To ask this man if this child is his daughter?

[wildsummerdreams]

I just saw a man carrying a child (she 3-4) against her will. She was throwing a tantrum and trying to free herself. It would seem like a normal scene if you have kids, but I could not help but think the worst, so I followed them and ask him if he was her dad. He stopped (good sign) looked at me and when he realised what I was thinking, told me to not be ridiculous. I asked the child directly if that was her dad, but she kept on crying. Then they wen off and he continue to carry her against her will. I watched them for a bit and took a picture of them just in case. Please tell me I'm not a total nutter and what would you have done or what to do if something like this happens.

The girl didn't have any shoes on and they were crossing Kentish Town high street.

wow Frequency thats amazing.

I don't think she understood what she was saying. I think she just mashed bits of what she'd heard together and ran with it. It's also very likely my mother told her to scream that if anyone she didn't want to go with tried to take her somewhere she didn't want to go, though my mother denies doing that to do this (she's a peado on every corner type)

DD even tearfully told the woman in the shop she missed her mummy and wanted to go home. We knew the woman in the shop. We lived next door to the shop. We spoke to the woman every day

You did the right thing. I'm sure before James Bolger was taken, no one would have thought it was possible for two young boys to openly take a toddler and drag him sobbing through the street. Some of the posters on here would probably have poo pooed at the very idea.

It's always better to be safe than sorry, and any reasonable parent would understand your motivation, even if it upset or stressed them at the time.

It may seem extreme but all the TV shows interviewing people who saw those boys take James Bulger and how they wished they questioned them, I think you can't do it every crying child but if you honestly thought it was more than a tantrum it's good you asked

You are absolutely ridiculous. And offensive.

I think you did a good thing by checking.
Best case scenario = grossly offended parent / carer.
Worst case scenario = too scary to think about.

I think it was a brave thing to do OP.
Many parents would get offended if someone asked them that but they would be bloody thankful if someone intervened if their child HAD been snatched.

I wish there were more people like you to be honest OP. Well done - if I were the child's mother & it had happened to my husband & child, I would be grateful that there are still a few people conscious enough to speak up. Don't be deterred.

Someone did this with my husband when we were holidaying in the Lake District. Da who is 3 and autistic had an almighty meltdown and had to be carried screaming to the car. Me and my dd were about 100m behind. When we arrived at the carpark a couple were taking photos and watching. They were fine when I explained. Slightly irritating at the time as it was stressful enough as it was but probably a good thing that people are vigilant.

It's a tricky one given how spectacular tantrums can be but well done for going with your instincts. There was an attempted abduction of a toddler from my local Primark a couple of years back. My recollection of how exactly is a tad foggy but the child was found safely a mile or so away.

I’ve read this after the paedophile thread -everyone is don’t let yourDD near him in horrified posts, to this -where the OP is a nutter for querying a man carrying a sobbing child away. Double standards.
You were right to trust your gut instincts imv OP.

If anyone was guilty of a kidnap surely they would be more discreet about it, regardless of it seeming like a normal parent/child the child could suddenly have an outburst also what with the paranoia the kidnapper would probably be facing whilst committing the act and wanting to get to a "safe area" as quick as possible, they wouldn't go down a public street just like that, so would probably rush down a back alley, throw them in the back of the lorry, hide the kid and tape over the kids mouth to not draw noise or attention to them etc

Sounded like a casual parent and child on a rough hot day, I understand you were coming from a good place, you wasn't aggressive you just asked, it never hurts just to show your concern and let the man know that the scene worried you by your questioning, maybe it would give the man more thought on how to deal with his child next time in public realizing a passerby could get that idea... and if on that rare occurrence you spot something odd one day which others would turn a blind eye to, and is an actual cause for concern; with your extra attention to detail and scrutiny you would end up being that victims hero in that type of situation, don't let others on here knock you for that it's good you care when someone could potentially be in danger.

Double standards, I agree.

My dd told me once after she got back from her father's (we're divorced) that a woman looked at her and her brother and their different skin colour and their different language/accent and asked ''is that man your father? where is your mother?'' - I remember thinking that it was NICE that another woman's motherly instinct kicked in when she saw a scene that she couldn't immediately make sense of. I didn't think ''oh what a nosy cow''

Your heart was in the right place OP. Don't beat yourself up.

If anyone was guilty of a kidnap surely they would be more discreet about it, regardless of it seeming like a normal parent/child the child could suddenly have an outburst also what with the paranoia the kidnapper would probably be facing whilst committing the act and wanting to get to a "safe area" as quick as possible

Myra Hindley (a woman) snatched a boy from a fairground. Lots of people around.

The Bulger killers walked a couple of miles in broad daylight with a bruised and crying child (James), were questioned and allowed to continue.

Sarah Payne was taken very close to her grandparents whilst out with her two older brothers and a younger sister.

We can't assume 'oh well, it's so unlikely...' will we have to wait until it happens first?

OP, I agree with most here - you did the right thing.
But maybe that is because I am always 'the nutter' who intervenes!

I have asked children that seem to be on their own if they were lost, I have asked a confused old lady if she needed help, and I think in your situation, if I felt that something was off, I'd have said something too.

It is probably true though that most kidnappings will not happen in daylight with a man carrying the child through the main street etc etc however a good number of posters mention having carried their kids screaming "help help this is not my mother/father!" with no one reacting.

To me that is worrying.

I highly doubt he'd be making such a show of it if it wasn't his kid.
And younger kids wouldn't tantrum like that for a stranger particularly.
Yabu if that was the only sign.

A woman I know was in the shops attached to a tube station and her 4 year old was kilcking off, demanding an ice cream, to which she clearly and firmly explained no.

She then made her way through the barriers during which time her 2 year old in the buggy kicked off. She turned to deal with the toddler and when she turned back, the 4 year old had disappeared.

Station staff alerted, then huge police attendance.

Eventually he was found. A woman who had witnessed the scene over the ice cream went to a different platform, different line, and she saw a man holding the hand of the 4 year old. In his other hand the child had a huge ice cream. The man led the child towards the stopped train. She put her foot in the tube door and said loudly “excuse me , is that your child?” The man shoved the child towards her and jumped on the train. (They did get him).

THAT was an intelligent, quick thinking intervention.

Harassing an already harrsssed parent with no real reason to suspect him, and then not even actually checking (how do you know even now that he wasn’t an abductor?) or doing anything was just needless, pointless, daft and ineffectual.

Blimey,that’s a dreadful event.scrub the deck,truly catastrophic if the adult had taken the child without an intervention

*I highly doubt he'd be making such a show of it if it wasn't his kid.
And younger kids wouldn't tantrum like that for a stranger particularly. *

It doesn't always have to be a potential offender either though - it could be an aggrieved ex-husband / partner wanting to take a child, or whisking them away to foreign lands etc.

www.express.co.uk/news/uk/833845/Manchester-city-centre-abduction-attempt-Police-primark-arrest

(man tried to abduct a child in broad daylight, was foiled by a passer by)

I don’t think you did anything wrong.
Look at the amount of people who sensed something was wrong but failed to do anything, with the Jamie buldger case. They probably worried that they too would be accused of being a nutter or weird. Yet how they, and the whole nation in fact, wish they had intervened.

If someone wants to question me in public with my tantruming ds, they can absolutely feel free. Although he is the double of me so that would be assurance enough for most.

I disagree ScrubTheDecks - your example actually proves that simply asking "Excuse me, is that your child" can prevent a kidnap!

Reminds me of time about 10 years ago, was in shoe shop finishing purchase for my DD's shoes when my friend came in with her 3 DD's, only needing shoes for oldest 2 and youngest screaming in her buggy. Friend said she's so tired thought she'd have gone to sleep by now so we basically did a child swap my DD stayed to help her friends choose their shoes and I would push overtired toddler up the high street to get her to sleep and get the coffees in. Well. The minute we were out of the shop the incoherent grizzling turned into very clear shouting of "that's not my mummy! Where is my mummy?" In my head I was rehearsing what to say when challenged and was ready to let myself be escorted back to the shop under a citizens arrest. Definitely got some looks but not one person said anything. Made me realise that actually it could be really easy to snatch a child, especially a tantrumming one.

"maybe it would give the man more thought on how to deal with his child next time in public realizing a passerby could get that idea..."

The man was doing nothing wrong. How he deals with his child shouldn't be governed by what passers-by think.

Sadly, as men, every time we interact with a child, we are mindful of perception.
The awful things that some men do costs all men, and it deprives all children of a safe and sensible relationship with adult men - because parents simply cannot tell a normal man from a predatory one and have to teach children to be so wary of men. It's understandable, sensible, but terribly sad too.