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To find floral tributes being left for Harry Vincent offensive

999 replies

frankchickens · 10/04/2018 10:47

This is an attempt to intimidate the innocent family. Flowers should be removed - isn’t it littering?

OP posts:
Aeroflotgirl · 11/04/2018 16:46

I totally agree Snow, well said.

SaucyJane · 11/04/2018 16:48

Elendon and vesta are positively surreal. Makes you wonder if they even read the same words as most posters here Confused

Stirner · 11/04/2018 16:49

@Elendon - earlier on in this thread you made false equivalences to the passing of Princess Diana and the murders committed by Harold Shipman, you can't really accuse anyone of "bizzare reasoning".

stitchglitched · 11/04/2018 16:49

Well said Snow. This man caused absolute fear and misery to some of the most vulnerable people in society. He was someone's son? Yeah he was a nasty thieving thug's son who has just served 6 years for robbing pensioners too. Lets not pretend the world won't be a better place without him in it.

Mightymucks · 11/04/2018 16:52

Sorry, but how does drinking stout mean you are not an elderly pensioner? Stout is piss weak, even my 89 year old nan has the occasional pint. And she’s certainly not known for being fighty or stabby. And you can see he’s only holding two pints to clown around for the picture.

SaucyJane · 11/04/2018 16:53

My uncle is 80. He can down a pint in seconds - like one gargantuan swallow.

He's still v frail, walks with a cane, and suffering with cancer Sad

stitchglitched · 11/04/2018 16:55

There has been a bizarre campaign by that poster to pretend 78 isn't old. On the last thread it was because she knew a 78 year old with 25 year old kids, on this thread it is because he drinks stout and her mother is 92 and goes to Ibiza. A bit baffled as to their motivations though- Henry Vincent and his family's entire MO is picking on the elderly. They select their victims specifically for their age and vulnerability.

Mightymucks · 11/04/2018 16:56

Ibiza has some lovely sedate resort. Portinatx is a great spot for the elderly.

FrancisCrawford · 11/04/2018 17:01

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Elendon · 11/04/2018 17:02

Are you hard of understanding?

MagneticMan · 11/04/2018 17:02

Re: the photo in question, there's no evidence of when that was taken - could have been 10 years ago for all we know.

There's also no evidence that both of the drinks were his, he could easily have been holding someone's pint for them. The fact both were partially drunk would suggest that actually. Hell, for that matter it could be that neither of the drinks were his - he might be teetotal and thought it would make a funny photo. It takes a very shallow person to pass judgement on a man based on one random picture.

If 78 isn't elderly then what is it? Middle aged? Pre-pubescent?

FrancisCrawford · 11/04/2018 17:02

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FrancisCrawford · 11/04/2018 17:05

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miffytherabbit1974 · 11/04/2018 17:05

Apart from the actual victims of the burglary, this situation doesn't make anyone look good.

I try and get news from lots of places and it's noticeable that the black-top tabloids, such as The Express and Mail Online are having a field day whipping up the very worst feelings that can potentially exist within people. It's as though we are being are being encouraged by these types of news outlets to stop thinking about things properly, and instead just thoughtlessly react with our gut emotions instead.

So, the the black and red-top tabloids are behaving badly by stirring up feelings of anger and hatred and treating this situation like a freak show.

It already goes without saying that the traveller community are shunned by much of the wider British society. They are casually lumped together as being little more than a collection of negative stereotypes. There is a long standing mutual suspicion between the traveller community and the police. Many observers have already made up their minds that the behaviour of this individual family is simply to be expected only because they are travellers. This is speculation, but it might be the case that they are doing this with the tributes because it is the only way they feel they can assert some sense of control of what has happened to their family member.

Nevertheless, there is no doubt that it is provocative and their continued presence at this tribute site means that the situation is unlikely to calm down. If in no other way, they are behaving badly by not being sensitive to locals living in the immediate area. Worse still, they are not showing much comprehension as to how this is effecting the pensioner involved in this, his disabled wife and their wider family.

IMO, the police could and should have intervened much sooner and more decisively than they have done. They could easily have cordoned off that particular section of fence in response to this, and community policing could have made their presence felt in that area in a much more obvious way. I understand that this morning there is a higher profile presence in that area, but it is too little too late.

So the police, whilst not necessarily behaving badly, don't appear to have done as much as they could to ease and de-escalate all of this.

Some of the so-called "vigilantes" who have been tearing these tributes down, ripping them up and stamping on them are, to my eyes, little more than brattish and rather sad attention seekers. At least one of the more prominent "vigilantes" does not even come from the local area. They have done absolutely nothing to calm this situation down and, judging by the video clips online, they are actively relishing being a part of the angst and upset.

So the behaviour of the "vigilantes" is pretty appalling too.

All of this combined seems to have green-lighted really unedifying behaviour from the general public on social media, from here at Mumsnet to Facebook and Twitter. It seems to activate a "react" switch in people's minds, allowing them to forgo critical thought and give in to their very worst instincts. It isn't just about some of the frankly disgusting latent racism, it's about wishing people dead, not bothering to think about the fact that there are very few winners and a lot of heartbroken people wrapped in this circumstance. I behaved like this yesterday on here by just "reacting". I had to go away and have a really good talk with myself.

So, much of the general public have ended up looking pretty unpleasant and badly behaved too.

There's no doubt in my mind that we, as a society, are thinking differently since the advent of social media and since it has become embedded into our lives and collective psychology. It risk turning many of us into unthinking reactionary zealots, ready to condemn rather than comprehend. But that's just my humble opinion.

Mydoghatesthebath · 11/04/2018 17:12

Anyone with any sense would describe a 78 year old man as elderly!

As I posted yesterday obviously one poster questions the frailty of a man able to pick up 2 pints of stout?

Akin to asking a rape victim what she was wearing.

Disgusting victim blaming there

MagneticMan · 11/04/2018 17:19

At least one of the more prominent "vigilantes" does not even come from the local area.

The burglar's family don't live in Hither Green so by that logic they shouldn't be there either.

The locals are probably too shit scared of reprisals to remove the flowers. The 78 year old man whose fence they are attaching the flowers to probably hasn't reported it because he's scared of what they will do to him.

FrancisCrawford · 11/04/2018 17:22

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crunchymint · 11/04/2018 17:24

Given the average life expectancy for a man is 79, how can 78 not be elderly?

FrancisCrawford · 11/04/2018 17:25

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miffytherabbit1974 · 11/04/2018 17:26

@MagneticMan

"The burglar's family don't live in Hither Green so by that logic they shouldn't be there either."

I agree. As mentioned in my previous comment, the presence of the dead man's family is deeply unhelpful and extremely provocative. However, that doesn't make the behaviour of the "vigilantes" any less problematic IMO.

InfiniteSheldon · 11/04/2018 17:29

And I think the 'vigilantes' are behaving in a way that the police should be. I'm glad that they're coming in and protecting residents too terrified to stand up for themselves, too fearful of retribution to prevent this appalling ongoing attack on a man an elderly man who was defending his disabled wife. The police should have stopped this when the first 'floral tribute'. (veiled threat) went up. The police should have taken it down and said no this is not acceptable instead of which they have allowed, nay encouraged this situation to happen. Thank God for the so-called vigilantes they're the ones on the moral high ground.

FrancisCrawford · 11/04/2018 17:31

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miffytherabbit1974 · 11/04/2018 17:32

@FrancisCrawford

I already agree with 99.9 percent of your comment, as I made clear in my longer previous comment.

"The fact the are travellers is actually incidental."

It is incidental to me, and it might well be incidental to you too. However, I've seen countless examples of out and out bigotry towards the traveller community being played out on social media over the last few days. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that this particular situation being played out on a street corner has functioned as an excuse to say all manner of disgusting things about travellers as a distinct group.

stitchglitched · 11/04/2018 17:33

If they aren't removed though, it is giving them the greenlight to keep it as a shrine. What is to stop them all gathering there on his birthday, the anniversary of his death etc? They need to be told to get lost frankly. Some of the comments from his relatives are awful and it is clearly designed as an act of defiance and intimidation. Maybe people getting angry and taking them down will show them that not everyone can be bullied. I can see a few for sale signs going up soon though.

MagneticMan · 11/04/2018 17:34

@Miffy

"I agree. As mentioned in my previous comment, the presence of the dead man's family is deeply unhelpful and extremely provocative. However, that doesn't make the behaviour of the "vigilantes" any less problematic IMO."

Well I agree with you there. The thing is, the "vigilantes" wouldn't be there if the family hadn't turned the fence opposite the gentleman's house into a tacky shrine. The family should never have been allowed to turn this into a 3 ring circus in the first place. Now it's just a silly tit for tat that will probably end in violence.

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