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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think "ran away with a black man" is racist

255 replies

Slarti · 14/04/2018 06:57

Seen a discussion on a local FB page, one of those "Who remembers parents/grandparents saying X when you were little" and everyone enjoys the nostalgia. Except this one was "Who remembers asking where you mum was and being told 'She's ran away with a black man'? And before anyone says, it isn't racist!"

My first thought was, are you sure?? Why mention racism in the first place if it's so benign? Isn't it a reference to interracial relationships being taboo/shameful/illicit? Anyway, the response on FB is unanimous - "My DM/DF/DGF/DGM used to say it all the time, so of course it isn't racist." My opinion that it might be hasn't gone down too well at all. AIBU?

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 14/04/2018 09:54

“bobstersmumtotally agree with you, you cant say anything these days without being called a racist. or sexist etc”

You can say loads of things! Just not racist or sexist things.

BertrandRussell · 14/04/2018 09:56

“It was seen as a FUN thing.“

No it wasn’t.

MereDintofPandiculation · 14/04/2018 09:56

The same as 'white trash' is racist too. Implying all non-whites are trash. It's an unpleasant phrase, but it's the first time I've seen it argued that the unpleasantness is towards non-whites.

Certcert · 14/04/2018 09:57

Rubbish. It was seen as a FUN thing. Whether that’s right or wrong these days, to suggest it would be FUN, that’s what it was, NOT bad.

You're talking rubbish!

gamerwidow · 14/04/2018 09:57

It was seen as a scandalous shameful thing not a fun thing to have an interracial affair.

MrsMollyMooMoo · 14/04/2018 09:57

I used to hear this all the time where I grew up in Scotland, Haven't heard it for years

peacheachpearplum · 14/04/2018 09:58

I don't' know why anyone would want to tell a child their mother has run off, as a starting point that is nasty and I can't see any fun in it at all, making it racist just adds to what is already unpleasant.

BertrandRussell · 14/04/2018 10:02

Just remembered my dad used to say “your mother has gone out with the Brigade of Guards-she’ll be home for dinner”

Proper posh, we were.

Fresta · 14/04/2018 10:05

I don't think the intent of the phrase was racist, although the origins may certainly well be. It was implying that the mother has done something to lower herself, something shameful to explain her absence. All similar phrases include an activity which would lower her- running off with the milkman, joining the circus etc. So therefore, if being with a blackman is lowering oneself then it was a 'racist' phrase. I still don't think anyone using it is necessarily a racist though.

C8H10N4O2 · 14/04/2018 10:13

So therefore, if being with a blackman is lowering oneself then it was a 'racist' phrase. I still don't think anyone using it is necessarily a racist though

Really? What is the non racist way to say someone is lowering themselves by being with a black person? Please enlighten me.

Lovesagin · 14/04/2018 10:15

It is racist, but, when my dad used to say it he actually meant it as in she went for a better option than him Grin, he was pretty upset when one day in my teenage youth I explained why if he says it in front of the wrong person he might get a smack in the mouth. He didn't say it after that instead it was the postman she ran off with.

I think many others might have thought the same, doesn't stop it being racist though but i wouldn't necessarily say they are racist if that makes sense just ignorant. Bit like how until recently my mum still used 'coloured' instead of black because that used to be the right word to use, I did a SIOB and put her right pretty quickly!

TammySwansonTwo · 14/04/2018 10:22

I should be horrified that even a single person here thinks this isn’t racist, but I’m not even slightly shocked. The casual pervasive nature of racism is what allows such blatantly racist turns of phrase to be accepted and defended.

I had never heard this phrase before this thread and it’s so transparently racist. If the”black” part were irrelevant, why not “she’s run off with another man”. Clearly the word “Black” adds something extra to the phrase (that being the derogatory implications of a white woman being with a black man). How anyone can’t see this is gobsmacking.

My nan, when especially tired, would say she had been “working like a black”. Do you think this was complimentary, because black people work hard? Of course not, and I could see that as a child, let alone as an adult with critical thinking skills.

BettyBaggins · 14/04/2018 10:40

Anniemouse I appreciate that many people seem to of understood the term negatively but for me it was seen as a fun thing too. Maybe because I had black friends who were fun and as a child I was naively interpreting the saying to my own experience?

@Gamerwidow thankyou. I seriously thought it meant 'be a racist bastard' or 'a dictatorial tosser'.

I think that the call for being over PC is actually stopping important conversations happening that need to be had. I have sat with a group of artists, who happened to be black, at such a community discussion, who have had to listen a group of middle class liberal white artists pontificate that it wasnt racism that made them get funding over the artists with black heritage, insinuating it was quality of work. It wasn't in any way. Cognitive dissonance from 'anti-racists' who pick and choose what works for them personally and no other? Maybe!

longestlurkerever · 14/04/2018 10:43

The same as 'white trash' is racist too. Implying all non-whites are trash. It's an unpleasant phrase, but it's the first time I've seen it argued that the unpleasantness is towards non-whites.

It's horrible on all levels. I agree it does suggest that it's exceptional to be white and trash and therefore racist, but calling anyone trash is nasty.

You don't need to "overanalyse" a phrase as blatant as this one to see its racist intent - though I think lovesagin might mean that although the phrase is racist not everyone using it might have racist intentions. I think this is part of the problem though - you don't have to be out wearing a white hood lynching people to be on some level racist. We live in a society where your life chances are significantly worse if you are black. This is if anything more down to the effects of unconscious bias rather than overtly racist nutters - it's down to all of us to check our language, our assumptions, our prejudices, call them out and accept graciously when we're called out on them.

longestlurkerever · 14/04/2018 10:44

Sorry - I'm waffling. by "this phrase" I meant the one in the OP.

Certcert · 14/04/2018 10:44

Rubbish. It was seen as a FUN thing. Whether that’s right or wrong these days, to suggest it would be FUN, that’s what it was, NOT bad.

But why would it be 'fun' to run off with a black man? Confused

Right, I'm leaving this thread..things to do, people to run off withGrin

EnthusiasmIsDisturbed · 14/04/2018 10:46

Of course it was racist

It implied she went off with someone who was no good and highly sexual

And also implied the women were sluts

paceyswife · 14/04/2018 10:47

My dad said this all the time to me and my sister whenever we asked where our mum was Blush

SchadenfreudePersonified · 14/04/2018 10:49

As I remember though, she wasn't stolen, she fell in love and left her rich husband for a gypsy? Fingers crossed

You remember rightly spiggle

It was a song about love winning out over money - when her husband catches up with her she says

"What care I for my goose feather bed/
Wi' blankets strewn so comely-o?/
Tonight I lie in a wide open field/
In the arms of a raggle taggle gypsy-o"

There was nothing racist about it - envious more like! (It was one of my favourite songs, too - though even when I was about 10 I wondered she'd feel the same when it started snowing . . . )

Chocrock · 14/04/2018 10:51

This was said by lots of people when I was growing up - 60’s & 70’s. I always wondered why his colour was mentioned.
It’s definitely racist perhaps ignorant racism but racism all the same.

TeachesOfPeaches · 14/04/2018 10:51

My Irish granddad used to say this to me. Thought it was odd.

SchadenfreudePersonified · 14/04/2018 10:55

Enthusiasm

That's exactly what it implied.

Nobody ever thought "Her home life is so horrible that she's taken the first opportunity that presented itself to run away, even though she will have to face social disgrace and condemnation by choosing a black man who treats her well over a white one who is aa abusive wanker, and will never be allowed to see her beloved children again"

They went for the option that exonerated the man. And even though it may have been said in "fun", there is a hidden shard of steel in it.

Racist and mysogynist.

ClaraLaMoine · 14/04/2018 10:59

This reminds me of when BBC news were pulled up on their headlines.

When referring to white man:
'30 year old male murdered young woman in London'

When referring to black man:
'30 year old black male murdered young woman in London'

The number of times I've been involved in conversation and someone has had to point out 'that massive black bouncer last night' or 'I was talking to this black guy earlier'. Very unlikely if the men in these scenarios where white that it would be mentioned. 'Met this really nice white guy last night' isn't something I ever hear.

I would describe this as ignorance however, not racism.

Think about it this way. Would you say it to a black person? If not then yes it's probably racist...

BlancheM · 14/04/2018 11:02

My neighbour used to say this much to the amusement of others.
It's one thing to acknowledge the phrase and plead ignorance, different times and all that, but another to defend its use and use the 'PC gone mad' argument. This is why I'm not on FB anymore. Winds me up to read endless offensive comments constantly being justified.

Sleepyblueocean · 14/04/2018 11:06

Of course it is racist. This type of Facebook local page discussion always ends up with people being racist and trying to defend it.