AIBU to not want to have homeless people with complex needs placed in the house next door to me?

[StressedandNameChanged]

I live in a 2 storey terraced house in a small residential street in an area with lots of rows of similar small terraced houses. It’s not the smartest area of town and hasn’t had the best reputation, but it was affordable when we moved here over 15 years ago, and we have been happy here. I live with my dh, and my youngest ds 12.

The end terrace house next door to me was bought by a private investment company earlier this year, and I recently found out that this was part of an organisation which combines property investment with supported housing. Following a lot of enquiries on my part, I found out that they planned to use the house as a house share for 5 vulnerable adults with complex needs and a history of homelessness. Complex needs means at least 2 of the following issues: substance misuse; history of offending; history of anti-social behaviour; mental health problems.

Communications with the organisations who will be managing the property have been problematic. They were initially very evasive, but once I had more info, the housing manager agreed to come to a residents’ association meeting to discuss the plans for the property. It didn’t go very well. On the agenda at the same meeting were problems with an existing supported housing project in the neighbourhood, where due to staffing issues and some challenging clients, the police are being called out every night.

The housing manager later offered to come and speak with dh and myself but as we were away at the time, we said we would arrange a date when we got back. Unfortunately, while we were away a neighbour put up some very offensive signs around the property, including some in my garden and went to the local paper. (This may be the same neighbour who has also been cutting cctv cables at the property). Since we got back we have tried to get in touch but no response. There is a meeting set up with the neighbourhood policing team and others, but the housing managers are not available to attend that either.

Meanwhile I have heard from elsewhere that at least one tenant would be moving into the property in 2 weeks’ time. I think the company running the property are trying to get it as a done deal with people living there before talking to anyone.

I know people can change and this is hopefully a good opportunity for the people who will be placed next door, but I also know there is no magic wand for people who have struggled with multiple serious issues for several years, and there will be relapses. I am worried about the location and the suitability of the property for this use. Most people who have suffered high levels of trauma and are trying to move away from a chaotic lifestyle want their own place where they can control their surroundings, not a shared house. I am worried about 5 vulnerable adults being housed together in a small Victorian terraced house with poor sound proofing. Many houses around here are used for student housing and they live 5 to a house, but they are groups of friends who choose to live together, and they can usually escape to their parents’ homes for a break. I know from experience the level of disruption just one tenant in a shared house can cause if they kick off, mainly to the other tenants but also to the neighbours. I am worried about some of the visitors they will attract. I am worried about the possible high turnover of tenants. I am worried about the potential disturbance for ourselves and other neighbours. I know what the streets around other hostels are like, and I will not feel safe if my street becomes like that. I am worried about the failure of the people managing the property to communicate, which doesn’t bode well if problems do occur. I am stressed out and losing sleep worrying about it.

Yes, I know I am being the very definition of a NIMBY, but I am amazed that this sort of facility can be placed in a residential street without any consultation with neighbours, the local authorities, the police or any existing services in the area.

Terry am i right in thinking its a higher rent for temp accomodation.

Depends on the arrangement. I always worked for charities. The rent was high but often (almost always) met my HB.

Ta

I've a long history of mh problems, I've also been homeless more than once as a result.

I'm also a Lp who despite these difficulties has managed to raise a reasonably well behaved 17 yr old, maintain a home for several years and never caused neighbours any hassle at all.

But hey, nice to know you wouldn't think me good enough to live next door to you!

I'd live next door to you Graphista. In a heartbeat.

@MrsTerryPratchett thank you. What in your view are the necessary elements for it to succeed?

I am concerned about the lack of communication and absence of consultation. It wasn't great before d**khead neighbour's actions, and unfortunately his behaviour has given them an excuse to cut off communications. My communications with them had always been polite.

As I said we have another hostel nearby which has been there for several years. Much of the time no-one knows it's there. The tenants have been involved in various community events and activities over the years. But every now and then, some particularly disruptive tenants move in and it all kicks off, or it's not necessarily the tenants but people who are (for want of a better word) preying on the tenants. That hostel has 24/7 resident cover (+key workers, etc) so a higher staffing level than next door. But they have been struggling to recruit and retain staff, which is partly why there have been so many problems there over the last month, and the frequent police call outs.

This sector is very low paid - not far above minimum wage for a challenging and skilled job with anti-social hours - so I think the staffing issues are across the sector locally.

Thank you mrsTP

Id live next door to you too Graph i suspect we would chat and debate a LOT over the fence.

Helena I'd love to live next door to you I think we'd get on famously the chats would last hours

@graphista your situation isn't very different from many of my friends. I wouldn't have any problem with you living next door. In fact I'd rather have you than d**khead neighbour at the moment. My concerns are putting 5 people all with multiple issues into the same small house, and the lack of communication.

There's a lack of consultation because the consultation invariably goes like this:

Org: We have done...

Neighbours: DRUG ADDICTS, NOOOOO, STEALING AND MURDER

Org: But we have found

Neighbours: NIMBY!!!!!!!!!

And scene.

I was in two excellent houses. One had 24 hour staffing and one was day only. Both had happy neighbours. I've also worked in middling houses. Tended to be because of a combination of youth (staff and residents), lack of community support, lack of training and lack of funding.

Honestly, the best house had an elderly neighbour who did gardening with the residents and they all loved her. The thought of shitting where they ate was horrific to the residents and any new resident that messed around got told.

BTW all the houses I've worked in have had more than 5 residents.

I knew a couple who lived next to a supported living flat and it was very difficult as the residents would stay up half the night playing music. The support workers didn't want to know. I don't blame you for being concerned and agree that a detached property would be better.

Graphista, easy for me to say, but I wouldn’t take this thread so personally. I’ve had a lifetime of mental health problems, my partner has been homeless, as have a number of my friends, family and some acquaintances. Not one of us has, or would be troublesome to live next door to. I think the fear arises from not knowing what the vague term ‘complex needs’ means. Because as you may have read in throughout the thread, it can sometimes mean living next door to ex offenders and substance abusers. Which, lets be honest, is not ideal if you yourself are vulnerable, or if you have young children. I’ve been in that situation and you are on edge all the time. So in the op’s situation I would be concerned for what that meant for me and my family.

What you're basically saying op is "oh but I don't mean you" except you do, you just don't want to admit that. This could well be me in a few years. My health is getting worse if anything and the only reason I've not been put in multi-occupancy is dd, but when she's grown & gone I can easily see how I could end up in this situation.

I've actually looked into the possibility of supported housing even though I'm only 46. It does exist for some mentally ill adults in a very few parts of the U.K. But nowhere near enough. Yet the facilities exist in most areas as elderly supported housing has the framework for it but it's not being used even if the elderly supported housing isn't full.

I am really struggling with this thread, it stinks of NIMBYism and ignorance.

People are homeless for all kinds of reasons.

Some addicts actually do wish to stop, addiction is an illness.

Complex needs could be a whole host of things.

This property will be regulated and operated by a whole load of agencies, MAPPAs.

The Police being called to a property is not always the fault of the residents, have you heard of cuckooing?

@MrsTerryPratchett how do you find out which organisations are likely to run excellent houses? The organisation running this is from out of the area, so we know nothing of its track record. It slightly concerns me that all of its directors come from a background of property investment/ management, not a social housing background.

It's not "taking it personally" it's putting the other point of view, that of the residents.

I've also got relatives and friends who'd be in the category of ex offenders and addicts. They'd be no bother either, they've enough to deal with.

Graph

@nooblynoo yes I have heard of cuckooing. There have been quite a few cases locally, and it takes a long time to get police action on it. At least that is a bit less likely to happen next door, due to cctv.

Because we are close to the town centre and parks there is a lot of street dealing round here. This is shit, and there are not the police resources to tackle it. But it is likely to make it more challenging for anyone trying to stay off drugs, because dealers will often target former users once they know where they live.

The definition of complex needs in the OP is from the housing organisation's contract. On the referral form, at least 2 of those boxes need to be checked, or they will not be eligible. It is not just for people who are homeless or people with mental health problems.

If I had a line of communication with the housing organisation, i would be talking to them to ease my concerns, rather than posting on mumsnet.

What an utter embarrassment of a thread.

I am really struggling with this thread, it stinks of NIMBYism and ignorance.

How I lived in my 20s was very different to how I live now, in my 40s.

I knew lots of drug addicts socially back then, I was in and out of their homes. Many of them were lovely. Some were arseholes. Would I want to live next to the ones on crack / smack, now I've got a family? Nope. And that's from a place of knowledge, not ignorance. It's a world I used to know only too well.

If they're well supported then it could be fine. If they're not, and some people living chaotically move in, I wouldn't want to be next door.

I wouldn't be so concerned about living next to a homeless hostel. As you say, people become homeless for all sorts of reasons - relationship breakdown being a major reason.

It's the drugs and "complex needs" that's the issue. People living chaotic lives, who may well not have the support they need, especially given the current climate of cuts.

i'm not saying it'll be terrible. It may be absolutely fine. Hopefully so. I'm just saying the OP is not BU to be concerned.

It slightly concerns me that all of its directors come from a background of property investment/ management, not a social housing background. Yes, this would concern me.

It slightly concerns me that all of its directors come from a background of property investment/ management, not a social housing background.

What you want to know is who will be running the support day-to-day.

My advice is to say hi to the staff, let them know kindly of any concerns, say hi to the residents and smile in the street. Say 'morning'. If you treat them like they are, you know, humans, they will treat you as a human.

The absolute worst neighbours I have had weren't poor, or mentally ill, or homeless. They were entitled arseholes. Well-spoken and everything.

@graphista sorry to have upset you. I have been homeless on more than one occasion, fortunately a long time ago now. I also have had mental health problems - not at the same time.

Thank you for putting it from the point of view of the potential residents. But you actually wouldn't be a potential resident for this property. You don't meet the criteria unless you had one of the additional needs, though your friends and relatives might.

In our area, housing association supported housing for older people starts at 50 with exceptions made for people who are nearing that age and need the support. Hopefully there is similar provision where you live.

My hope is that the people who move in next door will be no bother, but I am afraid I do need more reassurance of that.

My main concern if I'm honest is the addiction issue. Both drugs and alcohol are very hard to stay off, even with motivation and support. Over 90% of people sleeping rough locally are users. Possibly in their situation with their stories, I would be too. But even if they are lovely people, it causes problems. Someone on an alcohol bender can lose it. One of my periods of homelessness was after leaving an ex who was an alcoholic and violently abusive. And I have very little sympathy for the dealers of hard drugs and the misery they cause.