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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To find teachers a bit bloody defensive / precious

164 replies

SweetFanniAdams · 21/06/2018 20:14

Just find myself feeling the need to pussy foot around issues so as not to offend dc’s teachers. Not just isolated to the odd one over the years, but seems to be a theme that when ever I try to interact, understand what’s going on (with a view to support their work at home) that I get very defensive responses, like I’m questioning their teaching or decisions or something.
Bloody exhausting.
I’m very direct and find I have to spend a huge amount of time planning and thinking about what I want to say so as not to be offensive or misunderstood. I wish I could just communicate freely.
Is this just something that happens to me?

OP posts:
IfNot · 21/06/2018 21:02

Op I know what you mean and have had some teachers who are similar. And YES teachers can be very defensive. ..as evidenced by the responses on this thread!
Fucksake. You are concerned by ds behaviour, you support the disciplinary procedures in place,but want to understand more about the pattern of events so you can prevent future infractions and avoid a cycle of negative behaviour and consequences. That makes sense to me but you have had a lot of snotty replies.
Some teachers find parents to be a massive inconvenience, but all the good teachers I have met treat them like equals (usually because they are parents themselves).
Oh, and I have ADHD. I think I communicate just fine Hmm

FreeMantle · 21/06/2018 21:04

Teachers aren't able to say what they think though. They have to be professional, use the " appropriate" terms, maintain a professional distance in order not to be over familar.... you get the picture.

Its also hard to guess what the parents actual issues are. Performance oreintated , not bothered, stressed by the child at home rather than school.

73kittycat73 · 21/06/2018 21:06

spanieleyes SNAP! ed and farted?

MaisyPops · 21/06/2018 21:06

It sounds like when you are saying you're being 'direct' that be easily taken as 'pushy abd rude'.
I am usually inclined (in most areas of life) to think if someone keeps having the same issues with multiple different people, they are probably part of the issue.

With everything else it depends what you're asking, how often you're in touch, what your expectations are of them / turnaround for communication etc.

I'm not convinced you can write off a whole profession because of how you've experienced one school.

Nofunkingworriesmate · 21/06/2018 21:07

Personally a private school is no place for naughty or neurologically challenged child, I'm sure you had your reasons for sending him there but in my 25 years experience of education from both sides I would have thought a normal school with good sen department would be better? Private schools want/need absolutely outstanding results if your son is damaging that ( for others as well ) they won't be skilled, experienced nor want to deal with that. Sorry

Original poster
SweetFanniAdams · 21/06/2018 21:08

Ok so I meet with SENCO with form teacher but many off the issues occur outside of the lessons delivered by form tutor.
For fear of outing myself here - most things occur in games / PE where there are many many different teachers. No clarity of who knows about ds condition and no clarity on who knows about his medication which has v common CV side effect so a massive safeguarding issue for physical activity
But that’s another issue - hence the need for a protocol imo

OP posts:
grasspigeons · 21/06/2018 21:08

I haven't generally found this - I've had one teacher be a little defensive - i don't think she got what I was trying to ask.

I would agree people tend to get defensive when they feel blamed or under attack.

I always think its best to focus on the solution, so if you feel the teachers at your school are defensive then you probably aren't going to be able to change them! but you could havea google on how to talk to defensive people and get some tips?

Ekphrasis · 21/06/2018 21:11

Hmmm I think your query was very reasonable given the circumstances.

In a state school and an Sen School yes there'd definitely be a protocol and at least a pen portrait given to the various staff or even a behaviour plan / list of strategies. Might just be that School.

hididdlyhoneighborino · 21/06/2018 21:12

You're not the only person who speaks to teachers. Most teachers will deal with difficult parents daily, so I don't blame them for naturally being defensive. I always make it clear that I'm not criticising etc, unless I am of course..

Wishiwasonholiday1 · 21/06/2018 21:13

I'm a teacher in a private school and my son also goes there so I can see parent and teacher perspectives.
At my school, if ever a parent wants a chat then it's very welcome and we always communicate any issues with all members of staff, particularly games staff as often behavioural issues are more apparent in lessons outside of the classroom.
As a parent I would not be happy with the level of communication you're receiving and as a teacher I would definitely not be rolling my eyes at you!

Notevilstepmother · 21/06/2018 21:13

Would it be possible for you to speak directly to the head of games/PE if that’s where the issues are? It’s possible that the change from a structured classroom environment to a freer environment is the issue. Maybe something is happening in the changing rooms? Not knowing which teacher to expect could also be an issue.

PlateOfBiscuits · 21/06/2018 21:14

No clarity of who knows about ds condition and no clarity on who knows about his medication which has v common CV side effect so a massive safeguarding issue for physical activity
Yeah, I would definitely be meeting with the SENCO for that.

Also, that’s got nothing to do with what you said originally in wanting to help coach DS at home. Are you sure you’re being clear with them?

MaisyPops · 21/06/2018 21:16

sweet
I would arrange to meet with SENDCo, tutor and a representative for games.

The staffing is the staffing. If some are temp staff then they may not be able to divulge too much. Also, if it's a private school are the games teachers actually teachers? (I only ask because I have friends who said they'd never teach but they've got jobs teaching games at a prep school abd running the sport clubs / director of music but only doing extra curricular).

Go in seeking a solution instead of pushing protocol x y z. Children with additional needs (as you know) are differen and step 1-5 might work well for one but be a nightmare for another.

I would consider how you approach it. I can think of quite a few instances where parents have been really arsey, pushy, confrontational etx and I have no doubt they probably thought they were 'being direct' or 'telling it like it is'. The reality ia they really rubbed me up the wronf way and were being an arse.
If as a parent you have routine issues with staff, maybe your approach is the issue.

(P.s. I also say the same to staff. If you are always having issues when you call parents, maybe you need to look at your manner/approach)

RainbowGlitterFairy · 21/06/2018 21:16

Some teachers are very defensive and I think it comes down to a few things, personality, confidence and how good the senior leadership team are. A teacher who knows they are supported and is confident in what they are doing/their own abilities is likely to find it much easier to take questioning.

In your example there is possibly also an element of how much they understand about DS' needs and being afraid of being shown up for not knowing, or having done something wrong.

trinity0097 · 21/06/2018 21:16

The word protocol is where you are going wrong for one! It is a very attacking word when you ask for protocols!

So this is an issue nothing to do with the form tutor, games lessons in an independent school are rarely anything to do with the form tutor. Have you tired talking to the head of sport/games? Or the head? My head or I as deputy Head deals with things like this.

lilyheather1 · 21/06/2018 21:17

I expect this is exactly how teachers feel when they have to talk to parents...

Flatwhite32 · 21/06/2018 21:18

@SweetFanniAdams this definitely needs dealing with. If you can't get through to your DS' teacher, approach the head of the school with your concerns (not necessarily as a direct complaint about the teacher, but that you're concerned that your DS' needs are not being considered during PE). I normally hate parents going directly to the head about issues that can be resolved with the class teacher, but that's only if they haven't consulted me first, and it sounds like you've tried on a number of occasions to chat with your DS' teacher to no avail. I teach a child who, due to their condition, struggles with PE (which can have a subsequent effect on behaviour) so I have chatted to his mum and together we have come up with solutions to ensure PE is less stressful for him.

Mississippilessly · 21/06/2018 21:18

Yep. ALL teachers act 'defensive and grabby'.

If you go in with htat attitude no wonder things don't go well.

Holmesbird · 21/06/2018 21:21

This reply has been deleted

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APlaceInTheWinter · 21/06/2018 21:22

Would it be worth speaking to the head of PE? Or, actually, emailing the head of PE as I find emails are sometimes more effective because you have a written trail of their lack of response.Also, if it's a situation that merits you mentioning duty of care and/or safeguarding and asking directly for an action plan then it usually triggers a protocol that means they need to respond.

grasspigeons · 21/06/2018 21:23

I was going to suggest email too
or getting a friend for support

Original poster
SweetFanniAdams · 21/06/2018 21:38

It was the director of games I spoke to.
As a result of him yelling at ds over what seemed minor, but I only had ds’s side and knew there may be more to it. I didn’t want to undermine his discipline so wasn’t approaching it from that angle but was very much more from the ‘help me understand so I can support you and ds’ angle. I tried via email - got a very passive aggressive defensive reply so arranged a meeting thinking face to face would be better.
Not the case
Ds was diagnosed before getting a place at the school, SENCO were involved with the offer. It is not a hugely academic school and ds is not a huge problem generally.
99% of flare ups happen in games hence my wanting to get involved and communicate better with this group of teachers (yes they are teachers not helpers).
I work in sales, I have customers, I am very well versed on communication skills, I coach others on such matters. It strikes me that for whatever reason the teaching profession feels under attack - rightly or wrongly, and it feels like communication is difficult.
Again
This is not just around this example, this is a general view over many years having dealt with teachers in and out of private setting.
Some are great but many are hard work from my parent perspective. It may well be all me. Hence my post here I guess. If no one else feels the same then it must be me, but there are some others who seem to agree?

OP posts:
Original poster
SweetFanniAdams · 21/06/2018 21:42

And the medication thing is a whole separate issue, not related at all to the discipline thing but is linked to the need for a protocol imo
Not sure why mentioning protocol can be seen as inflammatory Confused
Lots of setting have protocols
As a way of simplifying situations and removing emotion from decision making and being consistent.

OP posts:
AppleKatie · 21/06/2018 21:42

AppleKatie
That is EXACTLY how I pitched it
In which case yes, those teachers are defensive and you clearly need to go in and speak to the head/senco possibly both.

It still doesn’t mean ALL teachers are guilty of this though.

Original poster
SweetFanniAdams · 21/06/2018 21:42

The school doesn’t begin with an M btw - can remember who asked Grin

OP posts: