To ask this man if this child is his daughter?

[wildsummerdreams]

I just saw a man carrying a child (she 3-4) against her will. She was throwing a tantrum and trying to free herself. It would seem like a normal scene if you have kids, but I could not help but think the worst, so I followed them and ask him if he was her dad. He stopped (good sign) looked at me and when he realised what I was thinking, told me to not be ridiculous. I asked the child directly if that was her dad, but she kept on crying. Then they wen off and he continue to carry her against her will. I watched them for a bit and took a picture of them just in case. Please tell me I'm not a total nutter and what would you have done or what to do if something like this happens.

The girl didn't have any shoes on and they were crossing Kentish Town high street.

My child had a tantrum of all tantrums a few weeks back. I had my 2 younger ones too. He never tantrums. But this was epic. Hitting shouting. If someone stopped and asked me i woukd have happily talked to them and actually be impressed they are lookong out for kids. And to be hinest i wish someone had as it would probably have embarassed him and he would have stopped. As it were friends and stra gers just stood staeing at us as i struggled carrying a tall heavy 5 year old. Pishing a push chair and a crying toddler following because his brother was being not himself.

I have often tried to help a friend in a similar situation or spoken to the cgild to try and distract them. Asking the parebt first of course. But most people cant be bothered. So much for takes a village to raise a child....

Stuff like this is why men want the kid to have their surname. Nobody asks a woman if its her kid

Sorry meant to post that I agree with the quote

As I said, my experience as a woman is that I'm assumed to be the mother, and a bully.

I'm sure that repeating, ad infinitum, in as calm a voice as possible, while still loud enough for DD to hear above her screams, "Stop" is bullying behaviour.

If it comes to protecting a child, I don't give a shit about equality between the sexes. More men commit this kind of crime than women. So they can expect to come under suspicion more often. End of.

Saying that a child might be less safe with their dad than being carried off by a paedophile is utterly absurd. Don't conflate the different contexts - both are arenas for serious abuse and they are entirely different.

We will never know how many times a paedophile has been discouraged from taking a child. From what I've read, there do seem to be times when predators, after evaluating an 'opportunity' decide it's too much hassle/too risky/too high visibility for them. A culture in which it is extremely risky because people always look twice can only be a good thing.

It's usually easy to prove it's your child. An abductor will probably not have photos of himself and the child in more relaxed situations, at different ages. A father almost always does. Or can put the child's granny/mother on. A small inconvenience and indignity for a parent in order to have a society united against abduction. My husband would be more than happy to do this because he is well aware that life would be living hell if anything happened to our kids.

Note the story upthread of a poster who was abducted for eight hours before being saved by a couple who thought something wasn't 'right'. Thank God for that.

The point is that this isn't what child abduction by a stranger (which is vanishingly rare) looks like. In the massively rare cases where it does happen, children are enticed away and go willingly, or are snatched up in a car. So if anything you should be more concerned about kids trotting along trustingly holding an adult's hand.

Stuff like this is why men want the kid to have their surname. Nobody asks a woman if its her kid

Rubbish, no it’s not! Men want kids to have their last name because historically kids were possessions of a man, it’s all about their ego, nothing to do with this at all. And why on earth should people look at women and men the same? They don’t behave the same. This is a problem of men’s making, it’s not women’s fault at all.

AlwaysTheEnd, 😂😂 don't be so stupid, children normally take the fathers surname because that is what has happened for generations as they want the family name carried on. Fair? Probably not but they don't take their fathers name because they want proof the child is theirs while out in public. How could they even prove this while out at the shops or the park etc?

FluctuatNecMergitur,

This isn't about abuse writhing a family or friend circle though is it? This is a different situation. If you suspected a friend/uncle/father was abusing a child in their own home would you stand by and do nothing? Even if you had no proof, just a feeling, would you risk that child's safety?

Happy to be asked if im the parent if my kids were kicking off in public. If a child was being kidnapped then imagine the different outcome if someone stepped in

YABU.

Children being snatched by strangers aren't kicking off and throwing tantrums. That would raise too much attention. Even if nobody says anything to the kidnapper, people notice when there's a child having a meltdown and notice their appearance and appearance of the adult. No kidnapper would want that kind of attention. They will either ensure that the child comes with them willingly, or take them when no one is around.

All your doing is making a bad situation for a father worse.

I understand your point and your reasoning, however if you were concerned and had a bad feeling, why did you just let this go?

You've probably hurt this man way more than you can ever imagine.

Oh piss off you lot! This attitude is exactly why people can get away with kidnapping children. If it were my child and you asked me the same, I'd have said "yes I'm his mother, he's just being a shit. Thanks for checking though" I'd rather 10 people stop me and ask than anyone feel like they can't and I could have been a kidnapper!!

"yes I'm his mother, he's just being a shit. Thanks for checking though"

Surely that's what a kidnapper would say as well?

And what do you do after that?

goosey that is exactly what kidnappers have said in the past. If you read up on some of the old cases, many kidnappers have claimed to be the parent/guardian.

Seeing as he was never going to admit he was a kidnapper I can't see the sense in you doing this. That's if you did of course.

There really is all types of crazy on MN isn't there.

the point is better to politely intervene than say/do nothing. 99.9 percent of time, there is nothing bad going on.

What possible hard can it do to say something or just hang about for a few minutes if you can.

For example in a busy outdoor market I saw a mum red faced and in distress calling a childs name. I just sort of observed the situation and the child was fairly quickly reunited with the mum.

I just hung about because there was an absolutely minute chance it might not have ended quickly.
No effort for me and no harm done.

I don't think asking that question achieved anything. It would be better to say something conversational and if you are still suspicious take photo, note car details etc.
Ds has frequently had meltdowns and had to carried off/ pulled along and I have people ask if they can help etc which has never bothered me but asking if I am his mother ( which could be lied about and he wouldn't be able to respond to) I would find annoying and judgmental ( as in why are you letting him behave like that).

I wouldn't be upset if someone asked me or dp that question. In fact I would be pleased that someone had bothered.

A kidnapper probably would say that all is fine. However, it's much more likely that 5 seconds later they will put down that child and get as far away as possible. Soneone who has been witnessed commiting a crime and therefore is now much more identifiable is unlikely to just carry on regardless.
If you question someone looking through your neighbour's window. Even if they answer that they are just looking for soneone and make up an excuse for being there, when actually they are planning to break in, they are very unlikely to carry on with that crime. They will leave and very quickly too.
So many thinking turning a blind eye is ok and even worse the right thing to do. I find that quite depressing actually.

I once carried my then 3yo DD through the street while she sobbed and screamed "help me, I want to go back to my mummy. Don't take my mummy away. I need my mummy. Stranger danger! Stranger danger!"

I was mortified. It was just after Madeline McCann and DD had clearly picked up more than we realised from the news and adults having conversations around her.

It did concern me that no-one batted an eyelid at this stressed woman wrestling a distraught three year old who was screaming for her mummy and ranting about stranger danger.

I think you did the right thing OP. I often wonder if the people DD encountered that day went home and turned the news on, just in case.

When DD was about 5, I had to take her to the dentist. She seemed fine with that, right up to the moment it was time to leave the house. Then I couldn't persuade her to leave. So I ended up walking down the street carry a large five-year-old on my shoulder who was screaming and struggling trying to escape.

I would have been embarrassed if anyone had questioned me, but would have thought it completely reasonable.

Luckily it occurred to me offer DD a trip to the shop to buy chocolate afterwards if she came quietly, and she agreed!

It may be embarrassing for parents to be questioned, but that doesn't make it wrong to do it.

A kidnapper probably would say that all is fine. However, it's much more likely that 5 seconds later they will put down that child and get as far away as possible. Soneone who has been witnessed commiting a crime and therefore is now much more identifiable is unlikely to just carry on regardless.

I agree with this. Though it that situation, I would apologise profusely and ask if he had a picture of him and the child.

If you question someone looking through your neighbour's window. Even if they answer that they are just looking for soneone and make up an excuse for being there, when actually they are planning to break in, they are very unlikely to carry on with that crime. They will leave and very quickly too.

Yes, I once surprised a would-be burglar. He gave me a fright but I think I gave him a fright too, and he left.