I’m putting this out there. High heels.

[Undercoverbanana]

I think they are ugly and make women/girls look ridiculous. AIBU?

For Docs to be comfy you’ve got to do a weekend of drinking your way through the pain with a lot of micropore :D then they fit for the rest of your life

Really? My one and only pair utterly shredded my feet and got binned asap!

I actually often don't like the look of them, especially the classic pointy-toed, high-heeled stiletto court. They look spiky and awkward to me especially when it looks as if the person is wearing them because that's what you "have to wear" with a dressy outfit.

However I do think some women genuinely like them, how they make them feel, and who wear them well. And I do like some high heels that are a bit more design-led and interesting.

But I never, ever wear them. I'm tall with big and wide feet and I can't walk in them at all, even if I can find a pair to fit. I've always worn flats or fairly low boots to posh occasions, and over time I've seen that becoming more and more common.

No one should have to wear them, and any company or event that requires them for women and not for men should be dragged through court - it's obvious discrimination.

But anyone should wear them if they want to, and I'd prefer it if we separated that from sex and gender and they were just seen as a shoe style. I think of Prince who wore seriously high heels with a vast amount of style and as a very hetero man. That's what we should be heading towards - all shoes being an option, or not, for anyone.

For Docs to be comfy you’ve got to do a weekend of drinking your way through the pain with a lot of micropore :D then they fit for the rest of your life

Seems almost as stupid as wearing heels....

Bertrand

I called "judgy" not because people are just questioning or saying women have internalised stuff courtesy of the patriarchy - Questions are fine and yes we have internalised stuff, including me -
I call judgy because people are actually being quite meanly judgy of other women IMO 🤗 There's no need, we should be helping each other not taking enjoyment out of ripping into each other for each other's looks - that's just here comes the new boss, same as the old boss!

For the poster saying it's hard to do anything in makeup - I'm fine doing stuff in my makeup. It's just a bit of eyeliner and mascara - it's not heavy or restricting my vision, I'm not allergic to it so it's not uncomfortable to have on and I'm pretty sure that I could go to the gym and work out/jump/run/whatever with it on. I'm not sure why anyone would think me restricted in any way by wearing it?

I agree with the other poster that said its getting ( started off ) unpleasant.

I have literally never seen a woman on Mumsnet boasting that she never wears dresses for feminist reasons. I have seen women saying that they don't wear dresses because they don't find them comfortable, or don't think of themselves as "girly". But not having made the decisions for feminist reasons.

But how does that argument transcend to only shopping in the men's department and buying Crocs? Can you see you are jumping to extreme assumptions?

No. I am asking a question. There are several posters asserting that women are not choosing certain styles for themselves.

I have asked twice where is the cut off point for the posters who make that assertion where they think a woman stops not choosing for herself?

I am giving those posters who opt for comfort over style the credit of making a 100% free choice to only please themselves . I am asking these posters where they draw the line that other women are not making that same choice. They are the ones insisting it isn't.

Why are you ignoring that and deliberately twisting what I said?

Most high heels look fab.
Sadly they are inappropriate for most occasions so I only wear them for going out. They immediately lift any outfit I'm wearing.

The ones that don't look fab are worn for the wrong occasion or by people who haven't learnt to walk in them nicely.
The ones that are unacceptable are the ones that are forced upon or even assumed as that's what everyone does, in any workplace.

"we should be helping each other not taking enjoyment out of ripping into each other for each other's looks"
I don't honestly think anyone's doing that, are they? Although somebody did talk about hairy toes in Birkenstocks......

I really miss being able to wear high heels, I can’t wear any sort of heel these days, due to having MS my balance is poor in flats! Gave all my heels to charity years ago.

I have literally never seen a woman on Mumsnet boasting that she never wears dresses for feminist reasons

That is not what I said. You have added the words "for feminist reasons". There are loads of threads on FWR where posters post about how they don't do femininty, don't own dresses, don't wear make up, don't wear heels, etc. And quite often it does come across as boasting- they are so high minded and see through it all.

The ones that don't look fab are worn for the wrong occasion or by people who haven't learnt to walk in them nicely.

Call me old-fashioned or whatever, but I believe a shoe should be made to fit the foot. Not the foot to fit the shoe. So any shoe, high, low, big or small that requires me to learn how to walk in it can get in the bin, frankly (sports/specific activity shoes excluded of course).

Really? My one and only pair utterly shredded my feet and got binned asap!

I'm still struggling with my one and only (girly, flowered patterened) ones. They are hellish though.

YABU.

Yes it’s an issue with all stiff leather shoes/boots. You really have to work to get them moulded to your feet, then they will fit you forever.

Sadly many of my friends in their 50's have now horrendous foot problems from years and years of wearing high heels. Many have to wear authotics, some have had to have by bunion operations etc. Wearing high heels in their youth has crippled them in their middle age.

kitten

I believe I asked you a question about why men are not expected to shave their armpits and leg hair but women are. You haven’t answered that and I would really like you to please.

To recap, you said that women shaving off all their body hair was nothing to do with a societal expectation for women to look younger/prepubescent and I asked you what other reason there was for the act of shaving all body hair off. Could you (or anyone else) answer that please?

Rather like Victorian whalebone corsets, or foot binding- it’s a useful identifier for idiots who have sold out to the patriarchy!

That may be the most ignorant comment about foot binding I have ever read. Foot binding was done to little girls against their wishes - they didn't [sell] out to the patriarchy. They suffered for the rest of the lives and then were doubly punished under Mao's regime by being labelled enemies of the people.

Sunny

So many of my clients have debilitating issues from high heel use.

Shortened calf muscles, lower back issues. Bunions, arthritic feet and toes. Terrible

YANBU. They are ridiculous. They cause foot problems, knee problems and back problems. We are not designed to throw out our posture in that way.

But people like them and they are popular, so they are seen as normal so you will get a lot of purple disagreeing with you.

They aren't the only ridiculous yet common thing that people wear. Ties, jewellery, fascinators. All ridiculous.

I do love a fabulous bangle though..

Ooh a Let's Attack Women Who Choose Differently From Me thread. How feminist.

Yes it's been a while since we've had one isn't it?!

If some daft women want to hobble their feet in painful and damaging shoes that they can barely walk in, in order to please men, that’s their choice.

I can't believe that so many supposedly intelligent women still wear them mainly due to the pressure from men and society in general.

All the posters saying they like wearing them are actually just totally brainwashed by societal expectations of what is acceptable.

It is a societal expectation that women should not have muscular legs but slender calves

Good god there's some utter twaddle being spouted on this thread

Please stop casting generalisations around.

I have muscular legs and one of the reasons I like wearing heels is because it engages the leg muscles and makes them look more defined. Absolutely diddly squat to do with making my legs look more slender nor to please men.

I live in a society where women choose whether or not to wear heels. I don't need to imagine an evening where women wear beautiful dresses and flats. I've been to many.

Ditto this!! Among my friends there's usually a good mix of flats, mid and high heels and no one bats an eyelid.

Also laughing at the anti-heel brigade spouting off reasons why heels are impractical and launching into "blame the ducking patriarchy!" when that's not actually what the OP asked. She asked if she was unreasonable for thinking they're UGLY, which is not the same as impractical or anything to do with misogyny or the patriarchy, but I guess some posters just can't help themselves can they?

and I sincerely hope that this Because they can't be doing it for themselves. Don't you get that? is sarcasm yes?

nd quite frankly i chose to wear high heels now and again, I can walk just fine in them

I envy you. I would love to be able to wear heels now and then but am dyspraxic.

I believe I asked you a question about why men are not expected to shave their armpits and leg hair but women are. You haven’t answered that and I would really like you to please

No, I never asked that question at all. Think you've got your wires crossed.

But I think they’re ugly because they’re a example of how women’s bodies are impaired due to the patriarchy.

Without that connotation I don’t know how I would feel about them. We will Never Know

kitten

Read what you bolded, I asked YOU that question (if it was someone else I’m sorry but I’m pretty sure it was you)