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AIBU?

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Original poster

To assume if you are anti-abortion, you are...

431 replies

Hamandcheesebaguette · 26/05/2018 20:24

...pro a full, complete and comprehensive government benefits system to fund mothers for at least the first 5 years of her child's life?

I'll tell my story, it's not particularly interesting or traumatic, but had I not had access to a safe abortion at 6 weeks then I honest to god don't know how i would have not have ended up homeless or starving.

When I was 21, I met a man. Same age as me. I was working in an airport, leaving for work at 2.45am and usually not getting home until after 4pm. My take home pay was around £980 per month. After rent in my 1 bedroom flat in the cheapest (and also not particularly pleasant) area in my expensive city, council tax, topped up my gas and electricity meters and phone bill (I didn't even have a TV!) I had £35 left to eat and pay for buses to work for the rest of the month. After only knowing this man for 6 weeks, I found out I was pregnant. I was on the pill, maybe it failed, maybe I had missed a couple, I don't know.

Should I have had that baby... how in the hell would I have been able to provide anything for it on that wage? Oh wait, I wouldn't have had a wage at all bevause I wouldn't have had anybody to care for my baby whilst I was working full time and leaving for work in the middle of the night.

So I assume, if you are anti abortion, and I had had that baby, you also agree I should have been entitled to a reasonable council property (not covered in damp or mould or other H&S issues), my rent paid, my council tax paid, plus money provided for gas, electricity, food etc. Plus some furniture (as I always rented fully furnished and didn't have any furniture of my own at 21), a TV, broadband (or maybe I should have sat in with my baby with absolutely nothing except the walls to stare at...)

Plus possible full training paid for by the government when I could have gone back to work once this baby reached school age, as I wouldn't have been a very attractive job applicant by this point.

AIBU to assume this is tour stance if you insist I should have been forced to have been a mother when I didn't want to be one, couldn't afford to be one?

OP posts:
SpitefulMidLifeAnimal · 29/05/2018 13:58

If it's a baby, it's a baby, however it was conceived

Legally and scientifically, it is a foetus until it is born. It is only a baby if you choose to assign that value to it.

Elspeth12345 · 29/05/2018 14:04

Totally agree with you OP.

This is a problem I have with anti-abortion republicans in the USA who don't actually care about how the baby is brought up once it's born even if that's into extreme poverty with no access to healthcare, adequate housing, parental care etc.

Most abortions happen pre-12 weeks when it is an embryo and I know that it can still affect the person who has had a termination but it's not getting rid of a baby, just an embryo- you effectively prevent suffering that a theoretical baby would experience in that situation.

Late term abortion is different but only really happens if there are serious health risks to mother or fetus.

Frazzledmum123 · 29/05/2018 14:05

No it's not ideal to be adopted I can see that but I have never understood that argument, you think it is worse that death? You think a child is better off dead tgan being adopted? Usually babies are very easily adopted, it's older children that aren't so much

freezerfoodyum · 29/05/2018 14:08

Usually babies are very easily adopted, it's older children that aren't so much

And do you think those babies are all delightfully happy and loved, or do you think many of them spend their whole lives wondering why they were given away by their birth mother?

And let's stop with the "death of a baby" shite please. One of my friends just had her 2 month old die after open heart surgery. It's a fucking travesty to compare that to the termination of a five week foetus, and it disgusts me.

SpitefulMidLifeAnimal · 29/05/2018 14:09

You think a child is better off dead tgan being adopted?

So what you are saying is that women should be forced to give birth just because of some bleeding heart sentiment over what is essentially a clump of cells. When did you begin to hate women so much?

Bangojam · 29/05/2018 14:12

I was adopted as a baby. My bm was a Catholic who was vehemently anti abortion but also has extreme mh issues so could not keep me.

I grew up in a loving family but have always felt a gaping emotional hole. Met my BM a few years ago and she has suffered her whole life because of giving me up, it made her mh issues a thpusand times worse and I don't mean to sound ungrateful but if she had terminated the pregnancy I would be none the wiser and she might have stood a chance at being happy. as it was I suffered, she suffered, and her subsequent children suffered.

I am pro choice all the way and always will be.

Bangojam · 29/05/2018 14:12

NC obviously.

cornishstripes · 29/05/2018 14:15

i'm pro britain's current abortion laws, but I would like to see more support for people for whom the costs of the first 5 years of a baby's life is the deciding factor. I've NEVER understood why pro-life people focus so much on the act of abortion and not on reducing the causes of abortions, such as poverty, not having the means to support etc.

Frazzledmum123 · 29/05/2018 14:16

The op asked options from people like me and that is what I am giving. Losing a baby at 30 weeks pregnant is still less hard tgan a 2mth old I'd imagine but doesn't mean it isn't awful. I imagine there are problems being adopted and wondering why. But I also imagine they have a fulfilling life with family and friends of their own. Life isn't perfect but it's better than the alternative.

And spiteful really? I hate women because I value life? You're entitled to think that if you like but you are wrong. I see it as a baby as soon as it is conceived. You don't. Fine, I ways will no matter how much of a bleeding heart sentiment you think it is.

JacquesHammer · 29/05/2018 14:17

You think a child is better off dead tgan being adopted?

That's just emotive bollocks. The baby (sic) won't know any difference given its a bunch of cells.

SpitefulMidLifeAnimal · 29/05/2018 14:18

I hate women because I value life?

Only the life of a clump of cells. You certainly don't give a flying fuck about grown women do you?

JacquesHammer · 29/05/2018 14:19

Losing a baby at 30 weeks pregnant is still less hard tgan a 2mth old I'd imagine but doesn't mean it isn't awful

I'm unsure what you mean here.

Nevertheless you cannot possible conflate the loss of a wanted baby at ANY term with abortion.

MiggeldyHiggins · 29/05/2018 14:20

You think a child is better off dead tgan being adopted

you can't be dead when you were never alive, but absolutely it can be better to never have existed. But thats not the point, its better, in fact its the only proper option, for women to not have babies they don't want to have.

Frazzledmum123 · 29/05/2018 14:28

So I hate women, you call them a clump of cells and not life and that isn't insensitive to people who miscarry? I lost one very early so I shouldn't have been able to grieve? And only wanted life is worth anything, neglected and unloved kids aren't then I assume? Anyway, like I said at the start, I rarely comment on these things as you are always made out to be evil, just because you see it as life. Heaven forbid I have a different opinion.

MiggeldyHiggins · 29/05/2018 14:29

Its not at all insensitive to people who miscarry and please stop using us in your hateful anti choice misogynistic arguments.

Bangojam · 29/05/2018 14:35

Did you read my post frazzled?

Bangojam · 29/05/2018 14:37

neglected and unloved kids

We are not talking about kids, we are talking about a foetus.

If you want to talk about neglected and unloved kids, why don't you take a look at the care system?

SpitefulMidLifeAnimal · 29/05/2018 14:38

So I hate women, you call them a clump of cells and not life and that isn't insensitive to people who miscarry?

Tell us then, once and for all, why do you think a woman should be forced to give birth, potentially ripping from arse to clit, to a child that she does not want?

Frazzledmum123 · 29/05/2018 15:00

Bang, no sorry I missed your first post. I'm sorry that's how you feel and I'm very sorry for your bm. I think there will be a lot of others who are glad they are alive though.

I've explained spiteful, I see it as life, it's hard to explain to someone who doesn't but in the scenario you describe the woman had her choice to be careful and didn't so I don't think the child should pay for her mistake because she doesn't want to pay herself.

Miggel- I respo see to the op who WANTED to hear others view. I can't change my opinion because you don't like it and people asked me to explain why I feel like that so I have. If you don't like hearing me then don't read it. And if others d ont want to hear my view they shouldn't ask!!

Frazzledmum123 · 29/05/2018 15:01

*responded

Bangojam · 29/05/2018 15:08

But why do those clusters of cells mean more to you than the many thousands of children like I was, and the many more women like my BM?

MiggeldyHiggins · 29/05/2018 15:18

you can give your opinion all you want, you're not immune to having it challenged or commented on once you do Hmm

JacquesHammer · 29/05/2018 15:33

So I hate women, you call them a clump of cells and not life and that isn't insensitive to people who miscarry?

No. I’ve miscarried. As devastated I was that I had lost the potential of a much wanted baby, it was still a cluster of cells.

My miscarriage caused me infertility. If a miracle happens now and I get pregnant I won’t be keeping it. Because it won’t be much wanted.

Frazzledmum123 · 29/05/2018 15:34

Of course not miggel but you asked me to stop. I'm just saying I was responding to someone else and if it offended you enough to not want to hear it, it's best you don't read it. I fully expected to have it commented on

Bango because the child had no say. The mother did. I doubt your life is so awful you wish you were dead? And honestly whilst I imagine there are a lot like you, I believe there are many more who are grateful they weren't aborted? Do you honestly think most adopted people which they had been?

Anyway it's a discussion I knew id never win and that's fine. The op asked a question and her flippant comment about not being sure she'd taken precaution made me want to answer it. I do not demonstrate outside clinics or comment to friends who have had them as it's not my place and I made it clear before I get it in some circumstances even if I don't like it. But she asked so I answered. That's me done

SpitefulMidLifeAnimal · 29/05/2018 15:40

I don't think the child should pay for her mistake because she doesn't want to pay herself

WTF? Women should pay for their mistakes? My god, that is absolutely disgusting.

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