To wonder what the point of cisgender is?

[Squatternutbosh]

I’ve just read an article where cisgender is described as “someone who identifies as the sex they were assigned at birth”. Is this an actual thing? Why is this even given a label? Surely if you were born male or female and you live as a male or female then this is what you “identify” as. (If you even feel the need to identify as anything, rather than just living your life as you).

It seems like everything must be given a label these days. The worlds gone fucking mad.

That is all cis means isn’t it?

Nope.

I was born female

This is enough. If at any point in your life you feel an unyielding urge to wear army fatigues, buzz cut your hair and or establish an entire Barbie collection and paint your talons fuchsia then have at it. We need to do away with sophistry.

There ya go. Keeps everyone’s sex biologically accurate AND gives a nod to gender.

"Trans identifying woman" is so much longer to type though, when you could just say "trans man/woman" and then "cis man/woman". Like I said people don't like being called cis so I might start doing that on here, but I can't imagine having a verbal discussion about it using those terms.

I also think saying "women" often leads to misconceptions, because you might mean only biological females but it will be read as "everyone who identifies as a woman" by many people. Also you might be talking about everyone who identifies as a woman some times when saying "women", but in others you'll be talking about just biological females, and then it gets difficult to differentiate.

I don't think it's worth the headache if I'm honest. If I was called "cis" in an insulting tone, honestly it'd be like someone called me "straight" in an insulting tone. Not nice maybe, but I'd be an arse to take great offence at it.

I was born female and have never felt I should not have been born female.

Well, yeah, essentially. Your gender identity is corresponding to your sex. That's really all that "cis" means.

I will not refer to myself as cis

But what is 'feeling like a woman'?

I am a woman.
But I wear trousers, have short hair, don't wear make up or high heels, have more interested in science than fluffy pink unicorns.

Also if pre-op transwomen (~90%?) really felt like a woman maybe they'd have a bit more consideration for the women who want to keep single sex spaces and single sex sports etc, wouldn't they? Because they would understand why single sex spaces are there and important.

'But what is 'feeling like a woman'?'

Exactly! I've never seen any coherent answer to this question. Ditto 'living as a woman' what on earth does that involve? I don't feel 'like a woman', I feel like me, who happens to be a woman. I know this because I have female body parts. It's nothing to do with feelings.

The funniest thing ive seen regarding this is a vague acquaintance who says they ate non-binary shouting loudly on social media about how Cisgender people can't possibly understand the transgender battle to 'smash the binary'

If Cisgender and transgender arent binary terms im not sure what is.

Or... you could try to understand (imagine) why for some people this has come about. It may be hard for you to empathise but you could try.

Well, you could try to understand why for some people this is offensive. It may be hard for you to empathise but you could try.

It's bullshit is what it is.
I will never use it and don't understand why I would ever need to. I am a woman. Female. That's it. I'm not going to change how I refer to myself to appease someone somewhere that I've never met for reasons unknown.
Fucking nonsense.

It's a dismissive comment. Never heard other than in the context of an insult or to close down a conversation.
The whole notion of gender fluidity becomes null and void when these pigeonholes are being foisted on others. Because I am married to a man with kids i have had this sneered at me in an lgbt meeting. I told theom i wasn't comfortable with their assumptions about my life. But I have not been back. LGBT is no longer diverse and welcoming. You have to divulge and self label.

I'm not sure: instinctively I don't like it. I don't like labels and I feel as the "default" perhaps I shouldn't need one.

But logically
We do have a label that means "not gay", ie we do use "straight" occasionally and I don't have a problem with that. So maybe we just need to use it in the same spirit.

If we accept 'Cis' we are accepting the role the patriarchy has foisted upon us. Women have been long fighting for rights to be seen as equal humans for pitys sake and I will not be part of any undoing of that. I do not accept 'Cis', I do not accept its lesser than men role.

@SmileEachDay cracking piece in The Guardian today on just that, by Hadley Freeman www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jul/05/dolls-dresses-no-proof-not-girl-pink-v-blue

“Or... you could try to understand (imagine) why for some people this has come about. It may be hard for you to empathise but you could try.”

Exactly.

Cis is a shorthand. That’s literally it. The fact that people can get het up about it astounds me.

Personally, I very seldom if ever need to use the word, because I’m not in a circumstance where it comes up very often. But for some people, it does come up a lot in their lives (say they are transitioning or know someone who is). Then it becomes a useful term.

That’s literally it. It’s not an insult for christ’s sake.

“If we accept 'Cis' we are accepting the role the patriarchy has foisted upon us. Women have been long fighting for rights to be seen as equal humans for pitys sake and I will not be part of any undoing of that. I do not accept 'Cis', I do not accept its lesser than men role.”

You are seriously misunderstanding.

No I don't misunderstand. You are confusing sex and gender roles.

I'm not "cis" anything. I am a woman.

Nothing was "assigned at birth". I was born, complete with vagina and absence of penis and the doctor said "It's a girl", not "it identifies as a girl".

I don't "identify" as anything. I am a grown adult female. A woman.

Gender bollocks can piss right off.

Gender bollocks can piss right off.

Hats off to that.

And I am gender critical but I don't have a particular problem with cis

How can you.claim to be gender critical but accepting of cis? The whole point of cis is that it reinforces gender!

We do have a label that means "not gay", ie we do use "straight" occasionally and I don't have a problem with that

Yeah but to be described as 'straight' or 'heterosexual' you are not saying that that this matches with that or having to accept any 'gender ideology'. It is a simple descriptor that you are attracted to people of the same sex as you.

I'm a woman. I'm not 'not a man who identities as a woman'.

'Cis' is crap. It implies complete acceptance of the gender roles society forces on people and nobody conforms to them so it doesn't even exist. One such gendered expectation, exclusively demanded of women, is empathy. I don't agree with telling someone to be unilaterally nice to their abuser.

It’s just made up, unnecessary bollocks.

I am a woman, woman works just fine as a descriptor, no need for a prefix.

Trans women are not women, they are trans women, hence the need for a prefix.

Yeah but I'm old enough to remember when "straight" was considered insulting by some people, the argument being that only minorities needed descriptors, ie "gay" was enough to simply assume everyone else was non gay.

It makes trans people feel better, equal and gives a tiny minority the power for a change to force labels on everyone else - not only that but it puts “trans” at the centre with non trans people now assigned a new description that only reflects the fact that they are not trans.