To wonder how many of you are ready for hard Brexit, after today's Common's vote?

[flibbertyfive]

Because that's what's now happening, very soon.

PS According to the civil servants I know, it will be utter chaos - there has been literally basically no preparation for this at all. Because the bloody politicians can't make up their minds for what they want/expect to happen. So there are no contingency plans whatsoever.

Hope you're happy and looking forward to the chaos if you voted for Leave.

Hear hear @Truckdriver.

the big difference is it’s 1.2 million going to 27 nations 5050 million pop and 3,500,000 coming here adding to a pop of 60 million, it has much more of an effect on this population

User So why didn't previous governments use the powers afforded to them, noted by flibberty, to control the numbers better? We didn't need to 'take back' control of our borders, since we already had it and didn't use it.

That's quite aside from the numerous other arguments voiced here about the contribution foreign workers make to our economy and wellbeing.

Believeitornot The last time I checked Merkel leads the EU. Fact.

Your second point is about immediate problems in the UK, but that is NOT why people voted to leave. I did not vote to leave because of a housing shortage or a lack of doctors appointments (although it is a concern, and I can see why others did) I didn't even vote because of immigration, although it is clearly unhealthy for the whole country to be inundated with cheap labour, and for us to service all the cheap labour in houses and hospitals, schools etc. I have many european friends.

I voted so that I could keep an accountable democracy alive in this country. I voted to be/remain an independent country.

The biggest swindle in history.

It's just a shame the GBP didn't have the sense or intelligence to look behind the Brexit empty iconic promises and keep Farage and his ilk in their box. But no.

So we are facing a shit pool so a bunch of zenopbobes and hard of thinkings can have their borders back. And anyone not of white skin or just foreign will have a tougher time.

You've lost Scotland, you're losing Wales. Wake the fuckup, Left

The Tories did that, not the left. Voting to remove control over fishing powers to take to the EU as a bargaining chip did that. A Tory MP chortling that “suicide” was the best option available to SNP MPs in the middle of last night’s farcical vote did that.
The post Brexit devolved power group did that.

And where were Scottish Labour? Hiding in the fucking corner abstaining.

So aye, the left hasn’t helped, but please don’t pretend it’s anything other than the right that got us here.

Oh and before anyone accuses me of lying, Marion Fellowes MP is on Facebook, she has made a statement which explains everything I’ve just said. She was there.

A4710Rider

Errr.... I have missed something Scotland voted to remain part of the union. Wales voted to LEAVE the EU and aren't going anywhere.

Keep to the facts.

Power GRAB not group.

@A4710Ride - "The tories increased the wages from £7.50 to £7.83 an hour". Great, so all solved? no? see, nothing to do with immigrants.

Wait and see what happens with Indy 2 now the facts have come out.

Fuck me sideways. It was the last Labour government who made the country bankrupt.

Nothing to do with a global crash was it? Some of us remember the 1980s under the Tories. 3.5 million on the dole, boom and bust.

A4710Rider My apologies you were talking about the left.

Lua

I cannot for the life of me understand why hard working people trust the toffs to make good decision for them

Which is exactly why I want the UK out of the EU.

At least we can vote out our brand of toffs every 4 years.

LittleLionMansMummy, please tell me how in real actual terms, the gov could control EU immigration, and don’t mention the 3 month rule

“At least we can vote out our brand of toffs every 4 years.”

You were aware of the European Parliament elections, yes?

BrandNewHouse

Well I can only answer for Switzerland, and will offer a few things that a post Brexit UK won’t have.

1. A banking sector _ London is the financial capital of the world so we have that for sure
2. 25% of residents born abroad who arrive highly skilled and leave at retirement age, plus another chunk that commute in daily from the surrounding countries UK can have a similar arrangement with the commonwealth
3. No NHS to our credit everyone including those in poverty have healthcare in the UK
4. Low taxes UK can implement a low tax system
5. Close to their markets We are close to our main markets US
6. High value manufacturing industries we have amazing growing industries in tech and medicine. Exciting new industries that may replace manufacturing in time
7. Easy to set up and do business (apparently). It is the same for the UK
8. Direct democracy with an engaged electorate. The UK is now very engaged as we can see on here, and yes we would like direct democracy which is why we voted to leave the EU

Thank you for providing a clear pathway to future success of the UK outside the EU. Enlightening!

BrandNewHouse

100% agree.

Also:

• Bilateral treaties and other international (trade) treaties (=>not quite as isolationist as some EU/globalisation critics seem to claim...)

• More than two "main" political parties / power players

• A political system that requires said parties to cooperate. (And 7 "head of states"...)

At least we can vote out our brand of toffs every 4 years.

How did the EU stop you voting in UK elections? You also vote for MEP's.

The last time I checked Merkel leads the EU. Fact

Er, no. Juncker leads the EU. What are you on about?

And actually those problems I’ve listed have been given to me as reasons why leaving is a good thing.

You voted for being independent. Ok that’s great. But at least go and understand how the European Parliament works and that we do actually have a voting stake as individuals in it....

Which is exactly why I want the UK out of the EU.

At least we can vote out our brand of toffs every 4 years.

I don't follow your reasoning. We always could vote our government out every 4 years. Sadly, leaving the EU is for life - we can't just decide to have another referendum in 4 years when we realise the mistake we've made. Thanks for that.

Now we all agree that Merkel runs the EU and that is without question

Erm no

You were aware of the European Parliament elections, yes

The EP are there purely to provide a veneer of democracy, it's just a sham.

It basically does what the European Council tells them to do. We certainly can't replace the Council every 4 years, can we?

I can't believe that seemingly intelligent people have swallowed this whole fiasco whilst actually thinking it's real democracy. it's bordering on frightening.

Er, no. Juncker leads the EU. What are you on about

How do we get rid of Juncker if we don't like what he says or does?

we can't

I can't believe that seemingly intelligent people have swallowed this whole fiasco whilst actually thinking it's real democracy. it's bordering on frightening.

I find people swallowing slogans theY read on the side of a red bus frightening TBH.

I don't follow your reasoning

Can we vote out EU Governance? No we can't, at best we can change 1/27th of the council.