How upset is ok for nursery before enough is enough?

[Babysharkdoodoodoooooo]

So AIBU to think its time to say nursery isn't working..? Please be gentle- posted here for more traffic. It may seem trivial but it's caused a huge dispute between DH & I so I need some opinions before I make things worse by continuing arguing my opinion (if I'm wrong!)

Backstory, 13 month old baby has been signed up for nursery as it was the best we looked around and seemed to have nice staff. He's been for several "trial days". The first 2 were for half an hour & he seemed ok. On coming back, he was sat on the lap of one of the nursery staff playing. The third time, when I arrived, he was asleep but gasping how he does when he has gone to sleep crying (I've only ever seen him do it post vaccines previously so must have been very upset prior to falling asleep), third time DH was called to get him early because he was so upset, 4th time DH again called to collect him because he'd been crying solidly for 2 hours.

He's a very sociable baby. Has been looked after by various family members & a nanny without problems.

DH feels he will be fine & should continue going to nursery & doesn't want to pay more for a nanny. As of next week we are both back at work 2 hours from nursery so if upset, we can't get to him as we have done previously. A nanny who provided emergency childcare on a few occasions & whom he has been happy with has just had an opening & offered to take him instead but obviously as a nanny, is considerably more than nursery. DH says it is unnecessary expenditure and he just needs more time to settle. I'm not sure when enough is enough. For reference, he will be at nursery 3 days a week for 12 hours a day although thus far 2 hours is the maximum that's gone by before one of us has been called.

Am I being unreasonable? Does he just need more time to settle in at nursery? The staff say when he's gone, he just lies on the floor crying but when he is with anyone else, he is a highly sociable, happy baby. Friends are telling me the nanny is the right thing to do. I don't want to fight with DH but I want to do the right thing by DS. It's caused a huge fight with DH over the last few days as he is insisting DS remain at nursery & I just hate seeing him so upset.

Probably a Range Rover evoke

It sounds as if you are putting a materialistic lifestyle before the happiness of your family life. It's not even just the happiness of their child. It's the emotional future of their child. Fair enough if they had not option, but they do.

How will you know if he stops crying that he hasn't given up trying?

I’ve not read the whole thread in full but from what I’ve seen, i’d Ask myself these questions?

1. Could it be he’s picking up that he has to share the attention within a nursery setting where he’s been used to having full attention all the time until now?
2. could he have separation anxiety? If so, it wouldn't matter which setting he went to, he’d still be upset
3. I always preferred to have my ds in a setting close by in case of emergency. Is there a setting closer to your work so it wouldn’t take you so long to get to him if needs be? Good luck reaching a decision that’s right for you all 😀

Sorry, just read the first part of the thread and the OP's comments so I may well be repeating suggestions already made. Sorry if so.

I would say that firstly you've probably picked the worst age to start him anywhere as from what I can remember around 13 months is peak separation anxiety stage, so you're likely to have some problems whatever. Secondly, if you're planning a second child and you both have such a huge commute, I would say you'd be much better off with a nanny if you can find one who could be in it for the long haul, as you're potentially going to have a nightmare with childcare when your oldest starts school. Plus, if you have a nanny he'll be able to start nursery class if your primary school has one rather than doing daycare and then reception, which may be hard on him if you live in a village. I get that you're very likely not thinking that far ahead, just finding the best way to deal with the current situation, but it would be worth taking it into consideration.

Do posters here think 10 hours is ok? I thought 10 hours is fairly standard and 12 doesn't seem so much more.

My 18 month is starting nursery for 4 days, 10 hours soon - this thread has made me feel really bad!

User1499 yes that’s the trouble with these threads. People using anecdotal “evidence” that I did such and such and my kids turned out fine. I think OPs and readers are always wise to consider perception/reporting biases....

My MIL would assert that all her DC were “fine” with their upbringing. When in reality she has the emotional intelligence of a brick and emotional abused and neglected her DC. All her DC have emotional/mental health issues as a result. She was also a full time SAHM so her DC would have been better off in a nursery full time.

OP you know your baby. You know your circumstances. If your baby is not settling then I wouldn’t hesitate to look at an alternative (nanny/CM) especially because you can afford it.

Also OP these threads always seem to turn very rude and personal with posters making huge sweeping generalisations and insults about your whole life and personality based on a couple of sentences - I don’t know why people have to be so unkind but there it is

What I mean is, don’t let it upset you if you can

namechangeaskingprice

It’s all down to the individual.
I think 10 hours is too long, yes.
However someone will think it’s not at all and that their child was very happy for those hours

Namechangeaskingprice - Please don’t let threads like this make you feel bad. For some reason people love to try and make OPs feel awful for their choices (or sometimes they don’t even have a choice) whatever that may be. It’s very unpleasant. The likelihood is your child will be absolutely fine for 10 hours a day. I know it’s only anecdotal, but almost all of my friends are working parents and their children have blossomed in full time childcare (nursery, childminder even one au pair). They’re certainly no less happy than the children of my SAHP friends. If when it comes to it your child doesn’t seem settled, you can look at any other options then. Please please please don’t worry about things until you have something to worry about though .

I would say that what you are finding is that your lifestyle and your baby's needs don't align, so something has to change. You mention niche jobs - I think one of you needs to look for a niche job in the same city as the other, not two places that are four hours apart, and then MOVE to that place. A 12 hour day isn't sustainable for a baby, and school will be on you before you know it.

If you restructure your lives to shorten the commute time, your standard of living as a family will improve a lot, even if you have less cash, and you won't have to put your child through these long days.

Not an immediate solution, but a start (especially if you have baby no. 2 in mind).

Do you have to go back to work?.
If not then your child is best cared for by you, or your husband.
The amount of stress on your family by leaving your child for someone else to look after will be enormous.
Nobody else is betters than you in the eyes of your child for his care than you.

User1499 yes that’s the trouble with these threads. People using anecdotal “

its fact fact1-Nurseys are the worst form of childcare for a under 1
Fact - children do not play with each other only along side under 3 so sending for socialism purpose is a moot point
Fact-childminders and nanny’s are the closest form of childcare to being at home
Fact- experienceing multiple care givers for a small child is not good children need consistency
Fact - it is not a natural state for a small child to complete for attention beyond their siblings

Nothing anyone has put so far is hearsay anyone who works with children any social worker or doctor or teacher will tell you these things are facts sorry if it dose t fit with wanting to put a baby in nurseys but these are the facts even people who work in nurseys would concede all the above to be true

I'll probably stick to getting my nursery facts from someone who can spell 'nurseries', thanks. Also, I know teachers, doctors and social workers who put their babies into nursery when they returned to work at or before one, so it isn't a 'fact' that they'll all tell you how dreadful nursery is.

Also, I assume my post upthread was deleted for being too personal, which is fair enough, so I'll put it in general terms: being at home with a SAHM seems to be rather less of an unalloyed good if that SAHM is the kind of person who deliberately tries to upset, belittle and scare other people about their parenting choices. I don't think it's good for any child to spend all day with someone who enjoys upsetting others and lacks empathy.

BookatBedtime
“It’s possible for people to reply saying that a nanny sounds like a better option in this case without that meaning that nursery is a terrible choice for every child.”

You can’t have read any of the replies I was referring to. I can’t see how you could have read them and missed my point so spectacularly.

Plenty of people have said that this nursery doesn’t sound like the best option for this child (myself included). I’m objecting to the people posting variations on “all nurseries are evil and damage children”.
they don’t damage children but it’s well documented for children under 1 Nursey is not the petered form of child care it’s not ment to make mothers feel awful it’s to make them to take note

This is the list

Mum at home failing that
Nanny or childminder failing that
Au pair
Failing that Nursey

Their is no practitioner that works with children who will tell you Nurseys for under 1 is ideal

But Nursey for a 3 year old fine

A growing number of studies is finding raised levels of stress hormones in young children who spend long days in nursery care. The latest research released last month by the Norwegian University of Science and Technology, found that the cortisol readings in the saliva of toddlers in crèches was around 25 per cent higher on the afternoons they were in day care compared to when they spent the day at home. The children who spend more than eight hours in childcare were the most stressed.

I’m not sure why the post from Lisasimpsonsbff was deleted as there are much worse posts on this thread that are designed to be cruel but which have been left up. Lisa’s post on the previous page about having been in childcare at 7 months made me think. I was with my SAHM until 4 and she really struggled with that (very intelligent, loved us dearly but wanted to be out there using her brain). As a result, she went back to work when my younger brother was less than 1 and he went into childcare full time. As adults, he is happy as Larry / Mr Sociable / the most care free member of our family by a long way. I, on the other hand, get bad social anxiety and have had lots of mental health problems over the years. Perhaps I was always going to be this way whatever happened and my brother was always going to be the way he is...but it shows that putting a child in full time childcare doesn’t automatically cause them problems later down the line, and staying at home doesn’t necessarily protect a child from having those problems.

LisaSimpsonsbff

Playing the man not the ball classic trick when somone has no come back
You can’t spell ner ner ner ner

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/health-fitness/body/much-young-nursery-stressing-child/amp/

Mum at home failing that
Nanny or childminder failing that
Au pair
Failing that Nursey

I note that dad doesn't even make your list... So surprising, that.

ne of the longest and most detailed studies of UK childcare has concluded that young children who are looked after by their mothers do significantly better in developmental tests than those cared for in nurseries, by childminders or relatives.

The study on children from birth to three will reignite the controversy over the best way to bring up young children. It found babies and toddlers fared worst when they were given group nursery care. Those cared for by friends or grandparents or other relatives did a little better while those looked after by nannies or childminders were rated second only to those cared for by mothers.

every research into this says the same it’s not about judging some people have no choice but if you do have a Choice the peking order is clear

Just out of interest, on this official list of best childcare arrangements for all children, where do stay at home dads rank? Or did the scientific journal you took that list from fail to mention them?

metoo you started quoting what I wrote but it appears it went wrong with your quote/bold etc so I think you may have got my post backwards.... I’m not trying to justify putting my DC into a nursery. I’m a SAHM because I personally believe it is the best thing for most DC (it certainly is for my child and her personality).

There is lots of evidence to suggest that nursery care and preschool is actually beneficial for children from disadvantaged and neglectful backgrounds though so I think the nursery = always bad arguement is more nuanced than that

LisaSimpsonsbff

But I guess having worked with children for over 20 years you know more than me
It’s literally one of the first things you learn different types of childcare settings are better or worse for different age groups not sure why that makes you so cross