To think a lot of people are jealous of teachers' holidays but...

[Pengggwn]

...too bitter about it to admit that they wouldn't be teachers themselves?

Just that really.

I have seen so many comments and threads aimed at dissecting teachers' pay and conditions to a forensic level, people complaining that teachers are available over the summer to answer their queries, people arguing that teachers should be working anyway or claim to be working even when they're not (I'm not, at least not for the next month).

And yet, we are in the middle of a teacher recruitment and retention crisis. We can't recruit and keep well-qualified teachers.

Where are all the volunteers??

People seem to think that teachers are rewarded with holidays for the hard job they do in term time.

Teachers get long holidays because the kids get long holidays and there’s no point in paying teachers to teach to an empty classroom.

There are long holidays because the kids need them, not because the teachers do. No one really gives a shit if a teacher needs a break.

Teachers don’t have the exclusivity of difficult jobs. That’s why people get annoyed.

^^ In gets this. And I used to be an FE teacher (before the escape)

I couldn't be a teacher. It sounds horrendously hard work. I used to be a lecturer, and had one day a week with back to back lectures and seminars, and being "on display" all day was EXHAUSTING.

You'll increase that by at least 60% in 5 years with TLRs and incremental rises.

Incremental rises aren’t guaranteed any more and lots of teachers don’t make it to 5 years. A quarter of new teachers are gone after 3 years - and they’re the ones who made it through training!

but I do think that sometimes on Mumsnet, teachers make out that their job is the most highly pressurised, badly paid, horrendous job in the world

I've never heard any poster on MN say this. I read a CiF poster in the Guardian who said this, about 6-8 years ago. I cringed. Never read it elsewhere or heard any teacher in RL say it. Been teaching forty years now.

I'm a teacher and to be honest, I don't really recognise the description of 'working 7am to midnight for less than 25k a year'. I earn about 31k and work 8am - 6pm for most of the year (apart from busy periods like report writing time and the start and end of a new term when there's lots of planning to do. I think I'm well paid and get good holidays for the work I do. I'm in Scotland though where the workload is less intense.

*Agreed. I left teaching but never put in 17 hour days and neither did any other teacher I knew. I also took full advantage of my holidays.

I guess some teachers are perfectionists so will put that time and effort in but it’s certainly not a standard requirement.*

I don’t think you can compare teaching of yore with today’s expectations. Hugely dependent on who you are working for.

I don't think it mattes how much we teachers try to explain the realities of the job. It is far easier to go straight to hyperbole, misunderstanding and repetition of vague 'information' and to castigate the whole profession.

There are many other jobs as bad, many worse. But these post ask about teachers, teachers therefore reply.. and suddenly we have to accommodate Uncle Tom Cobbley and all before we can have an opinion on what we do every day.

Which all seems to much like being back in front of a class full of kids who are excitedly awaiting their 6 week holiday

Teachers don’t have the exclusivity of difficult jobs. That’s why people get annoyed.

^^ this x 1,000,000.

So sick of hearing teachers winge.

I can honestly say I’m not jealous. But then my ‘work’ for today involves a three course dinner at The Ivy and a normal working day for me is about two hours work, working from home for the most. I’m incredibly lucky, I write the theatre reviews for a large magazine so I see all the top shows for free, complimentary drinks,, mingling with celebrities etc. I wouldn’t change my job to one where I work with other people’s kids!

I need the six weeks. Today is my first day and I am totally brain dead and anxious. I am finding it hard to get motivated - I am thinking about all the things I should have done, what I need to do and about how some of my pupils who have really bad lives are doing. This will continue until next week.
Next week I will start to relax and by week three I will be in the swing of things. Week five is results so the panic starts again - what will my 'punishment' be when the pupils don't all achieve and what extra work will it mean. Last week will be in school.

People don't tend to get the intensity of teaching. It is all consuming. As someone who retrained at 30 and has a really stressful job before I didn't realise the difference. I am performing from 830-330 every day. Dealing with children who have particular needs, who are living in poverty, who are being abused, bullied, not cared for. On top of that the admin side which is all done outside of contracted hours.

I know that lots of jobs have long hours but teachers, nurses, caters have that extra intensity that sometimes those in different jobs don't understand

I've never understood any jealousy about teachers' holidays. The amount of prep they have to do, often burning the midnight oil, is enormous. They can't afford to get behind with research or reading. Most work some of the school holidays too.

It's an extremely demanding job and not that well paid compared to other professions until a teacher becomes more senior and is promoted.

I'm happy to admit I would never have considered teaching as a career. The main reasons for me are: appalling salary, lack of flexibility during the working day, no option to work from home, rigid holidays that have to be taken at peak times.

Oh, well done Latte.

I agree there are lots of ignorant comments or accusations that 'if teachers claim to have it so hard...' etc.

Simple economics would tell us that if it was an easy job it would be over subscribed. As it is we have a recruitment crisis.

That said I think there are people who go too far the other way and don't allow for any questioning (even well intentioned) of anything an individual teacher has done or even any polite questions about what they can expect from a teacher in terms of response to emails etc. If someone asks 'can I expect a response to a query over the summer holiday' it's fine to say no the teacher isn't working. It's not fine to have a go at the OP for asking a reasonable question.

so sick of hearing teachers winge classic!

If teachers do occasionally overstate how many hours they work, that would be because of all the digs about their long holidays. I can understand them being defensive. And if the holidays were really such an advantage, it doesn't explain why so many teachers are leaving the profession.

There are many other jobs as bad, many worse. But these post ask about teachers, teachers therefore reply.. and suddenly we have to accommodate Uncle Tom Cobbley and all before we can have an opinion on what we do every day
It's the professional equivalent of someone seeking advice on here about a financial situation and then soneone turns up saying why are you complaining? You're so entitled. Don't you realise how lucky you are to own your own house. I know people who live in cardboard boxes and are grateful for the shelter but you complain because you might not be able to afford childcare if you change jobs, oh bore off!

@Chosenone

Genuine question - which University staff have a long summer? I am academic staff and have 25 days annual leave a year. I am not allowed to have more than 3 consecutive weeks annual leave unless for "exceptional circumstances"? My non-teaching weeks are mainly devoted to the part of my contract that requires me to hit research targets (as well as, in summer, marking re-sits in August and preparing teaching for the next academic year).

royalalfred
Just some Uni staff I know. I have one ex teacher friend who now lectures and has been finished since mid June, but does go back mid August. I have a few friends in admin HE roles who are off most of the summer break too.

I am unsurprised to see a few posters say that the reason they like to have a go at teachers is that teachers 'don't have exclusivity on difficult jobs' etc.

I know that perfectly well. I chose teaching. Every time there is an opportunity to resign and go back to my previous career, move on to a new one or be a SAHM, I choose teaching all over again. I enjoy it.

I still don't understand why there are so many people who say I have a "cushy job" or "should get a job in the real world", as if I am currently living the dream, when - as I've said and many posters have agreed - we can't recruit enough teachers to educate their children properly.

Yep, all jobs have their pros and cons. I’m a teacher and I love the holidays. However I also love the job itself and I’m not sure that the holidays would make up for being unhappy in the profession. So I don’t think that ‘become a teacher then’ is the answer for anyone who resents our holidays. The answer for me is not to particularly care what anyone thinks about it and just get on with the job I’ve chosen to do.

@pieceofpurplesky

I completely understand how you feel - hence I left the profession

But can't you see how lucky you are compared to farmers, supermarket workers, accountants, childminders???

They would all benefit from a 6 week break. I think that's what gets people's hackles up about teachers and their constant declaration of how deserved their holidays are

But can't you see how lucky you are compared to farmers, supermarket workers, accountants, childminders?

That luck doesn’t appear to be sufficient to recruit and retain teachers though, does it? It’s a head scratcher given how lucky teachers are that more than one in ten secondary teachers quit teaching last year.

We do deserve our holidays.

Each job has pros and cons. If people want school holidays so much then they should get themselves a term time only job, not bitch about people who do have term time jobs and feel sorry for themselves.

I made the decision to teach. That brings with it a package. I like some elements. I don't like others. Overall I really enjoy my job.

What I don't enjoy is people thinking they're bloody experts in my job, weighing in with their take on my pay and conditions, and this sense that before teachers (or nurses and other public sector professionals for that matter) complain or offload about any element of our job we should some how grovel and make it very clear how lucky we are.
Jobs have pros and cons.
Most people complain about an element of their jobs.
Teachers seem to be fair game for pointless ill-informed digs probably because someone once attended school.