to ask how do private schools produce such "confident" kids / adults and how I can do it at home?

[dragontwo]

Ok, I have my reservations about private schools, but I recognise that often they produce kids / adults with high self confidence and self assurance.

I want to know how they do this, how they drill this confidence into them, and how I can replicate any beneficial aspects of this at home into my own kid (state schooled)?

What do they say / do / teach that encourages them to be so confident and expect success?

I know there are down sides to everything but I'm just thinking about good ideas I can help my kid. NB I'm no tiger mother and do my best to encourage my kid as it is already but just looking for ideas and general thoughts on how it's done!!

Just curious!

My DC have been to both decent state schools in the UK and private schools when not in the UK. Their current private school is very good and they are thriving. It isn't that the three r teaching is much better, although with a much smaller class size it is easier, it is more the range of opportunity they get. A lot of time is spent on plays, choir, musical recitals and a wide range of clubs, like philosophy club. There is a lot of individual support for handwriting, spelling and the like. The DC are encouraged to get up in front of the school and perform, there are art exhibitions of their work held in adult gallery spaces. Parents pay a great deal of money so expect a lot, teachers expect a lot of DC and the DC work hard to deliver this. I think the feeling of success following each event gets carried forward into the next one. Each individual DC gets a chance to be good at something which builds confidence. They are also told how great both they and the school are quite a lot!

*in state

I didn’t have the money for fees, but I could find the money for the extra curricular activities & offered that to my dc. They both did stuff outside of classroom activity stuff, and both come across as confident- one isn’t but you wouldn’t know

I don't think it's fair to say private school must = confidence. I was privately educated from nursery to university and I am not a social person, although how much of this is down to me and how much is down to my mental health is another matter. But I'm very awkward and dread social events.

I think private schools are more likely to produce confident people because they have fewer pupils and more resources. It is therefore easy for them to find a niche which a child excels in which might not be available to a child in a state school.

For example, I was always OK to bright academically (nothing notable) but I was atrocious at sport and I used to dread the annual hockey-netball-athletics carousel, topped off with a sports day and cross country run. I hated it to the point of being ill.

But I was then given the option of other sports, and I chose shooting - largely because my best friend was going into it. It turned out I had a real knack for it and I went on to compete nationally. Being able to achieve and bring home trophies in a sport of all things, which no-one would ever have expected, really boosted my confidence.

So therefore I would suggest finding what your child is good at and encourage him to take it up. Whether it's a hobby, a sport, or an academic subject. Everyone is good at something, it's just a case of finding what you're good at. If you're only exposed to a narrow range of things, none of which suit you, then it's no wonder you'd grow up with less confidence.

Being told you are better than everyone else and being given lots of connections with this

^^ that is not true!! I would never ever tell my son that he is better than someone, or allow someone else to tell him he is.

He is now at the age where he understands that there are people that are less fortunate than him, which only makes him want to help them. This morning on the way to school, he suggested that we could start save money every week until near to Christmas and buy gifts for children that never get a gift.

I have also found that kids going to dance schools and performing have great confidence or maybe it’s just a mask.

Also I wish someone would tell me where all these private school connections are (that I should apparently have coming out of my ears) because I've got fuck all!

gracie, I'm absolutely not saying it's the case with all girls' private schools. But, in my experience, there is a particular kind of ethos of 'don't aim too high, no one likes a tall poppy, let's all be nice to each other ladies, and not dent any fragile egos' that is instilled by some girls' schools. There's some research to suggest women underestimate their capabilities and men overestimate, and I do sometimes think that girls' schools can magnify that a bit, so although the girls may do very well in exams, they also go through it all thinking they're all frauds/imposters and about to be unmasked as such.

They get too taught at an early age that they are ‘elite’ and can achieve great things, they are the best and after being taught that they believe it and believe in themselves, you can achieve it to an extent at home.

I think it’s a matter of high expectations and learned communication techniques. I went to a grammar and so did my DCs.

My eldest said she loved her new school when 11 because everyone just wanted to learn and no one messed about at the start of the lesson.

I don't know about private schools, our dc's went to the local comprehensive. Apart from one of my sons who was very shy the others have always been very confident and, I think, have struck a suitable balance between recognising the authority of other adults and being able to talk to them comfortably.

Part of that I think is because of their involvement in the local church where they were given responsibility in accordance with their age/maturity. Also, for the girls, going to Girl Guides contributed to their self confidence and for my younger son his passion for music and performing brought him into contact with adults outside the family. All of them will talk to anyone in a social setting.

DC go to private prep.

I think having parents who are educated and motivated is one aspect. There are often expectations of achievement (or at least doing the best you can) and greater awareness of opportunities (both from parents and their children).

In terms of what the school offers, I think the school ethos is key. At DC's school there are very clear rules, high expectations of behaviour and a lot of work put into developing respectful relationships with adults and peers alike. What has always struck me about DD's school is that although the children are busy there is a sense of calm when you go in. The school work hard on developing resilience- children are encouraged to try new things, pushed to go out their comfort zone and told that failure isn't a bad thing, but that you need to learn from it. One example: DC scared of heights so headmaster encouraged her to join the rock climbing after school club- she now loves it and that fear is conquered. DC achieved a certificate and this was presented at assembly- with an acknowledgement of how hard DC had worked to achieve it. DC has learnt a lot from this and I can see a noticeable difference in confidence and willingness to tackle new things.

The children are encouraged to celebrate their successes, whatever they are- and this is acknowledged by the school e.g. sporting success or success in a hobby/activity is on the noticeboard and announced at assembly.

I think the small class sizes help- teachers have more time to spend with each child, allowing them to have more time to identify their strengths/weaknesses and then have more time to support them in developing their talents and also in supporting them to work on the things they find difficult. There are also LOTS of opportunities to find the thing you are good at- there are over 40 different extra-curricular activities/clubs, for example. Ranging from art/ computer/ chess/ latin/debating clubs to things like poetry or gardening club to LAMDA, choir, orchestra/wind band/string group/pipe band to sports such as tennis, cricket, swimming to climbing, hill-walking, sailing, kayaking, skiing and so on. I think if you are helped to find the thing you excel at- even if you struggle academically or at sport, that really does help boost your confidence.

DD goes to a very ordinary primary school, though she will be going to a private school in September (one of the ones people have probably heard of, very selective and very academic). She is hugely confident, articulate, able to present her own opinions and back them up, amazingly focused on her education and apologises to nobody for things like her academic bent and desire to know things and find things out (though there is a certain amount of ridicule of this, even at primary level).

Her primary school does quite a lot of the things that people from private schools have mentioned upthread - opportunities to eg show adults round the school (when they were interviewing for a deputy head it was the children including DD who showed him round, and DD has been doing tours of the school for prospective parents since Y4 - the only school in the local area that does this rather than staff conducting tours), opportunities to debate and speak in public from the earliest years, opportunities to interact positively with younger children (reading buddies, maths buddies, opportunities to interact with adults in positions of authority (governors' teas, headteacher's teas etc, though they don't quite run to dinner parties). So I think her school has given her a lot of space to start to become an adult and take on responsibility. It's not a high performing school but it is a school that places a lot of emphasis on the next step and preparing children for independence. Interestingly, because it isn't a high performing school it isn't popular. But I think they are doing some things very right. Even though DD's class has a massively wide range of ability, they are all being taught to conduct themselves well in the world and I think it will stand all of them in good stead. I think the key here is that children aren't just children, they are people who will become adults and they need to practise this.

As well as this, I went to the same high-flying school that I'm sending her to. I do have an expectation of being able to negotiate in order to arrange things to suit me. I do have an expectation that things should, generally, be arranged for my benefit and the ability to follow through to make sure this happens, I do think that I'm capable of anything I want to do, and I have benefited from the sorts of opportunities to excel and to take responsibility that private schools are good at offering. I think I have probably passed this on to some extent. I was always treated like an adult at school and expected to behave in an adult way in terms of being responsible and thinking things through.

We didn't have particularly tiny class sizes or the same tutor all the way through (I think this is an awful idea, what if you don't get on with them?) but we were encouraged to believe that the world was ours and we could do whatever we wanted with it - and I've tried to pass this sense of possibility on to my daughter. Obviously, if you take this to extremes you get Boris Johnson or David Cameron and that is not good so perhaps don't emulate Eton. But it is important for children to believe that there are no limits to their potential achievement. After we took our O Levels, we were offered work experience. The offers were things like GP surgery, advertising agency, Lloyds of London, publishing company, law firm etc - all interesting careers that anyone would be fortunate to enter if they were interested in that area. My friend from university who went to a comprehensive in a deprived area got given a week at an abattoir.

I don't really have any connections as such and that's not what I hope DD gains from her future private education. I just want her to believe that nothing is off limits and she can do whatever she wants with her life as long as she tries hard enough.

Also agree with PP that smaller classes mean more likely to be used to being active part of the class as it's harder for shyer children to hide away. And add in to that they are routinely expected to do small presentations to the class from their 1st year at school, working up to bigger presentations as they progress through the school- so they are used to speaking in public and learn to be comfortable doing so (on the whole, obviously some people find it more difficult than others). If they play music, they are expected to take part in lunchtime concerts attended by teachers, other pupils (quite a few attend) and parents; graduating up to evening performances at least once or twice per term.

I think all of this helps in the development of a sense of composure and confidence.

I can only speak from my own experience/ child's school.
Teachers are allowed to teach, and children are allowed to learn.
Teachers have more autonomy and children respect them.
Teachers have good working conditions, up to 2 hours lunch. They aren't always working and have a couple of free lunches each week.
The kids want to learn and it isn't sneered upon.

I taught in both comprehensives and a private school. The girls in the private school believed they were entitled to university and to have major roles in society. All of the above things already mentioned, they had no worries about money to go for whether want and no culture to bring money into the home. They also had staff and second homes ( about half) and huge amounts of tuition if they fell short in any subject. Amazing sports facilities and any choice of A level subjects. They felt the right to demand and so this is a pattern that is instilled for life. No end of public speaking, tours visits and speakers from very prestigious institutions.

Most of then were lovely girls but the idea that life would present difficulties in the form of money or opportunity was unthinkable to them.
If anything perfectionism was a problem, also very very ambitious and often unrealistic parents who assumed that a very average child should get an A*. Money talks and money buys confidence.

Gillybeanz, opposite for my school we were treated like servants, no autonomy and every lunchtime was to run a club. I am much happier in my state school I happily went back to. And I was in private for 12 years.

We have had DC at a mix of state and private. The state nativity in year one they were all sheep. Not one of them had a line. They sort of swayed (very cute mind!) and some sort of murmured the songs. Private prep nativity in year one they all had at least 10 lines and quite complicated songs with different groups coming in at different points. DS has autism and is not terribly confident. He would have been utterly lost in a class of 30. At the private prep they gave him the solo song in the nativity. He had to do all sorts of actions with it and had no one to cue off of. I honestly didn't think he'd do it but they built him up so much he nailed it. This was my kid who couldn't settle in a mainstream nursery, who was horribly speech delayed and makes little eye contact.

Every lunch the teachers sit with them in small groups to facilitate conversation and enforce manners/kindness. They shake hands on the way in the door. They are forever giving little presentations or teaching the class how to do something. The small classes mean there is no hiding and they can focus on helping each child really achieve their goals. There are no SATS/Ofsted to worry about so I honestly think the staff are more relaxed and less stressed. All of those little things add up.

I think things like scouts/volunteering/drama clubs/team sports all really help and are ways to build confidence outside of school.

I would never ever tell my son that he is better than someone, or allow someone else to tell him he is.

Im not sure it's always an 'active' thing though is it?

Really interesting question, and with the visits we've been doing recently there was markedly more interest and self assurance in the selectives than the secondaries.

ladtqueen today at 21.19 I like you🙂

lastqueen sorry!

I think it's the expectation.
My own experience as a swimming teacher of both public and state educated kids is fascinating. I'm very enthusiastic and when a kid first swims unaided (I teach under 5s privately) I get very excited. 100% of parents of the state educated dc (ime) are equally as excited, shower their dc with praise. 100% of parents of the private educated dc (ime) are utterly unperturbed, barely say a word to their dc. I found it shocking at first, now I'm used to it. Their thinking is clearly 'of course dc can now swim, that's what they come to lessons for'.
Likewise, I get presents from all state parents for being a marvellous teacher, nothing from private parents, it doesn't seem to occur to them because that's my job isn't it, to teach their dc to swim.
This must have an impact in to adulthood 'of course I can do that'

Cheery

That's a shame, I'm glad it's better for you now. It shows how schools differ, even in the same sector.

I do have to agree with the pp who spoke about entitlement.
I wonder if it's because they are constantly told how better / superior/ they are, especially the ss schools.
I noticed this in my dd and believe me she's been brought up in a wc family, with no aires? and graces. But she believes she is untouchable and so confident it's bordering on illusions of grandma.
If enough people tell you how amazing, marvellous, fantastically talented or clever you are, not only will it serve as a self fulfilling prophecy but the person will believe their shit.

I went to private school, but I wouldn’t say I was overly confident.

I’m intelligent, so I guess I have confidence in that and my own academic abilities, but I hate things like public speaking and meeting new people.