they like to see what exactly those taxes are. In my particular municipality the sales tax is broken down as follows:
"The 10.00% sales tax rate in [suburb] consists of 6.25% [state] state sales tax, 1.75% [county] sales tax, 1.00% [municipal] tax and 1.00% Special tax."
Local voters cast votes for all of this. There are referenda on property tax increases to fund items like a new library, a new year round ice rink, etc., etc., and to increase funding for local schools, and lots more. There are also referenda on setting up special tax districts in the municipality where I live. Part of the job of the municipal mayor and administration is to attract business and thus increase sales tax revenue, and prevent increased taxation of property owners.

If I shop in a certain other suburb I pay about 9% sales tax, and if I travel out of my county I pay less again. When my county started taxing sugary drinks many people drove across the county line to pay less.

LighthouseSouth
@ Storm4Star
no offence but why on earth would you use a stranger for transport - would you get in a random minicab that stopped by you in London?

You hail a taxi, as in the movies. You do not know the driver from Adam (assuming one stops). This is how it works.

KeepOnKeepingOn1 Thu 09-Aug-18 16:56:30

According to posts on here this system is terrible for the staff and terrible for customers. (Except for those customers who get off on flashing largesse to buy 'exceptional service').

But staff and regular customers have to accept it.

You have to go along with it because of system and custom otherwise go to Blackpool and/or eat at KFC/McDonalds.

Push past the 'custom' and 'system' bollocks and we find it is great for restaurant owners.

And no one can understand why OP may be confused?

She's not confused. She's just a cheapskate.

Restaurants barely make ends meet. Very few last more than a few years.

And nobody is getting off on flashing largesse.
Americans tip because they are not tightwads and they know the reality of life for most recent grads or students.

Most have done unpleasant or low paid work themselves as teens or college students, even students at Ivy League universities, and they know how much it costs to live in any major metropolitan area. Many have children who are doing jobs like waiting tables too. I do not know a single professional American who did not do his or her share of scraping trays in a university dining hall or other lowly work.

Waiting tables is what you do to pay the rent while you interview for the job that requires a university degree, or while students are in university, juggling classes by day and waiting tables at night. There are very few waitstaff who do this as their career, all their lives.

They way the system is set up, it incentivises moving on. Ditto the way the requirement to pay back your student loan beginning six months after graduation regardless of your income incentivises getting a job. Maybe that job will be waiting tables... You do the waitering thing until something better comes up. Meanwhile you are required to report your earnings to the IRS and the IRS estimates that your take will reflect 15% tips. There are tax tables to help you figure out how much your quarterly tax check will amount to. You also pay Social Security and Medicare rates.

Funny how many misconceptions there are on this thread.

KeepOnKeepingOn1 Thu 09-Aug-18 17:18:42

People from the UK don't tip for normal service because they can't imagine that worker's rights have been so eroded that they actually rely on tips to meet everyday expenses...

...How many of us rely on tips and putting on a persona to maximise them?
The incentive to earn the good tip means that waiters do their utmost and customers return. It's not 'a persona'. People in the US are generally not surly or unfriendly or rude. It is not a stretch for most to work waiting tables, being nice to people. As a result of friendly service and decent food that is priced right, the restaurant stays in business. The waitstaff keeps on earning. And so on.

On a check for $100 a waiter can make $15, with $5 going to the busboy. The table is seated for an hour, and the waiter works maybe four tables for that hour, and let's say each table has a bill for $100. $60 per hour is well above minimum wage, and the busboy pockets $20 for the same time. Or it can be divided out further or in different proportions.

Yes it is expensive to live in NYC and tax will eat into your hourly take too. But it is still worthwhile to do it until something better comes up.

Incentive is a major part of what makes the American economy tick over.

People from the UK don't tip because British culture is a 'please' culture while American culture is a 'thank you' culture.

I'm just staggered that you'd be so entitled that you think you can not pay someone for their labour.

mathanxiety

the way Storm4Star described it, it sounded like the unmarked minicabs that pull up by nightclubs in London.

it certainly didn't sound like a legitimate thing.

I do know how to get cabs in London and New York, thanks!

Tipping is just the thing over there. If you didn’t tip they would just add the service charge onto the cost of your bill. If you can’t afford to tip then you should eat at cheaper places. NYC has some really nice reasonably priced restaurants so don’t let it spoil your trip.
I don’t think I’d be able not to tip or under tip. It really is considered part of the bill and it would be like walking out underpaying your bill over here. And I’d feel bad that my waiter/waitress had basically served me for less than the minimum wage.

Ok, it was a proper mini cab outside the airport. I made it sound worse than it was! Our flight arrived very late and it was a mini van where he said he could drop a few of us off so would be cheaper than one single cab. The reason I told him about the money is because he quoted around 80/90 before I said how much I had (I'd already checked with a couple of other cabs and they wanted more). It was at that point, that I then said I had literally only had 100 in cash. As I was worried we would get to the destination and he'd suddenly ask for more than 100. He said this was absolutely fine and would cover it.

I personally did not like New York at all! I didn’t find the food good [...] and once you’ve seen the major “sights” there’s nothing else there to do

That's hilarious! We go pretty much once a year for a week to ten days and there is PLENTY to do. We did all of the touristy things during our first trip and we've not been bored for a second of the subsequent visits.

All of the best food I've ever eaten is in NYC, you just have to do a tonne of research before you go and not go into a place on the hoof.

The subway is brilliant and easy to navigate, the city isn't dirty or smelly and the service in restaurants has always been impeccable. Yes, the service can be crap in shops (people chatting on the till while they should be serving) but I've seen that everywhere.

This is why I said "I personally" rather than saying something like New York is crap! I know other people love it. I didn't.

I want to support you Storm. I personally didn't like it either. I didn't get it at all.

But I personally don't like gritty and urban particularly. I thought it smelled actually- round where I stayed it really dod smell of fried food everywhere!

I didn't understand why Central Park is so great other than the views which are spectacular. After that, it's just a park.

And as for the High Line...

I loved the Lower East Side best, Washington Square and The Tenement Museum.

I don't get the love for Macy's. It is like Debenhams. Why do people go thoudands of miles then spend a day shopping?

Lots of people don't like museums. It doesn't make them 'limited'. I think that is one of tbe snobby comments I have ever read.

Sorry, have cat butting me. Meant that is one of the most snobby comments I have read on Mumsnet.

On a check for $100 a waiter can make $15, with $5 going to the busboy. The table is seated for an hour, and the waiter works maybe four tables for that hour, and let's say each table has a bill for $100. $60 per hour is well above minimum wage

IME - at least in chain restaurants - the servers work rather more than 4 tables, but that's still very well put. Even if you halve each table's spend to allow for quieter periods and smaller groups it still comes out at $30ph, which is hardly a pittance

All of which is absolutely fine and I wish them only the best with it ... but let's not pretend servers are reduced to eating scraps purely on the basis of what they take home

#supportStorm

Loveka, you've reminded me of the bed bugs. Our hotel was £120 per night and just sitting on the bed made me itch. How much do you need to spend to get a non-bed buggy bed?

Thanks loveka! I don't mind the odd museum visit but I don't want to visit an endless amount of them. People are just different. I'm not sure why people find the concept of different people liking different things to be so funny!

Thanks Shumpa! When we went we actually stayed in New Jersey, which sounds crazy! But it worked really well. We were right on the edge and a bus came by the hotel every 10 minutes, straight into the Port Authority bus terminal. Took about 15 minutes and was cheap. By doing that we got a huge room with a seperate living room etc where in the city, for the same cost, there were broom cupboards with a set of bunk beds in!

Well, I stayed in The Hilton Midtown for $400 a night. No bedbugs but it felt like staying in a shopping centre. It was SO bloody noisy as well. I thought they were having a laugh charging that.

I did have some lovely food and I liked the skyline views. But I wouldn't go back if I had to pay myself.

I hate tipping. But when we visited the US, we were careful to make sure we tipped "enough", but I actually got the feeling that tipping 20% is not as common as you would be led to believe? A couple of waiters seemed surprised at the tip and looking at what other diners around us left as tips, I mean I don't know for definite but I started to feel like we were tipping too much. And I'm confident in my maths skills!

"I personally did not like New York at all! I didn’t find the food good"

The food was the best bit for me! Although we didn't go to any restaurants, we just ate 'fast food' and by that I mean the new wave of healthy fast food that NYC seems to be inspiring. We had loads of delicious chopped salads and various soups. The underground bit of grand central station has a wonderful array of take away food. The massive variety of ethnicities and culture of 'new ideas' seems to inspire some really interesting outcomes when it comes to food there, in my opinion.

It's the same with cruising, which I'm pretty keen on. Even with the frequent deals where tips are included they'll still do it - often upfront before any service has been received - which creates an expectation from everyone else

Yep. I give an envelope with $100 to the cabin steward on embarkation day. On family cruises, my BIL tips his young adult daughters' cabin steward well because they are very messy.

See I didn't even know you're meant to tip on cruises! Although I've never been on one or looked into it. My friends on one at the moment so will ask her about it when she comes back.