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AIBU?

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Original poster

to think that Scouting should be one group now?

247 replies

Flatpackjackie · 16/04/2018 21:52

As girls are allowed in Beavers, Cubs and Scouts, why aren't boys allowed in Rainbows, Brownies and Guides?

Or better still, just have one group for Beavers/Rainbows ages, one for Cubs/Brownies, etc?

Seems outdated and daft to separate by sex, especially as the Scouting groups include girls anyway.

(Not a TAT, not about trans issues at all.)

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 18/04/2018 17:07

Boys and girls do different things in gym. It depends on the ability and training of the coaches and the availability of equipment.

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2018 17:08

"But I think it is seen as a lot more acceptable to discriminate against boys in general tbh."
Is it the no boys in Guides you are particularly bothered by?

Tomorrowillbeachicken · 18/04/2018 17:10

Not really. In local area there’s lots of clubs that are girls only but there would be outrage if something was boys only.

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2018 17:13

What sort of girls only clubs are there? I don’t think there are any but guides round here. And what sort of boys only ones would you like?

budgiegirl · 18/04/2018 17:43

In local area there’s lots of clubs that are girls only but there would be outrage if something was boys only

I’m sure you’re right, unless the club can prove there is a good reason to have boys only. For example, I can remember a poster in here wanting to open a boys only art club. Her reasoning was that some boys feel art/craft is a girl dominated activity and were therefore uncomfortable going to a mixed art club as they may be the only boy there. Mumnetters were generally in favour of her idea.
I could imagine that a boys only ballet class may have its merits. Especially if it encourages more boys into what is seen as a female dominated activity

Toomanytealights · 18/04/2018 18:32

My dd goes to Guides because a lot of her old primary friends who she no longer sees go.Its a good way of keeping in touch.

You say the children choose the activities. It seems to me the two extremes alpha males and craft loving boy hating the other. Many children are in the middle and would love more of a mixture and mixed sexes.Knowing the characters I suspect many in dd's group would prefer a mixed group.

Non alpha males really miss out and it is actually very damaging for them. A mixed group would be healthier for all.

ForgivenessIsDivine · 18/04/2018 18:49

And yet, even in the arts which are 'girl dominated', when it comes to money, there is still a significant gender pay gap.... so despite being underrepresented, men still come out on top in the money and power stakes so in my opinion, until those gaps are closed, girls should be given every opportunity possible to help bridge that gap, even if it means there are more resources allocated to girls than boys. (and for context, I have both sexes in my family)

www.npr.org/2016/12/07/504651764/the-gender-wage-gap-in-the-arts

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2018 18:52

“Non alpha males really miss out and it is actually very damaging for them. A mixed group would be healthier for all.”

But Scouts is mixed, and is child led. I really don’t understand your point. I’m sure it’s me being dim though.

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2018 18:54

And I am interested in all the girl only activities you have in your area- that’s quite unusual, isn’t it?

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 18/04/2018 18:54

mixed group would be healthier for all

Scouts are mixed

There were two troops in our village

One was very outdoorsy and sciency and the other was more crafty and talky (other people giving talks) based

One had a massive waiting list and the other didnt...one was mixed and the other wasnt, and it wasn't the way round you thought it would be

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 18/04/2018 18:54

You general

Not you too

ForgivenessIsDivine · 18/04/2018 18:55

@Toomanytealights.. but there is space for both, scouts who allow both sexes to join and guides which is girls only. In your terminology, 'non-alpha males' get to choose a mixed scout troop.

budgiegirl · 18/04/2018 18:57

Non alpha males really miss out and it is actually very damaging for them. A mixed group would be healthier for all

Cubs and scouts are mixed. Some packs have only a few girls, some packs are very active and rowdy, some packs are quieter. Sometimes it’s a case of finding the right fit for a child, especially if they are a quieter boy

Mamaryllis · 18/04/2018 19:00

Lol tealights. As others have said - guiding is a youth-led space. For the last few years my unit has been resolutely outdoorsy - backpacking, all night challenge hikes, climbing, building shelters etc. This year the younger girls are deciding they prefer more indoor activities, and our trips and overnights are changing as a result. (I can do either - my role is to support and facilitate). Sexist is the last thing it is. It’s empowering and gives the girls an opportunity to practice decision making and leadership at an age appropriate level.
My line in the sand is protein at breakfast for multi night camps. Smile

Toomanytealights · 18/04/2018 19:02

Most towns don't be have a selection. If the pack is rowdier with very few girls a big chunk of boys have nowhere to go and it highlights their differences even more which is damaging. Some girls may want to have boys but not be the minority at scouts. We don't live in the dark ages any more,it really is long overdue for a change.

Toomanytealights · 18/04/2018 19:03

It is sexist to say boys are all the same and damaging to girls. It is sexist to say you can't join simply because you have a penis. It is sexist to say girls can't cope with boys.

Tomorrowillbeachicken · 18/04/2018 19:04

I have to make it clear I don’t want boys only groups, was just saying there would be outrage. Closest stem group and gymnastics groups are girls only. Can’t think of any boys only groups tbh.

Tomorrowillbeachicken · 18/04/2018 19:04

My son does much better with girls than boys tbh.

dlnex · 18/04/2018 19:04

Yes.
Brownies was fine.
Guides - bitchy, lots of mobile phone use, lack of outdoor activities, leaders giving out LOTS of junk food, pop, sweets.
Swopped to Scouts - better on outdoor activity front, slightly more 'robust' leaders, but got too 'locker room' as girls faded away, younger boys messing about, girls got fed up of leaders shouting.
Not sure how relevant Guiding/Scouting is any more, I have very happy memories from my childhood.

Tomorrowillbeachicken · 18/04/2018 19:05

He already goes to a club where there are many girls and just two boys, including him. It is there he thrives.

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2018 19:11

“Closest stem group and gymnastics groups are girls only”

STEM- because girls are still underrepresented in STEM. Gym because girls and boys do different things and probably the coaches are specifically trained for girls disciplines.

But hardly “lots”

catgirl1976 · 18/04/2018 19:14

Boys are allowed in Guides. Perhaps you've missed all the threads on this.

Tomorrowillbeachicken · 18/04/2018 19:17

I think that’s if they identify as female

drspouse · 18/04/2018 19:28

Yes catgirl only if they identify as girls.
There's a boy only ballet school in London.

Toadinthehole · 18/04/2018 19:32

Non alpha males really miss out and it is actually very damaging for them. A mixed group would be healthier for all

This. It seems that no one thinks of them.

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