to think that Vegans get an unfair amount of hate?

[britchick77]

Having been a carnivore for 37 years, last year I did a vegan month to try and reduce my meat intake – mainly for environmental and animal welfare reasons. My health didn’t come into it (I actually still think it’s slightly healthier for the human body to eat meat). But it felt like the right thing to stick with it, so I have.

I don’t ever bring it up in conversation unless asked, I’ve never tried to convert anyone else, if I go for dinner at someone’s house I’ll eat whatever they cook (including meat). So I don’t consider myself preachy or extreme in any way.

The thing is that I get asked about it All The Time – every time I eat anything in fact. Recently I went out for dinner with a friend, ordered the vegan option, he’d asked me if I was vegan and what the reasons were. He then told me all the reasons why people should eat meat (free range is fine, slaughter is humane, UK has great welfare laws, chicken is better for the environment than soy, meat is healthier for us), and I put forward my counter arguments. It was not an emotional conversation, more of a debate.

He later told a mutual friend (who reported it back to me) that I had become weird and fanatical. As far as I was concerned if anyone was being preachy it was him! He instigated the debate, told me I was wrong and why, then expected me not to argue back when he said something which objective research has shown not to be true?

I don’t get it. Is it the pure fact of being a vegan that is considered extreme? Is it because it makes people feel guilty about their eating habits? Because they think vegans are judging them? Why do people care what I eat, when it doesn’t affect them at all?

I agree with you OP. And I'm an enthusiastic meat eater. In my experience, vegans are no more genuinely preachy than other groups.

I have two theories as to why people are so harsh on vegans. Firstly, the ethical position for veganism is hard to argue with and people find the cognitive dissonance hard to deal with. So even the smallest justification for the position is interpreted as preaching.

Secondly, meat eating is a big part of how humans show hospitality (at a subconscious level at least). People struggle when that's taken away from them.

I guess the only thing to do is ignore the negativity.

CoteNoir

I hold meat eaters that preach with the same contempt that I do vegans that preach. In fact the same contempt as anyone that preaches at me.

The ones who take a break from it when on holiday because they're somwqhere very meat or dairy focussed
So you just expect them to starve when they can't be catered for or cause a huge embarrassing fuss in restaurants?

The ones who have cats or dogs (thus supporting the very worst end of the meat industry)
That's just nonsense cats and dogs have to eat meat. Humans don't have to.

I’m not a vegan or a vegetarian and I don’t understand the vegan hate either. It is objectively better for the environment to be vegan and we should be more honest with ourselves about where our meat and animal products come from. I think people get defensive because deep down they know that eating meat is a bit of a shitty selfish thing to do and they don’t like being reminded about it.
I admire vegans because they’re prepared to put the work in, unlike me who knows I shouldn’t be eating meat but does it because it’s easier.

Overcome across more peachy meat eaters than veggies/vegans tbh.

The raised eyebrows and "what do you eat at Christmas?" I had one dude berate me "you do know you're missing eight essential amino acids in your diet" I mean that's just wrong.
Ppl who tell me they think it's cruelty to raise your child vegetarian.
Always after basically finding out I'm a vegetarian without me actually saying anything about it.

Then again maybe preachy vegetarians don't try it on me because I'm already vegetarian....

*I've come across more preachy....

Fwiw I know quite a few people who I never realised were vegan or vegetarian until we ate together because they had never brought it up before.

I don't know any vegans or vegetarians. Therefore they don't get any hate from me. I don't know why people don't just mind their own business. It's rude to make judgements on what other people eat. As for the OP. The less said the better.

I'd love to be vegan. I tried it for a week, I got 'Oatley' Milk substitute thingy but completely forgot when I started grating generous amounts of Parmesan over my Spaghetti only realised once I was eating it. Then realised I couldn't do it.

I'm a lifelong vegan as are my children and husband. We have no friends or family which suits us as we are very strict and I couldn't be friends with someone who eats meat personally. But I don't talk
about it or get into discussions, I have people I have small talk with at the school etc but would never invite them into my house. It helps that I'm a huge introvert .

Oops sorry OP. Ignore the last bit. It was meant for the vegetarian daughter thread.

Not one single thing described here is hate. We shouldn't devalue words. Real hate would result in violence or screaming, not an irritating conversation or mild criticism or weak joke.

"I've just started a thread about veganism, but I never, ever, ever, talk about veganism"

Hmmm.

It is also a blindingly hypocritical that meat eaters are permitted to talk endlessly about their reasons for justifying eating meat, Yup! But I try not to unless asked or challenged, or am responding to a different pov or, occasionally the downright lies organisations such a PETA spout!

Truth probably is that we choose whether or not to eat meat based on our own sense of right and wrong - and nobody responds well when their innate sense or rightness is challenged!

meat eaters are permitted to talk endlessly about their reasons for eating meat

Wut ? when would be the occasion that a meat eater would do this just off their own bat ? ? They don’t need to, it’s the norm. It could only be when a poor persecuted vegan is ‘ daring to join in a conversation ‘ ( yeah, right ) and the meat eater is being asked to defend their choices.

I have zero problem with someone being a vegan - in fact I’m thrilled, because I have a dairy intolerance and the current fashionability of veganism has been very helpful to me being able to access non dairy foods when out. And much of it is delicious.

I was vegetarian for many years for ethical reasons that i subscribed to at the time - it was much, much harder then as it was virtually to get interesting ( or indeed edible ) foods, everything had to be made from scratch and omelette was often the only default offered. But I don’t remember people being unpleasant to me about it nor did I give my reasons for not eating or preparing meat unless specifically asked.

I changed my mind quite suddenly, on a holiday when something meaty was being offered - don’t not know why but it was my choice.

Proselytlising a particular viewpoint is is off putting for many people - it may be more effective to lead by example or by your purchasing power, as it happening with the increasing availability and visibility of vegan options.

Exactly why I eat venison. I despise factory farming and eat no dairy.or meat otherwise, but have little issue with my brother shooting a deer and us eating it. It's not a fucking religion. Its just food ffs. People are mad.

Well my pals are obsessed with making other's vegan.

I am 7.5 stone I eat healthy but I am a fussy eater. I ordered chicken on our last meal out, they banged on about the chicken, how the male chicks were slaughtered. I can not eat chickens, now in my tea I offer them almond milk when I get cows milk I have to hear all about antibiotics and puss. It is as if they are not near almost radicalised.

Ive no issues with their choices but mind you own business in mine.

Yanbu.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine I’m vegan and teetotal too (vegan for the animals, teetotal part is recent and for health/ fertility) as is my husband and we have plenty of fun and no hangovers! Only downside is judgy people but thankfully I don’t meet many!

I also use my lack of meat and dairy eating to argue why I don't feel guilty about my 5.6l engined car 😀 a family of 5 meat eaters vs my family, I win!

But every time I talk about being vegan on this forum it turns into a bun fight and I’m personally attached, kind of proving OPs point. So that’s all I’m saying on it.

But I think there's a middle ground between that and eating meat 3 times a day.

Of course there’s a middle ground.

But calling yourself vegan while still eating meat isn’t it.

I think what winds people up is when vegans preach and pretend that they are eithical. Pretty much nothing humans do is ethical with no environmental impact.

Factory farming, mega fields (environmental deserts), cotton growing, most types of fishing, making synthetic clothes (mostly from oil based products), flying food between countries, heating mega greenhouses, none of these are good for the environment and that's before you get to how badly the workers are treated.

It does worry me when we leave the EU and potentially start importing food with dubious ways of producing meat and growing crops.

If you eat meat when someone cooks you it then you're not a vegan so stop calling yourself that

@LaurieMarlow
Firstly, the ethical position for veganism is hard to argue with and people find the cognitive dissonance hard to deal with. So even the smallest justification for the position is interpreted as preaching

I think you've hit the nail on the head. That conflict is definitely something I have felt - and still do, but it's shifted now to trying to balance the desire not to eat animal products with the desire to not be a total pain in the arse at dinner parties...