To be utterly depressed at this article and comments it generated in the Daily Mail

[Dulra]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5972845/Irish-PM-mocked-saying-ban-British-planes-airspace.html

I apologise in advance because I am linking a daily mail article and I know a lot of mumsnetters hate the daily mail and all it represents but this article and its hateful comments has really upset me. The article is referring to comments made yesterday by the Irish Taoiseach in relation to Brexit. He said “You cannot have your cake and eat it. You can’t take back your waters and then expect to use other people’s sky”. It was an ill-advised comment and he shouldn’t have said it. But it is no secret that the Irish government are getting increasingly frustrated with the lack of progress on Brexit and the lack of a clear plan from the British government to negotiate with. His comment was in response to comments made in Britain that Irish fishermen could be banned from fishing in UK waters next to the Irish coast. The Daily Mail reported on it yesterday and continue to do today. What they said he said was that leo Varadkar had threatened to ban British flights over Irish airspace. Read quote above that is not what he said!
You can imagine the comments this generated mainly slagging off the Irish loads of potato famine references, leprechaun references, stupid irish, stupid Taoiseach, he’s not even Irish, where would Ireland be without Britain, the south should just join with the north and become a part of Britain again, Ireland is the begger state of the EU, Ireland would be better represented by a potato. I could go on and on and on.
I am just so sad that people think this and think it is ok to say these things. Fine Britain want to leave the EU but why the sudden hate against the Irish. Why is every other country that disagrees with brexit and is fed up with it suddenly a target for this hate. What hope has the Good Friday agreement got in this climate?

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5972845/Irish-PM-mocked-saying-ban-British-planes-airspace.html

MURPHER you don't know anyone from Ireland who refers to the UK as the mainland you may know some people from Northern Ireland who refer to it as such but no one from Ireland, you would be fine if France stated referring to itself as the mainland in reference to the UK would I think not

The Irish bailout comment made me laugh. The only reason Ireland got a a bailout from the UK was because it was in the interests of the UK to provide it. The fact is the UK was in a much worse position, so much worse in fact, that no one could bail them out. Hence Brexit. And now, huge regret from most of the general population. British people (mainly the English since they're the ones who have forced the rest of the UK into this) are by and large informed by tabloid rags and are generally quite uneducated in regards to politics etc. actually believe that the nonsense they read is true. Its really not surprising that they have no respect for the Irish Taoiseach or Ireland in general. I know which country I'd rather live in.
Also it would be interesting to know how many of these DM readers have applied for Irish passports through Irish ancestry. I would imagine the answer is pretty galling.

Serena I found the bailout comment quite galling also.

Fair enough, our economy crashed into a wall...some of it due to our own mistakes in economy management.
Perhaps that poster has forgotten that the loan from the United Kingdom was part of a package from the European Union which we received alongside other loans from (in particular) Sweden and Denmark.
It's not as if we are solely recovering on the back of handouts from the UK.
The UK is getting it's money back with interest.
Ireland has tried to repay early (having successfully repaid the Swedish and Danish loans early) but there is an early repayment penalty in the UK loan.

@LastTrainEast
Your analogy is interesting...and yes, "starting your own business" is an interesting way of looking at it.
However, I think you misjudge the reaction of your co-workers.

I think it's more akin to starting your own business, but piggyback on existing contracts with outside agencies, expecting to still use the photocopier in your old workplace, continue to walk in and use the bathrooms and lunchroom, still draw from the company healthcare plan, still use the company's contact list and SOP's, still use the company parking spaces etc.

There is no "irrational hatred" but quite rational irritation from your "co-workers" at the degree of disruption that your resignation is causing and the arrogance of their former lunch-mate.

I can see there is very strong Irish feeling it is good for us to hear and understand it. However the UK is leaving the EU and we all have to look forward not back as to how our two countries can live happily side by side.

(If the French called themselves the Mainland we would just laugh of course here in the UK but we have got over the Normal Consquest in 1066 just about - long time ago now. Irish and British history is more painful for the irish and more recent.)

The 'mainland' conversation is hilarious! I'm Irish living in Dublin, know a mix of people from all over the Republic including people educated to masters level. I have literally never heard anyone refer to Britain as 'the mainland.

Xenia, you really are intent on coming across as completely pea-brained on these threads. If so, keep digging.

By all means point out anything I write which is inaccurate. I am hoping we can keep the amicable relationship between the two countries. I think that's a laudable aim and given I have English, Irish and Scottish ancestry I am not on any particular sides on all this (other than wanting us to remain in the EU). I have not found any Irish (or English) poster to be "pea brained" so far. It's a good debate. Thank you.

'The Mainland' thing is weird ~ just as weird (and annoying) as when people referred to people from Britain as English (even if they are from Scottish, Wales or Northern Ireland by birth)

You cant expect reason and sense from the Mail and if you read the loons who comment then expect to be depressed. My mother, dead for 45 years, used to call it a fascist rag. As you know, mums are always right. Get kitten block on your laptop it'll make you feel better.

If the French called themselves the Mainland we would just laugh of course here in the UK but we have got over the Normal Consquest in 1066 just about - long time ago now. Irish and British history is more painful for the irish and more recent.

Of course, you would just laugh.

After all, the UK does not have newspapers such as Daily Mail, Daily Express, etc. who specialise in outrage

Except Europe IS the mainland. We’re an archipelago off the coast.

Yes, very silly all this my island is bigger or more important than yours. Size doesn't matter. It's what you do with it that counts.

(Better not disclose I owned an island for 10 years......)

@Xenia given that I have seen you write intelligently on different issues over the years, all I can think is that your account has been hacked.

"we all have to look forward not back as to how our two countries can live happily side by side" is pollyanna-ish.
There will be no living happily side-by-side without some hard thinking, negotiating and compromise.

There is a feeling (in Europe and Ireland) that the British attitude is "Brexit is happening, and we don't give a hoot about the implications for our neighbours" . The lack of regard for your allies, friends and neighbours (which is evident on threads here) is what has European and Irish backs up.
To sail blithely toward a Brexit future would be just fine if it had no implications for your neighbours.

Seriously, if that's what the UK wants, then fine. Absolutely. But your actions have consequences, and it is, frankly, childish, to think that you can maintain your course without dealing with those consequences.

It's shame when I say I hope we can continue to live peacefully side by side is not even liked! I've never said brexit will not be complicated however and I voted Remain. So I am not the person to attract the ire of Irish who wished the UK had voted to Remain. I am one of the ones you should be patting on the back and commiserating with surely?

We certainly care about what happens to everyone in this process.

They are not my actions of course as I voted Remain. They are the actions of those who voted Brexit that are causing the issue. I would never have even had the referendum in the first place.

I apologise, @Xenia. My comments were a bit harsh.
You are right.
I am allowing frustration at some commenters to cloud my judgement.

There’s a new shitstorm about to hit the negotiating table anyway in the guise of Ian Paisley and his ‘forgetfullness’, the implications of which are potentially far reaching in the negotiations if he is suspended and then a by-election occurs. Varadker’s little outburst is now chip shop wrapping paper.

@Franzipanny11 do you think it will make a difference?
His seat is such a DUP stronghold- won't it just be musical chairs?

There’s still a 30 day suspension period during which his vote will be absent. No such thing as a ‘free holiday’.

BBC His suspension from the House of Commons is due to begin on 4 September. This will deprive Prime Minister Theresa May of a vote on key Brexit issues.

Ah yes, I see, it's a timing thing.
So it narrows her majority.....interesting....

Interesting indeed. An exploration of possible outcomes below.

Hope Paisley has sleeping pills and a speed dial to his chum Trump.

www.newstatesman.com/politics/brexit/2018/07/ian-paisley-s-suspension-raises-stakes-theresa-may-and-arlene-foster

@Xenia

The issue is that Brexit is ripping up a peace treaty.

It’s all very well to issue meaningless platitudes like “I want to live peacefully with my neighbours” or whatever. Well duh! Of course you do and of course we do too. Everyone in the world, bar the occasional psychopath or arsehole, wants to live peacefully.

That’s not the point! You don’t get to rip up a peace treaty and the talk about the need to live side by side as one big happy family. Actions have consequences, and a consequence of Brexit is the utter screwing over of the Irish border. Platitudes be damned.

This explains the ‘Special Arrangement’ for NI and rejection thereof.

www.newstatesman.com/politics/brexit/2018/07/i-m-tory-mep-hardline-brexiteers-my-party-are-destroying-british-union#amp

So P, how do you get to the conclusion then that I who voted to remain have any responsibility for the Brexit vote? I am not the one who voted to "rip up the peace treaty". I want us to stay in the EU.

Thanks for posting that article Franzi. It's very clear.

I'm going to repost it in the Irish border thread on the Brexit board.