To think a lot of people are jealous of teachers' holidays but...

[Pengggwn]

...too bitter about it to admit that they wouldn't be teachers themselves?

Just that really.

I have seen so many comments and threads aimed at dissecting teachers' pay and conditions to a forensic level, people complaining that teachers are available over the summer to answer their queries, people arguing that teachers should be working anyway or claim to be working even when they're not (I'm not, at least not for the next month).

And yet, we are in the middle of a teacher recruitment and retention crisis. We can't recruit and keep well-qualified teachers.

Where are all the volunteers??

Yes i think they are, but on the flip side people are jealous of the perks of lots of other jobs too. Both my parents did shift work and when I went into a 9 to 5 role it was a real shock that I couldn't just bunch my shifts up to make my annual leave stretch, or pick up an extra shift when money was tight but they were jealous that I had every single weekend off and every Christmas day off.

I agree, I think dealing with a class of 30 children for 6 hours a day and then all the lesson planning and marking that you have to do outside those hours sounds like fucking hard work. I wouldn't be a teacher and I don't begrudge teachers their holidays one bit, from what I've read about teachers a lot of those "holidays" are spent doing work for the next term/year anyway.

I used to get this teasing from newly-acquired chap until he wanted to take me out for a drink one evening. I replied that I had report to write, and I could hear from his voice that he thought he was getting the brush-off, which I didn't want to do. So I said, "come round and make yourself comfortable (escape from rather hectic house-share) and we can go out later". He turned up, grumbling slightly, I gave him a cup of tea and left him watching TV while I ploughed on. At 8:30, I announced that I'd got as far as I needed for that day, so ho for the local! And yes, I'm teetotal, but can get seriously rowdy on diet coke......He was gobsmacked, as his job paid overtime! It later transpired that he had been a "bit of a lad" in his own schooldays, and never considered how tiring dealing with that could be.

Absolutely OP. I'm fed up having everyone opinion on my job shoved down my throat whilst simultaneously getting "I'd never teach/Oh woe is me, I have to deal with my OWN KIDS in the holidays"

I'm currently trying to put my DD off teaching. I wouldn't recommend to anyone to come into this "profession".

I think the difficulty with teaching is that nearly everybody had had experience of going to school so they've seen the public facing 9-3 end of it. Add in most people have had a bad experience with a teacher at some point, and many had a pretty rotten time through their school life so a negative association of teaching and schools.

There was an era when teachers could plan a lesson in minutes by using a text book, and mark quickly with flick and tick and brief comments such as "good". Those days are long gone, and the increased expectations and workload (data, meetings, working groups, double marking etc) is all beyond the 9-3 that people see. Then there's a very critical culture where the government/ OFSTED/ academy chains/ senior management are constantly scruitinising teaching staff creating a negative background and that reinforces peoples' negative assumptions about teachers being lazy.

Anyone wanting to teach because of the holidays or because it's "family friendly" is highly unlikely to make it through training.

Is the UK unique in how badly teachers are treated by government etc? And I believe they are treated badly. Do teachers in other countries have better conditions, less stress, more respect etc?

Plus we're not paid for our holidays! Lots of people have a long summer, University staff, many surgeons, MPs, Forces... I honestly think people direct their anger towards teachers because they find looking after their own kids bloody hard work!
We get one of the shortest summer breaks globally. I wonder if Americans moan as much?

I love playing teacher thread bingo when those topics come up.

Though seriously, most people I know in person aren't stupid enough to come out with half the nonsense you see on MN. Then again, I don't socialise with people who think black trainers with neon branding is the same as a black leather school shoe.

The holidays are a perk of the job. Like many jobs there are pros and cons.

The main issue with teaching is that anyone who has ever been to school seems to think they're a bloody expert on everything our job entails.

I will openly admit I’m jealous of their holidays, but not jealous enough to work 7-7 every day, spend 6 of those looking after tired grouchy children and have to lesson plan all weekend!

I've no idea how you do it. If I go anywhere where there's more than a handful of kids I feel my blood pressure rising.

Someone once said to me kids are like farts, your own are bearable but other people's are horrible.

I think teachers need all the time away from them they can get. That said I don't think nurseries get, what is it 11 weeks holiday a year? Also isn't there a shortage of nurses, social workers etc do you think they should have nearly 3 months off a year?

I have a few friends who are teachers and at this time of year I always have a few moments of 'gosh, I wish I could have the Summer holidays off with DC and not have to work or worry about holiday childcare'.

I considered it once for about 10 minutes but the reality is I would be a terrible teacher and would hate it. I also look at the other side which is that I can generally move my hours to accommodate sports days, assemblies etc. and I know my friends miss out on a lot of that. And whilst I work some long hours I know that they do as much as I do, if not more, during term time. I take my hat off to anyone that spends all day every day with 30 children - imo teachers earn their holidays.

Teachers don’t have the exclusivity of difficult jobs. That’s why people get annoyed.

^^ I fully admit that I would not want to be a teacher, but I do think that sometimes on Mumsnet, teachers make out that their job is the most highly pressurised, badly paid, horrendous job in the world - and I don't think it is.

I would also like a proper explanation of why teachers constantly say they are not paid for their holidays but their salaries are annualised etc etc.

I have just looked up the starting salary for a newly qualified teacher - it is £22,467 outside London. Does that mean a teacher earns £22,467 divided by 12 each month? Or do they earn pro-rata £22,467 according to the actual teaching hours?

This is not a debate about whether or not that is a good salary for teaching or the fact that teachers do more than their 'contracted hours' but I would really like a simple explanation of why teachers constantly say they are not paid for their holidays.

The DfE released a bunch of documents on the first day of the school holidays asking that teachers review them and tell them what they think.

Most of them are on ways to reduce workload.

I'm (in my dreams) deducting one week off my 6 week holiday as accrued sick leave for all the days I dragged myself into work ill. So far I've been ill for one week, it happens every year. Thought I'd got away with it this year, but it just waited until week 2 and caught me out!

I come from a family of teachers, and a lot of my friends parents were teachers too, other jobs weren't on my radar at all. Imagine my shock as a teenager when I discovered that non teachers didn't get the summer off work!

I'm not jealous of them but I am sick of hearing teachers moan about how no-one else could possibly have jobs as hard as theirs, without acknowledging that the long holidays are a great perk. I say this as someone with many teachers in the family.

All jobs have their perks. I do wonder why the perks of teaching are such an issue for people.

I think the holidays are all out of kilter. WE don't need 6 weeks over the summer. I would much rather a couple of week taken off summer and put onto Easter and Christmas.
Now all my kids have had letters from school wanting them do do maths everyday of the holiday in order not to 'regress'. Why have such bloody long holidays then?
I am an ex teacher btw and wold never go back into to it. I currently work as a TA and have seen many of my colleagues brought to their knees this year. 7 highly experienced staff have resigned to be replaced by NQTs, all innocent and shiny. Let's see how long it takes to knock that out of them.

Not sure where pp gets the idea surgeons get long summer breaks. NHS gives 6 weeks annual leave - surgeons the same as anyone else.
For what it’s worth I couldn’t be a teacher don’t think I’d have the patience. My SIL is considering it purely because the hours will fit with the kids. She’s way too flaky so can’t see her making it through training.

The holidays are a great perk, but strangely not enough to attract people to teaching, particularly when they see how much they can earn in other professions.

Only quite thick people make those comments OP and they can therefore be easily discounted.

My family are all teachers and its hard hard work. Without the summer off I genuinely don't think my father could have stuck it out (and he was incredible teacher, rated "inspirational" and still often approached by fan like ex pupils well into retirement )

God I took 10 of my 12 year old dds friends on a birthday outing and DH and I were on our knees by the end of it.

The holidays are also not enough to keep people in teaching. Retention is massive issue.

Happy to admit I couldn’t do the job but am envious of the holidays! A lot of my friends are teachers, they work bloody hard but do no more hours than I do in a week. Equally I get some great work perks that my teacher friends are envious of too.

I think people get a bit fed up of the apparently monopoly teachers have on working unpaid overtime...but then teachers also get fed up of being told they work 9-3 and have half the year off. It’s an argument I’m sure will continue forever!

You'd think teaching was akin to national service the way some people talk about it on here. No one forces you to choose that career. I'm not saying it isn't hard but some of you are like martyrs on here.

Teachers aren't the only profession who work longer than their hours but you'd think they were if you read Mumsnet. And if you're working 7am until midnight every day, that's on you.

In Ireland teachers are better paid and have longer summer holidays too. That’s changing now, but compared to the UK - teaching is a very hard job and some schools would give you a break down they are so tough.

We need to take better care of our teachers, better pay and better conditions. It’s actually awful how much pressure there is.

I’d be a teacher in Ireland but not the UK.