Munchausen Syndrome

[BlooperReel]

AIBU to ask if you have experienced anyone with this condition? Or if there is something similar? If so, what were the 'symptoms' and how (if at all) did you get them help/did they recognise it?

I am concerned for a relative who I know lies or embellishes illnesses, conditions etc, to the point where they will exaggerate an existing condition so much they make themselves worse by not taking medication/leaving it so long to go to the Dr that their condition then requires hospitalisation.

Their health issues are all they want to talk about, to the point I can see their eyes almost glaze over when another topic is being spoken about until it can circle back round to them/their upcoming treatment/symptoms and so on.

Since statements were changed to EHCP a huge amount more parents have been accused of FII
Most often parents of children with
-Autism
-EDS

It’s a worrying trend. Parents trying to fight for support and corrrct care are being deliberately discredited as what possibly is just a money saving exercise and to limit ehcp success

Guidelines by the likes of Danya Glaser at GOSH don’t help as they actually name certain conditions as ‘red flags’

people who are genuinley suffering don't feel the need to talk about it all the time I am not so sure that is true actually. Some people do need a lot of validation and attention and their issues may well be genuine. I was so worried that i had exaggerated some aspects of my BPD (the voices and some though not all, of the suicide bits) that it meant i was faking the whole thing and that i did not have BPD at all ,, i mentioned it to both my therapist and another MH worker and they said that sometimes that kind of exaggeration is a "very BPD thing to do" and in their opinion it was part of genuine BPD.

most often parents of children with autism or EHDS

and ME/CFS too. i have heard some horror stories.

True FII is actually very rare
People being accused of it in recent years has risen dramatically. It’s a real problem currently

Parents who are loving and caring and trying desperately to access help and support for their children are shot down with the FII bullet

The number of stories i have heard of parents being accused of munchausens by proxy when their children have ME/CFS is bizarre because if they want sympathy, why go for ME/CFS which is NOT typically a condition which elicits sympathy from others.

I don't think the OP is talking about Munchausen's-by-proxy 'simplyMoisture'- she's just talking about 'Munchausen Syndrome' where an individual feigns or creates illness in him or herself for medical care and attention/sympathy.

Often in these cases there is no proof of anything and I’m a huge number of cases schools are referring and citing concerns in this area after parents have asked for additional support.
Other cases seem to be located in ‘hot spots’ and are traced back to certain doctors who seem to have a tendency to suspect FII in multiple patients

It does sound like your relative has 'Munchausen Syndrome' OP (I posted above about telling her to seek help).

Yes I can see that but it is a similar issue and one to be aware of

Yes. My ex boyfriend's sister I am sure had this. She was in and out of all sorts of hospitals. In the 5 years I knew her she had epilepsy, diabetes, schizophrenia, depression, anxiety, a blood clot, migraines, crohns, a lump in her breast, fibroids, asthma, gluten intelligence etc etc etc. Her dad went to an appointment with her once (when she actually had something wrong with her) and it all came out that the above were all made up and she hadn't been officially diagnosed with any of them.

I think there is a difference between making out your illness is worse than it is and actually feigning numerous illnesses for attention and sympathy. The latter may well fall in to munchausens.

could you go with your friend to the doc's / a&e next time so you can see / hear for your self , this would put your mind at ease and make your friend realise that there was someone there while they were been attended to so they could not embellish the issue

NAS - National Autistic Society was petitioned / Head or President of NAS was written to by a support worker/EP claiming that many many parents of ASD children were accused of FII.
Nothing happened. It resulted in.... nothing.

This thread makes me uneasy for all the sufferers of INVISIBLE illnesses who have to prove day in day out they aren't feigning.

They might appear ok when you see them because that's only when you can see them.

I was a long term patient in an antenatal ward and the woman in the next bed was desperate to stay in hospital and kept attempting to alter test results. After every meal she would tell me she was feeling a bit sick so needed to pull the curtains round, then I could hear her making herself sick and she would really excitedly pull back the curtains and declare she had been sick and how she needed to stay in because she couldn't keep any food down. She would go around with the kidney dish showing other patients her vomit . I thought maybe she had an eating disorder but realised that she lied about most things for attention and validation. When she had visitors she would say how the previous night the baby's heart stopped/she had a massive haemmorhage and how the whole hospital team had to rush to her to save her and the baby and 'one more minute and we would have both been dead'. I felt sorry for her in the end because I got the feeling she was only kidding herself.

A family member of mine worked with a man who spun a huge range of odd stories. 5 years ago he had everyone in the workplace in tears because he,d been given months to live. I never believed w sord of it, and felt a bit mean. He,s still alive and kicking!!

VanGoghsOtherEar - wow, you are the first person on MN since I have been a member about 18 months ago who has had a very similar experience to me and can relate.... I'd never thought anyone would ever have had anything remotely like what I went through.

You sound so intelligent, emotionally sensitive and definitely DEFINITELY not deserving of anything that you have been through - especially your movement disorder. There is no way either you nor me deserved to get this and we are both very unfortunate to have been left with permanent disabilities (for want of a better word... condition?) that will affect us for a long time.

And you definitely NOT disgusting - don't you ever let yourself or anyone tell you otherwise. Your story is very sad, and you deserve to be heard, listened to and to feel worthwhile - despite having a condition like dystonia (I also get some dystonic movements sometimes), you are still a valid and good person and very much equal to everyone else.

I have felt very depressed over the past couple of years because of my stupid movement disorder, the perceived 'shame' I feel about it, and how much it has affected my self-worth and esteem - but I am being as strong as I can every day to prove to my DD and my soon-to-be-born DS that you can still have a happy and fulfilling life despite adversity.

We are stronger because of our experiences and we must carry on. You are certainly not a nobody - you are a valuable person with valid hopes, strengths and dreams. Don't let anything make you think otherwise. And you can still be someone without needing validation from exaggerated illnesses.

NooNooHead1981

Your post almost made me want to cry. Thanks so much for what you posted. It is lovely to read what you wrote. i really did not know what the reaction was i was going to get when i commented on here.

((((hugs))))

I know this thread is making some uneasy, but actually I think thats why it’s so important. This is a huge issue for a decent minority - whether dealing with mystifying symptoms, studiously ignoring issues because they hate the idea that they might be like their parent, dealing with a relative who is “feigning” illness... it’s all so easy for others to have an opinion, but this really is one of those areas where you need to walk in the shoes. I’ve only skimmed read the last couple of pages because the whole subject brings up huge stuff, but I will go back to it all. I too was diagnosed with ME, but tbf I remember very clear physical symptoms, and it’s not something easy to replicate.

Yes, my DM has been diagnosed (by proxy, ha!) as probably BPD, with Narc, and that in itself has been enormously helpful. The problem is that I have had several chronic issues to resolve as an adult, and I can barely believe it’s real, and hate getting into it all. It’s even worse with your children. There’s another thread in AIBU (am I allowed to reference it?) where a MNer has asked for help with identifying wtf is going on with her mum/their relationship, and it ties in so closely with with this whole subject. To the extent that her boyfriend has questioned her Asperger diagnosis as a teenager because it seems to him that her characteristics might be born out of the toxic childhood. Anyway, it made for very painful reading at the same time as this thread.

I haven’t been in hte UK for a long time, but it’s horrendous that this kind of issue is being used as a pass/way of avoiding believing parents..although this has always been an issue. I now live in a country where they constantly pre-empt problems, send you for tests at the drop of a hat, and whilst to some it’s reassuring, and obviously, useful if they find something, I actually did end up very sick a couple of years ago because I couldn’t cope with any more testing.

Van your comments have been really helpful (if painful to read). I thought I had this all filed away, but your info has persuaded me to try and get more therapy, and hope to find some peace with what I’ve experienced, and understand more. It’s so difficult for everyone involved.

I know several people that use ill health to gain attention.

One was very ill as a child yet has probably completely recovered. They are always 'ever so ill' and need a lot of support - except can go anytime to the theatre if a spare ticket comes up. No one else can ever be as ill as they are. Two of her adult children now have long-term health issues related to the same childhood health issues she had. They never received any medical intervention as children as the mild symptoms they exhibited were ignored.

Another, I believe, has imaginary ill health; her doctors refused to continue to have her registered at their practise a few years ago. Her daughter was sick all through her teenage years but since leaving home has fully recovered. The daughter no longer eats any food or drink at her mother's house. Many people were suspicious about this for years but nothing was ever proven. This person trained as a nurse but stopped before finishing.

Year later this person is no longer allowed any contact with two young children she was caring for - again they weren't thriving but again nothing was ever proved.

I had YEARS of people accusing me of this. Turns out, believe it or not - many don't (besides my doctors & consultants of course) - I suffer from 5 different chronic illnesses...!!! One of which DOES take a long period of time to diagnose. Think up to 2 years.....

Please don't be so quick to judge.

One of my conditions causes debilitating pain & fatigue. One day I can be crawling around soft play with my 3yr old but the next I wake up unable to bend my legs or get out of bed. Those who don't suffer from it, generally cannot understand it.....

Sickofthomasthetank

I find it such a shame in my case the people that should have supported me caused my life a misery. I was isolated and questioned my sanity. If I didn't mention my illness I was suddenly ok and pretending. If I did mention it I was trying to be controlling or making myself worse as it was somatic and all in my head. Apparently I wasn't trying to get better even though I was doing absolutely everything possible. In the end they ignored its existence.

You're right some people will never understand. It takes such strength to trust yourself when even doctors can be just as bad and take ages to diagnose because of not doing necessary tests.

Often illnesses are also comorbid or the body can deteriorate in separate ways.

Sorry to derail. I know there are fakers too.

IheartMary cheers Ill take a look at the link you posted.

Lots of to anyone commenting has been genuinely ill and not believed. It must feel like the loneliest place to be.

Ironically the person I know whom I 100% think has fabricated illness by a carer (and also fabricating her own illnesses) is good friends with someone who has been accused of it in the past but really is suffering (and is now formally dx)

The danger with the label Munchausen-by-proxy rather than mass murderer is that it seriously diminishes the burden of proof. A doctor can give a diagnosis on evidence that no court could ever convict a criminal, but the behaviour you are being accused of (of injuring or even murdering) a child is exactly the same.

In the days when this was current doctors like Meadows could decide that a child's symptoms were the result of MbP simply because "the mother seemed the type" rather than because of any actual proof that the mother had done anything.

The other danger, of course, is that once a trigger-happy doctor had decided that "the mother seems the type"= this is MbP, they would stop any further medical investigations, which could put a genuinely sick child in danger.

I remember overhearing a conversation between dd's consultant and a junior doctor which I was definitely not meant to overhear: the junior doctor was trying to persuade his senior to do further tests but the senior had already decided that dd's symptoms were made up.

Dd was later diagnosed, fortunately not with anything life threatening, but with a disorder that caused pain and disability and definitely needed dealing with.