Munchausen Syndrome

[BlooperReel]

AIBU to ask if you have experienced anyone with this condition? Or if there is something similar? If so, what were the 'symptoms' and how (if at all) did you get them help/did they recognise it?

I am concerned for a relative who I know lies or embellishes illnesses, conditions etc, to the point where they will exaggerate an existing condition so much they make themselves worse by not taking medication/leaving it so long to go to the Dr that their condition then requires hospitalisation.

Their health issues are all they want to talk about, to the point I can see their eyes almost glaze over when another topic is being spoken about until it can circle back round to them/their upcoming treatment/symptoms and so on.

For those mentioning invisible illnesses, of course they should be recognised.

I think the op is talking about more extreme fabrications/obviously false medical problems. (Correct me if I'm wrong op)

My relative with this problem had for example in ONE week - a heart attack, type 2 diabetes diagnoses, a broken back and a broken hip.

None of which required hospital admission or treatment, just a quick X-ray and back to the GP apparently

When asked about follow up treatment the details become VERY sketchy!

Oh, and an osteoporosis diagnoses. All separate incidents too!

It's very sad for all involved.

Relative may be hypochondriac. Generally attention seeking.
But please don't demean it, by referring to this as 'Munchausen by Proxy'.

Because Munchausens is a very very serious issue. It's an abuse. It's abusive. It's a MH condition, trying to convince others that say your child has an illness, that gives you attention. The attention that you crave.
And does the child actual harm. Ie by being given the cancer drugs, that you've persuaded everyone they need for their cancer. Or dosing then with tonnes of salt, so that they are always in hospital on a drip etc. Harm is actually done to them.

This is not what OP is describing.
So please be respectful and not flippant or blasé.

I agree with Iborgia. Sir Roy Meadows research into Munchausens was completely discredited. And the new Fabricated Illness Government guidelines introduced by Tony Blair were questioned, on the medical investigations and research they were based on.

So, all it not quite as it might appear!

guidelinesReChildren

Threads like these can hurt
I am sure they can.
But there is a danger (and I have seen it happen on mn) that Induced and Fabricated Illness can be totally dismissed as a reality because parents have been treated appallingly in the past.
I&FI has the highest mortality rate of any child abuse. Its hideous and it absolutely does happen.

The difficulty is that there is usually some grain of truth. A child has a disability or illness which is exaggerated, extended or worsened by the carer.

I think most people who work with families will have suspected it at some point. I am not talking about jaded professionals who are chronic 'parent blamers'. I mean professionals who are real advocates for parents.

I worked in A&E for a long time. There were regulars who came in with made up ailments. The women tended to go for ectopic pregnancy because it was easy to fake the symptoms and meant a lot of intense attention.

I went to school with a girl who most certainly had this.
She would invent wild stories about various illness and accidents.
She claimed on numerous occasions that she'd been raped, and would talk of it in detail, however the story changed depending on who she was talking to.

Weirdly, she has a real chronic illness and I think that had a hand in her determination to fabricate others. She'd experienced the "benefits" that had come with being ill so felt the need to invent more issues when her real symptoms weren't present.

I haven't seen her in years but last I saw was her filling her Facebook page with endless posts about her various problems, hospital visits and long, woe-is-me monologues about how challenging her life is.

In my experience, those who are genuinely suffering don't feel the need to talk about it endlessly. They want their lives to be as normal as possible and talk about anything other than their health.

I am absolutely and utterly 100% convinced that MIL has Munchausens. Every single week she has a number of different illnesses. She's at her GP 2-3 times a week, constantly in hospital. It's gone to the stage now where she won't even go to a&e, instead she'll call an ambulance out.
She spent almost 2 weeks in a private hospital recently. She had absolutely EVERY test under the sun done, and surprise surprise, they couldn't find one thing wrong with her.

She 'can't' walk to the corner shop (literally 2 minutes away) because she might 'have a turn' or 'something' could happen, yet she spends a huge amount of time during the summer away on holiday.

You literally can't have a conversation with her that doesn't revolve around her health. Last time I saw her, she told me that she'd been to the physio the day before and had gotten a laser burn, the GP was sending her for more 'tests' and the dentist said she'd have to have a root canal. She only went to the dentist for a check up and created a scene about how 'terrified' she was and apparently the dental receptionist had to go in with her and literally hold her hand

She's constantly seeing specialists and consultants and having scans and x-rays etc. I dread to think how much she has cost the health service over the years and all for absolutely nothing.

My FIL is the world's most quiet man and has completely indulged her over the years. If she'd been married to anyone else, he'd have left her years ago.

DH and I have had rows about it because he constantly runs to her side everytime there's another 'medical emergency'.

She's spent years crying wolf. I actually hate being around her now because I just find her so horribly draining.

NooNooHead1981 and CleverQuacks. my story ties in with both of yours really.

Firstly CleverQuacks : Since the age of 16, I had borderline personality disorder type symptoms and was later diagnosed with it in my 20s whilst at University. I did have genuine symptoms of BPD and was certainly very unwell- serious rages, mood swings, self harm, violence towards others, lies, stormy relationships, either avoiding people or neediness,anxiety, emptiness feelings, binge eating (and even came close to actual bulimia), impulsive risky behaviours around shopping and money etc. But I was abused by my father verbally and mentally and bullied by my peers. One day a girl at school showed an interest in my mood issues etc and I felt for once in my life that someone cared. So I made some of my symptoms worse by not seeing a GP for ages, (this was before i entered the mental health system- my parents would not let me get any help with them and was too afraid of my dad to try). I did have suicidal ideation mostly over my dad, but I also felt I was not "sick enough" unless I made real attempts (had been self harming for some time already), so I made some "attempts" where I did not want to die so much as I wanted to be "sick enough to deserve help."

I had a very low self worth, always felt insignificant, so for me I wanted to be special. I was angry at myself for not being "ill" enough. I had never heard of BPD then. I thought i had clinical depression. my friend thought i did too. At first i hid my self harming- i needed it, and was terrified of someone taking it away from me. It was my control. but after my friend started giving me attention i started cutting where peopel could see. i made it my goal to be as sick as possible. because i had no sense of identity before and have always been a perfectionist. So i had to be "sick enough." And yes, I let myself get worse until i failed my A levels. had taken several overdoses and was then in the MH system.

I started hearing voices and i felt both scared i was going crazy and also excited. It felt like a way to be "more sick." I was convinced I maybe had bipolar but psychiatrist was unsure. I went one day to see the duty psychiatrist because i had been feeling weirdly detached from everything (not the first time) and had voices also.

NooNooHead1982 this is where your story and mine start to converge. I was given Largactil (Chlorpromazine) and warned taht if i had any muscle stiffness or cramps it would be something called drug induced Dystonia (very similar to TD) and i must STOP them immediately. Well, i started to feel the cramps as soon as i got home- i had begged them not to admit me- if i was in hospital my parents would find out and my dad would go ballistic. he once threatened my sister with stabbing her because she had depression and she was "bringing shame on the family"- so i got back to my flat but could barely walk- cramps everywhere. But I did not stop taking the tablets and a few months later my balance was gone and i felt like i had writer's cramp all over my body- i could barely pick up a heavy textbook for my degree and could only walk very short distances and stairs were a nightmare. I never got official diagnosis, but i KNEW that i had dystonia from the drugs. Dystonia is very common in those of Ashkenazi Jewish extraction and my father's mother had that heritage, so that is another piece of the puzzle. Now as regards my BPD, CleverQuacks i now have had proper diagnosis and Dialectical Behaviour Therapy was given for me which has helped a bit but i am not really one hundred per cent cured. I would fabricate sicknesses if I ever felt I was being abandoned and I woudl do the thing where I would take someone else's illness story and pretend it was mine.

NooNooHead1981 After a breakdown which put me in hospital I had a CPN last autumn who believes I cannot have dystonia as the diagnosis is not official, even though several GPs I have seen since have felt my muscles and observed my gait and have tried to prescribe me things to help relax my muscles, and they believe me 100 per cent. My other mental health workers believed me too. But this CPN says because diagnosis of dystonia was never official thought it was one of my lies. I had to explain to her the whole sorry saga. (I did lie to my CPN that I had MS once- I know that was a horrible thing to say and I hate myself for it- ironicaly i said it due to a fear of my actual mobility issues (i need a stick now for balance) not being taken seriously.

Why do i exaggerate illness? 1/ abandonment or fear of being abandoned.

2/Fear of not being taken seriously. I had ME after a virus for some years after a virus i had age 12 and my father never believed me even after official diagnosis and seeing i could barely get out of bed. i was also sexually assaulted when i was growing up but was not believed or taken seriously. I do not believe people will believe me when i tell them the truth or when i need help.

3/ Shame. i hate myself and feel not good enough as just being moderately ill and mildly abused. i am also overweight and have an ordinary average looking face, average intelligence. i did have some musical talent (classical singing) but due to health stuff i never continued my studies in voice. Did go to university to do a law degree but my mental health made that v difficult. i am a nobody.

NooNooHead1981 I expect you are reading my story and thinking I am disgusting, and yeah, you are right. I deserved my movement disorder, you did not. I guess I wanted you to know that I understand how hard it is to get taken seriously with a movement disorder, because outside of the Psych community, no one has heard of it, it seems.

I am disgusting, but I am capable of empathy, and I really feel for you.

I agree with previous posters who have mentioned how difficult stories like this, can be for people who are struggling with genuine health issues and lengthy diagnosis. Our young daughter has been in hospital many times since she was born, and also suffers from urinary & digestive problems & multiple allergies, to the point that it disrupts her sleep every single night and makes her miserable and tired. Yet she goes into school and puts on her happy face. People have often commented that she ‘looks so well’, which often feels like we are not believed! Even after she was hospitalised for a week with septicaemia, I had a mum comment that her recovery must have been so quick...as she looked so healthy. It really does upset me sometimes, and suspicions like this, can often be levied where they really don’t belong.
As for your situation OP, I know it does seem strange...but you really never know...

I have a friend who constantly has multiple ailments - minor things like food intolerances, slightly runny nose, small patch of eczema etc. She hot foots it to the GPs at every minor twinge, her kids too. When they can’t find anything wrong or suggest something like hay fever or a cold, she flies off the handle, goes to see a homeopath to find out “what’s really wrong” and gets diagnosed with ‘chronic fatigue’ or ‘multilateral food allergies’, when clearly it’s just a spot of hay fever. Then it’s back to the GP who sends her or her children for actual scientific laboratory tests, (pin prick, blood tests, all checked on Facebook at clinic/hospital etc) then when they are clear shes back at the homeopath taking mint & cuckoo crap pills & making her children only drink coconut milk “they’re allergic to soya too, hun”.

No problem giving them McDonalds or KFC three times a week though.

It’s the drama.

My mil had an actual diagnosis of it
Twas a nightmare I can tell you

Really QOD? As I understand it it's extremley difficult to diagnose it in an individual. Did she have treatment and stop the behaviour?

for you Van Gough, that sounds so hard. I hope you have some real life support.

No @IHeartMaryLennox.
My fil didn’t accept the diagnosis so carried out letting it all play out, she was very convincing 😕
She had a very unusual verbal diagnosis of bowel cancer pre Colonoscopy due to her symptoms and extreme weight loss - which then showed she was clean as a whistle. She’d gone private as her nhs gp didn’t believe she was dying ...

Was all very stressful on and off until she died.

As she developed dementia she became very controlling of poor fil’s health

@greymisty I have raised the pattern of ignoring synptoms until there is extreme pain/hospitalisation, pointed out that they know the symptoms so surely a gp visit at the onset is better than waiting 3 weeks only to then need a hospital visit. I even lectured them on the cost to the nhs of these ambulance call outs but it falls on deaf ears.

Blooper it sounds like my niece.

She also had to be intubated. An allergic reaction apparently. This particularly fucks me off since my son has severe allergies and genuinely nearly died from them.
When I asked her what caused her allergies she name the offending item. I asked her what bread she used as DS is allergic to that item too and we struggle to find bread that doesn’t contain it. She named the bread and it did indeed contain the very thing she claimed closed her throat up.

She also gets her drink spiked regularly, faints at the top of stairs, etc etc
It’s been going on for years since she as a child and she has being diagnosed with.... drum roll

Fuck all.

RickOShay I have some, but it is very intermittent. Thanks for the flowers. Bless you.

1. Your family member probably (but not definitely) does have Munchausen Syndrome.

1. It's a real mental health condition.

1. If she does if it she needs treatment. You need to be kind but firm- say that you think she might have some anxiety/self-esteem/emotional issues as well as her physical problems and that maybe they should talk to a therapist/counsellor about their situation and her medical problems. She might not take it very well but she will get stuck in this cycle if no-one helps!

• If she does have it, not 'if it'