to think that Vegans get an unfair amount of hate?

[britchick77]

Having been a carnivore for 37 years, last year I did a vegan month to try and reduce my meat intake – mainly for environmental and animal welfare reasons. My health didn’t come into it (I actually still think it’s slightly healthier for the human body to eat meat). But it felt like the right thing to stick with it, so I have.

I don’t ever bring it up in conversation unless asked, I’ve never tried to convert anyone else, if I go for dinner at someone’s house I’ll eat whatever they cook (including meat). So I don’t consider myself preachy or extreme in any way.

The thing is that I get asked about it All The Time – every time I eat anything in fact. Recently I went out for dinner with a friend, ordered the vegan option, he’d asked me if I was vegan and what the reasons were. He then told me all the reasons why people should eat meat (free range is fine, slaughter is humane, UK has great welfare laws, chicken is better for the environment than soy, meat is healthier for us), and I put forward my counter arguments. It was not an emotional conversation, more of a debate.

He later told a mutual friend (who reported it back to me) that I had become weird and fanatical. As far as I was concerned if anyone was being preachy it was him! He instigated the debate, told me I was wrong and why, then expected me not to argue back when he said something which objective research has shown not to be true?

I don’t get it. Is it the pure fact of being a vegan that is considered extreme? Is it because it makes people feel guilty about their eating habits? Because they think vegans are judging them? Why do people care what I eat, when it doesn’t affect them at all?

CoteNoir
I made the parallel with born-again Christianity because it’s the silently smug sanctimony of those who hold more extreme views that irritates and the sense that someone is sitting in judgement on your opinions -the Christianity one is something I regularly seethe about in my personal experience. Equally I could have used people who are rabidly extremely pro-meat eating as an example. I have no issues with people deciding to be vegan, but I don’t have to agree with your beliefs about it. I do agree with some of them, especially the risks about leaving the EU, but I think these issues are more nuanced than that. Great, act on your beliefs, but don’t feel ‘silently sad’ if your nearest and dearest actually use their critical thinking skills to decide for themselves that they have a different opinion. Have a lovely day.

Agree with @Doh9899 you're not a vegan, why give yourself that label if you eat meat when it suits you?

@kpo58
I think what winds people up is when vegans preach and pretend that they are eithical. Pretty much nothing humans do is ethical with no environmental impact.

Totally agree. But I still think it's better to do something than nothing. I don't believe you have to be 100% perfect or give up completely.

YANBU.

Omnivores spend way more time complaining that vegans are preachy than vegans do preaching. It’s just an example of a group in our society where it’s seen as funny to rip them to shreds/marginalise them. Then it gains traction with all these copy pasta shit vegan ‘jokes’ and before you know it everyone and their dog believes vegans are preachy dickheads, when a tiny bit of thought would help them realise that they have no idea about the vegans they know who haven’t had cause to mention it. Complete logic fail. Anti vegan ‘jokes’ always mark the joker to be a bit dim ime.

I am another vote for its preachy people that annoy me

Whether vegan ,meat eater , ex smoker , Shaolin monk conversion ....i don't care but don't sodding get judgey and bang the drum....people make their own choices and provided they are not directly harming you (if a vegan throws a cabbage at me or a meat eater throws a cow at me I get to complain) then leave them the hell alone.

This includes people who say , post or type

"Please please can I ask you *delete as appropriate not to risk your health/consider the dangers / don't take the chance...." on the grounds that am an adult early middle aged woman who doesn't need to be patronised, if I don't realise wrestling a bear is dangerous then let Darwin's law take it's course

Basically asses are asses whatever they consume and respectful people are respectful people whatever they choose to consume

I was amazed to see a famously militant vegan make up brand owner being told all of it was worth nothing because she fell pregnant and apparently there are anti natalist vegans who believe you should not reproduce.....proof therein that's got nothing to do with veganism they are just judgey asses (I'm reasonably sure most vegans want nothing to do with that lot)

There are other ways of not causing a fuss at dinner parties.

Or if you stop calling yourself a vegan, you’ll get even less fuss.

To those who have said I'm not a vegan, you're right. I actually don't like the word and wish there was a different word for someone who is a 99% vegan but eats meat/dairy very occasionally when the alternative would be to be very rude or waste food.

For clarity, it's very rare. The last time I knowingly ate meat was in February when I went to lunch with some friends. They hadn't cooked specially for me, but I popped in as I was in the area and they invited me to stay to lunch. A couple of weeks ago my mum made me some toast and buttered it unthinkingly. I ate it because the alternative was to throw it away (which would have been worse, IMO).

I actually don't like the word and wish there was a different word for someone who is a 99% vegan but eats meat/dairy very occasionally when the alternative would be to be very rude or waste food.

There is-an omnivore.

I actually don't like the word and wish there was a different word for someone who is a 99% vegan but eats meat/dairy very occasionally when the alternative would be to be very rude or waste food.
There is-an omnivore.

if you stop calling yourself a vegan, you’ll get even less fuss.

I'll also get served meat and dairy.

The only time I 'call myself' a vegan is when I need to describe my dietary preferences to someone. The word 'vegan' neatly describes what I am comfortable eating (and I don't think the waiter cares whether I ate some lamb in February and a slice of toast with butter in May).

I don't feel a need to label myself to fit into some kind of tribe so I don't describe myself as a vegan in any other scenario, it just doesn't come up. If someone asks me if I'm vegan I usually say "yes, 99% of the time", and leave it at that unless they press me for more info.

I'll also get served meat and dairy.

Why does that matter if you’ll eat it not to be rude or waste food?

I have no issue with anyone who is vegan, i do have issues with people (be they vegan or not) preaching to me and feeling superior.

I know a few people who are vegan, only one of them gets on my nerves because she is constantly preaching, her facebook timeline is full of it along with photos of her very unappealing food (not because it's vegan but because it is generally brown and horrible looking).

MissMarplesKnitting

"Besides which, I once pulled one up on bring preachy by pointing out the hypocrisy of saving animals but wearing sweat shop produced primark clothing. No comments since...."

Sorry to be thick but what's the connection?

Why does that matter if you’ll eat it not to be rude or waste food?

Because my strong preference is to avoid it. Just not at any cost.

Sorry - that grin was to purple

lighthouse - it’s the ethical element- ie not eating or wearing animal derived products or using toiletries tested on animals but consuming or using products grown or manufactured through practices not far off human slavery

Sorry to be thick but what's the connection?
I guess it’s about having such strong views about the conditions animals are kept in that you believe they shouldn’t be farmed at all, but not caring about humans living and working in appalling conditions.

@aridane

Exactly, I find a lot of the preachy vegans seem pretty anti human though so they probably aren't as arsed

But lots of people care about animals and don't care about humans.

I don't shop at Primark btw, just puzzled at the connection.

Haven’t RTFT but you’re not technically vegan if you will eat meat .

I believe many vegans fuel the fire by perpetually ramming their beliefs down anyone who will listen’s neck. In turn, it can make meat eaters automatically defensive when they realise they are being faced with a vegan. I say this as a former vegan and long term vegetarian.

It seems as though this all comes down to a belief that vegans specifically consider themselves morally superior and others want to bring them back down to earth by pointing out their hypocrisy (e.g. wearing a wool jumper)?

I do find it interesting that this doesn't seem to apply to any other moral standards people try to hold themselves to:

For instance in a perfect world I would:

• never snap at my family
• actively avoid all gossip at work
• use my car less and use public transport/cycle instead
• visit my mum every week and help her with chores
• avoid meat and dairy

I try to do these things always, but fail pretty often. But it seems like the only one that bothers people when the mark is missed is the last one.

My sister and her boyfriend are vegans. Sometimes the preachiness is a bit too much. My son got chicken pox a while back. My sister's advice was to not let him have any processed food and to give him lots of vegetables and smoothies.. !!.. so what the hell does that mean? Is she saying if my son had a healthier diet he wouldn't have got chicken pox? Will eating fruit and veg magic his pox away? I was so annoyed I looked up best diet for kids that get pox and read an articles that said protein.. milk, eggs, meat... So she's talking bollocks!

It's just annoying that anything that happens comes down to diet to them. If my son is sick according to my sister it's because he eats meat and not enough fruit and veg! So it gets irritating.

Also the tactics to try and convert. Comments to my son like "how do you feel about eating chicken?" When we r at a farm looking at chickens. My responses "how did you feel about eating chicken at his age?" She only became a vegan when she got with her boyfriend, had no problem with eating meat before this!

Also they say stuff to us meat eaters like "meat gives you cancer", "people die young from eating meat". My mum hit back at one of these comments with "well you drink smoothies everyday with lots of fruit in, that can cause diabetes" this upset my sister's boyfriend and my sister said my mum was rude saying this... Err hello, we have to put up with being told we are going to die of cancer etc etc! They are the rude ones.

Sorry, that's turned into a bit of a rant. I guess I am venting cos dynamics have changed a lot since they became vegans, restaurants have to be vegan friendly for family get togethers no more steak places or rib/pork places. Sad times!

As a vegetarian, I've had both vegans and meat-eaters try to convert me. 😂
Mostly meat-eaters at first, when even being vegetarian wasn't so mainstream. The worst however, was a vegan who had access to my postal address (through a society I belonged to) and signed me up to receiving loads of pro-vegan post. When I rang the society to complain, she was arguing with me and trying to convert me on the phone! I was a bit shaken tbh and cancelled my subscription.

@BritChick77

Many vegans ARE preachy and pious, and the fake ones are the worst. (And some of them claiming to be vegans ARE fake, as they sneakily eat dairy when no-one is around.)

People get sick of the blathering about veganism on instagram and facebook and twitter, every third post is about veganism, they post animal-abuse videos, they slag off meat eaters, and the 'fact' they are a vegan is in every mini bio of theirs online.

They ramble on and on about veganism, they are boring and pious, and they think they are better than meat eaters, and some of them sneakily eat cheese and drink milk (and eat food made with eggs and milk) on the sly. They also seem oblivious to how morbidly dangerous 'veganism' is if it's not done correctly.

And don't even get me started on people raising their children as vegans. You can actually get prosecuted for that in some countries, as it's classed as a form of child abuse, because of the damage you can do to a child.

All vegans claim that they NEVER preach, they NEVER go on about it, they NEVER act in a pious manner, they never judge, and they never post anything about it. And yet every single person claiming to be a vegan that I know does ALL of the above.

So this is why they are often universally loathed. There are a small number of genuinely nice ones who don't preach and are pretty quiet about it. But they are the exception rather than the rule.

Hope that helps.