Munchausen Syndrome

[BlooperReel]

AIBU to ask if you have experienced anyone with this condition? Or if there is something similar? If so, what were the 'symptoms' and how (if at all) did you get them help/did they recognise it?

I am concerned for a relative who I know lies or embellishes illnesses, conditions etc, to the point where they will exaggerate an existing condition so much they make themselves worse by not taking medication/leaving it so long to go to the Dr that their condition then requires hospitalisation.

Their health issues are all they want to talk about, to the point I can see their eyes almost glaze over when another topic is being spoken about until it can circle back round to them/their upcoming treatment/symptoms and so on.

I was in hospital for a week in my third trimester sharing a ward with 2 other women one was in supposedly for a similar reason to mine.
I am diabetic and the insulin plan my Consultant has put me on wasn't working and I was having extreme hypos so was put on a different form and had daily monitoring and an even stricter diet than I was already on.
Any way she was always eating, munching, drinking but it was all crap you shouldn't be eating as a diabetic especially when pregnant. She was downing huge bottles of lucozade and cans of energy drinks and a few times I'd seen her wrap up the empties in blue roll and put in the bin.
Then she'd all night she'd moan and thrash about getting the attention of the nurses, get topped up with more insulin and then phone what sounded like everyone in her contacts list to tell them how she nearly died and was close to being in a diabetic coma ( she even got that wrong) blah, blah, blah.

This went on for 5 days, every morning after breakfast she would go to the on-site shop buy her stash and then waddle back to gorge always just after rounds.
On day six a consultant came to see the other lady, curtains drawn and mumbling etc they finished just as this other lady got back. With two massive bags of rubbish and the consultant got an eyeful of it!

She was moved the next day, not sure where but I was glad.
I don't think you can help people like this unless they become self aware enough to know what they are doing, if they are just hurting themselves it's one thing but to do it to a baby or child it's really disturbing.

I always zone out with competitive sick people, haven't got time for that.

MIL told her 3 kids that she was dying of lung cancer years back. Nope, she’s never had cancer

Since then she’s tried to persuade doctors she has many various types of cancer. At one point a doctor got a bit stern with her telling her she didn’t and it was all in her head. She told him he was wrong

She lies about everything though so no level she sinks to would surprise me. Ironically, I’m no longer sure I’d believe it if she actually died now.

Also she makes up random ailments that she can’t name. Ridiculous lies.

Just to add some balance into the thread, many, many, many chronic illnesses are hard to understand and also difficult to diagnose. Things like fibro, MCS, a-typical EDS, allergies, lupus, ME, autoimmune disorders are particularly hard to diagnose because they can come and go, have symptoms that appear random and cross over systems.

Threads like these can hurt. Doctors sometimes get things wrong, under diagnosing happens but also people can panic because they don't feel heard and minor health ailments can get blown out of proportion.

Doctors are great but they sometimes make mistakes because they are human just like everyone else.

iborgia if you know anything about the Allitt case (and it sounds like you don’t), you would know munchausens by proxy was the diagnosis given at the time, which is why she didn’t go to prison but went into a secure psychiatric facility instead. If she was simply a mass murderer (as you have decided, because clearly you know better than the professionals who dealt with her), she would indeed have gone to prison.

Yes, this thread makes me worry that people with unusual diseases which come and go will be dismissed as neurotic. It's perfectly possible to be very well, even hyper fit and then unable to do anything much from one week to the next.

Allergies can vary over time, depending on triggers, age, hormones, pregnancy. The severity of many hidden diseases and mental illnesses can be hard to appreciate when looking from the outside.

These misconceptions feed into the narrative of malingering disability benefits claimants which is not helpful.

Even people who are malingerers or Munchausen are probably psychologically damaged and need support.

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There are absolutely ways you can produce the results you want on tests- that is the point of having Munchausen's- finding a way to fool medical professionals. Fasting, taking other medication and keeping quiet about it, being dehydrated... just straight up living. and if you are faced with awkward questions- switch hospital and doctors.

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My dh did have a Nurse insert a tube into his airway because of very severe hayfever that he takes prescription medicine for. And it happened at the GP surgery. Some bigger surgeries do have GPs and nurses trained for emergency medicine and even have Ultrasound and X-Ray machines onsite.

I have a chronic autoimmune disease - and it's frankly quite scary how many health forums are full of people who either want to be ill or have been 'cured' by natural remedies or by praying to Jesus or by some special snake oil merchant.
I worked with a woman who claimed to have type 2 diabetes and yet was continually eating sweets and cakes and drinking fruit juice. She said her sugar levels were 'under control' - any body else's would have been off the chart!

I don't understand it. Being ill is really shit - and boring.

Also its worth noting that women going to seek medical care with mystery symptoms are more likely to diagnosed with a mental health condition then a man, even though women are more likely to have hard to pick up autoimmune conditions.

I swear, Unrest (available on Netflix and other streaming outlets ) should be mandatory viewing for women across the globe.

Doctors and nurses like to use Munchausen too freely nowadays. It should not be used for people who clearly haven’t been tested; to give you an example an ex-colleague was accused of this and almost got her child taken away for ‘attention seeking’ because she kept bringing her daughter into A&E, was ‘overmedicating’ her with prescription pain relief medication (so the GP was on her side) and apparently ‘nothing’ was wrong with the child. That little girl was eventually diagnosed with Juvenile Arthritis.

That's sad DuchyDuke, a mental illness shouldn't be fodder for an 'accusation', that's like accusing someone of having a broken leg. It's a legitimate diagnosis that ought to be given after psychiatric assessment!

I’m not saying that I know better, I’m saying that we all know better. She may have been described at the time as having it - but seeing as it was discredited, that can’t be what it was. In the meantime, I do stand my own opinion that you cannot say she behaved in the same way as those who are seen to display fabricated illness by carer. It was moving goalposts that was made to fit whatever was required.

There is also the perspective that woman are more likely to be described as being “ill” rather than just plain bad.

There are many serial killers, male and female, in psychiatric care, but being a mass murderer wasn’t a MSbP element - I don’t know what that proves tbh.

Meanwhile, Grey and Bills - couldn’t agree more, that it is obviously a sign of something, even if they don’t have the illness they think they do. It is so hard that, as is obvious on here, it just really annoys/tires/ irritates people til they stop listening. Which is the opposite of what they want I suppose. But it’s harder to forgive the impact it leaves on others sometimes.

Though to be fair, it doesn't sound like the "attention seeking" was the reason for queries about whether she could safely care for her child, overmedicating a small child with painkillers isn't without risk. Though I see that was under doctors' orders.

Nobody ever knows the full details of these cases other than the people involved though. It's not uncommon for someone involved with children's services to neglect to tell people of various other reasons their child is deemed at risk than the real ones (how often do you hear someone say 'they had their kids taken away for the house being messy' when there is absolutely no doubt that either the house was inhabitable and dangerous after support to get it habitable, or there are other serious issues like drug abuse going on that the family obviously don't want to share).

i have a relative with severe health anxiety but they are self aware - their GP is great. Its a real mental health issue that needs a lot of support.

Mary that’s incredible - why would anyone pay to hear more?? Anyway, thanks for hte clarification.

I didn't intend for this to be detrimental to anyone who is struggling to obtain a diagnosis, I am just genuinely concerned for my relative's mental and emotional state.

I can't go into huge detail as it could out them, but think of fairly minor things like a UTI, the symptoms although very obvious to most people, are left, with no treatment, until they are in such a sorry state they are hospitalised. Similarly a heavy cold, they will go out and walk in the cold, rain etc, not take medication, it then develops into a chest infection, and so on.

Then, when the Dr gives advice, i.e. avoid eating/drinking/doing such and such, they contribute to eat/drink/do such and such and then the ailment reoccurs, and so the cycle goes on. All with endless discussion of whats wrong, what medication they need, when their next appointment is, or in extreme cases, calling out ambulances because they 'cannot breathe' etc.

Then we are all regaled with how the resuss nurses 'have never seen anyone recover so quickly', or 'the consultant has never seen anyone with this reaction' etc etc as if they are a medical marvel.

It is very draining as you never know which bits are actually true, I have offered to come along to consultant appts with them, but am never allowed.

Sounds extremely dull for everyone but the individual!

I'd be taking a step back, changing the subject if they tried to discuss their health with me. Make it boring for them to try and engage with me regarding this issue. Won't change their behaviours but it'd save me from the stress and frustration of hearing it!

I have no advice for you OP, but you are not alone. It's a shitty position to be in.

I have a close relative who acts like this; serious broken bones, diseases, numerous heart attacks you name it, they've had it (Except that they haven't).

It's a new thing every week. They once forgot the broken back that they had last week! It's been going on for around 10 years now and the lies just get bigger and bigger. Especially when challenged.

They are also an expert in all the medication names and technical terms etc.

It's exhausting and bloody hard to deal with. I wish there was a solution. I hope you're ok

I have a diagnosis of Borderline Personality disorder which means my mental health is very changeable. When I am at my worst I fabricate illness: telling outrageous lies and making up symptoms to convince people I am not well. I spent 6 months in a wheelchair whilst pregnant due to “pain” which I now know wasn’t there. When I am well (like now) I am deeply ashamed of the lies I have told.

I guess what I am trying to say is, people who fabricate illness are often seriously unwell (mentally) and although it’s hard not to judge and be hurt by their lies quite often it is out of their control.

I have a rare drug induced movement disorder, caused by taking an antipsychotic for a serious breakdown a couple of years ago. This was following a head injury and post concussion syndrome, that wasn't really diagnosed properly by doctors and I got myself in such a state that I ended up needing a lot of psychotropic drugs - including the antipsychotic - that ironically ended up making me more ill in the first place.

My family were fed up with me at the end of it all and wanted me to get back to 'normaility', implying I was being OTT with all my symptoms, and my GP didn't believe me when I self diagnosed with my condition tardive dyskinesia because it is so rare and the chances of getting it from just a week of the drug I took were very low (apparently).

All of this was extremely frustrating, and I saw five neurologists who were equally useless at telling me what I have, until I saw a private one who immediately confimed my diagnosis based on my symptoms. To say it was a relief to actually be believed and listened to is an understatement.

I'm sure if someone had said I was making it all up and it was in my head, or it was due to anxiety (one doctor did say this), I would have been even more fragile mentally and my recovery would have been even more prolonged.

I'm certainly not saying that there aren't people out there who are malingering, or who do have psychosomatic illnesses that are more for attention, but for those of us with invisible injuries and illnesses (like traumatic brain injuries), it is a bit hurtful if someone implies it is (literally) all in their head. Just because someone doesn't have a plaster cast on their leg doesn't mean they aren't ill.

Blooperreel - it's interesting your relative actually ignores ailments before they turn to something more nasty. Something is up with that - do they feel it's not worth taking care of themselves unless it's something major? Do they neglect themselves in other ways? Or do minor ailments for them turn nasty because their overall immune sytem is distressed? Must be very exhausting watching and listening to this happen all the time. If it's appropriate I would have a chat with them about this pattern of behaviour and see what they say. You sound as if your trying really hard to be supportive feel free to point that out to them as well and keep offering to go with them to appointments with an open mind.

NooNoo - what an experience to go through! Glad you got the right help in the end.

Thank you Greymisty - it does still affect me quite a bit now, but I have focused my attention on being a good mum and getting to the end of my pregnancy (hopefully with my c-section booked for early June!) - but to say I am not that trusting of doctors any more is a bit of an understatement!

I think I will put my lack of trust to one side during the birth though as I may need all the doctors' and midwives' help I can get! Ha ha!