Noisy church

[DoctorWhatTheFuck]

I went to church this week for the first time in years for a christening, which was during the normal service.

OMG the noise.

There were children crying and not being taken out. Some eating loudly. Some whining. Some talking in their normal voices. Some running around. It added up to the priest actually having to shout to be barely heard.

Can’t people teach children to sit quietly for an hour? It was certainly not like this at church when I was growing up.

Even if you are not religious, it is clear that it is a quiet environment, not a soft play area.

It’s clear these children know there will be no consequences for playing silly buggers. I don’t mean hitting them, I mean a 7 yo knowing he won’t get to play on the wii when he gets home if he keeps it up. Even a toddler can be entertained to sit quietly, and as a parent you inconvenience yourself by taking a crying child out rather than inconvenience everyone else with the noise.

What the actual fuck is going on with parenting!

I was interested in what other faiths feel about this. Was just reading about advice for taking children into mosques.

The bit i've read so far seems to say that peaceful prayer is not to be compromised. However ... children aren't expected to sit quiet until they are 5 to 8 ish and so aren't subjected to the ordeal of having to sit still for ages expected to go to mosque until they can manage it without a fuss. Seems sensible tbh.

The last time we went to church was for DD2's Christening. It was a full church as they'd booked her in on Battle of Britain day, before they realised there would be a military aspect/ remembrance part.

The vicar joked that he'd never done a Christening with a black stole on before.

After the christening part we took DD2 to the children's corner to unwind her a little (just a little chatty, not running around). One of the 'helpers' at the church told me that I'd have to take her out for the 2 minute silence.

We practice the 2 minute silence all year (great tip for standing quietly in queues is to get a timer out and 'practice'. We're up to five minutes now ) and DH has done 22 years in the military. We get it. But for DD2 to be asked to leave the building not 5 minutes after being 'welcomed' to the church family. Well we left all right.

The vicar is trying to make a family church, but there is resistance in the older members who want the archtypical silent, staring as the vicar preaches, service. It's not like the children run riot. It's a small town which still has a community feel and there's a lot of takes-a-village parenting. Mine were hissed at encouraged to be quiet and sit, or go to the kid's corner and colour. Very few children roamed free.

I might try taking the DDs back now that they are older and see if it's more welcoming.

Oblomov I went to church when I was 4. I had no problem sitting absolutely still and quiet for 15-20 minutes in main church until Sunday School and nor did any of the other kids. On occasion, even for an hour (Christmas carol services).

Agree Shatners.
I was responding to a pp where they said that kids don't sit still anymore, not even in school.

Ds1 just told me that he sat through assemblies in primary of 30 minutes to 45 minutes.

It’s people like you op that drive families away from church.

Children are noisemakers , it’s impossible to keep an 18m old tot quiet, also the children hear everyone singing, they’re not old enough to understand that they have specific times to sing and times to listen.

Are you deluded enough to believe that it’s only this generation that makes noise and that your children were perfect?

Instead of being so preachy, how about engaging with the little ones, or is that beneath you?

I think you’re better off staying at home and watching a church service on the telly love, at least that way you don’t have to witness real people whilst thanking imaginary god for all the wonders of the universe including noisy kids.

When I was about 18mo old and kicking off in church, my mum went to go outside with me and the vicar actually chased her up the aisle and told her to come back because I had just as much right to be there as anybody else!
I agree there is a time and a place for quiet reflection but the bigger Sunday services (especially baptisms where there will probably be cousins and siblings of the child being baptised) tend to be raucous! The biggest culprit for running up and down the aisle in my church used to be the curate's daughter who would come to give him a hug mid-sermon!

Anyone who has seen those churches with gospel choirs etc. on TV (or actually been to one themselves) knows that there's more than one way to worship!

Joy I don't think the OP was specifically referring to only 18-month olds but toddlers and children in general. And I'm sorry but it IS possible to keep small children - as opposed to toddlers - relatively quiet for a reasonable period of time and it's a skill kids actually need to learn.

surely it’s not a great idea to put off all the adults without kids
This ^^. I go to the 8am service because it's peaceful with no kids. I couldn't cope with the 10.30am family service. And there's only 1 service during the week so not much choice.
There's a big difference between encouraging children and allowing them to run riot. If they're charging round screaming then what are they learning about God and the church? Nothing.

I'm on the fence here OP. From what I can gather your post suggests the noise from tots was only a small part of your annoyance. It sounds like you're as annoyed by the adults lack of courtesy in not hushing up. Christenings are never going to be silent, and kids need to be in adult positions if they're ever going to learn, but surely a free for all is not a good thing either? I'm not religious, but if you're going in to a church I don't think it is too much to ask of an to shut up and let the vicar talk.

*an adult

At our Easter vigil. (Small RC Cathedral so fairly formal. The family of one of the candidates for baptism were quite noisy. Dad then cracked open a box of Capri sun and stayed giving them out. Cue lots of noisy slurping and chatting. I was very Fortunately they then left immediately after the baptism and didn't bother to stay for the confirmation.

I go to church regularly. The kids that attend week-in week-out usually behave reasonably well. The ones that come on the monthly family service can be a bit noisier. The ones that attend only on one-off occasions like baptisms and weddings are the ones that race around the church, wreck the toys in the kids area and are given snacks and iPads to distract them during the service.

So the OP probably had a particularly bad experience due to it being a baptism service.

My church is very much all about including young people. They don’t race around wildly but there’s a table with pens and paper etc and a big sofa for them all to hang out on at the back. There’s loads of space for them to dance around (the worship is lively and very modern).

After the worshipthey go out to their groups which are great. Really interactive and they love it. It’s a huge church though and we’ve got about 80-90 young people that come regularly from little ones to 18.

That’s so sad that you feel like that OP.

At my church children are welcomed and are a huge part of the church! It’s their church too, not just the adults that can sit quietly.

We have children stay for the worship (modern lively songs) and announcements and then leave for kids class/church. Then several times a year kids will stay in for the full service.

There has to be a balance I feel though between children being allowed to talk, play, eat, etc and kids running around, climbing the walls, throwing things, trying to get on stage, touching the musicians equipment (all things I have seen). At quiet times I obviously encourage my children to be quiet, but they are kids and sometimes they will let me know very loudly that their brother took the crayon they were using, or they have finished a snack or of course that they ‘need a POO!!’

Church isn’t just for people who can sit quietly for an hour or so.

The quote is ''Suffer,little children..'' meaning christians are the children who may suffer on account of their faith,not that we have to put up with badly behaved kids!

Well I think its rude. A church is supposed to be a place of worship, not a bloody free for all.

You know that is the exact opposite of what the bible says Jesus actually preached right? You genuinely don't belong in the church if you have a problem with it because you aren't going to worship, because your attitude flies in the face of the stated wishes of the man you are supposedly worshipping.

Deschain I believe you misunderstand the meaning of that bible verse, as do many of the people quoting it. It means don't hinder children from getting to know Jesus/God. Maybe it could be used more broadly to mean people who aren't familiar with God and church. (I think use of the word 'suffer' is a bit archaic in the verse and other translations are clearer.)

It doesn't mean church is a place for children to run around and play like they play elsewhere, with no regard for the message, even when they are old enough to begin to be involved. Some play is fine, especially for babies and toddlers but it does need to be contained a little by parents.

Depends: do you want a silent church with a tiny congregation behaving the way you think is suitable, or a noisier one with a big congregation which might behave in ways you don't approve of?

Also, as many pp have pointed out, it was a christening service, which are generally the free-for-alls of church services.

I understand making children welcome and not expecting silence but I don't see what anyone gains from them shrieking and running amok. They ( and everyone else) can't hear a thing and as they shouldn't behave anywhere else like except a park then they're not learning anything either.

Poor kids. I remember being dragged to church as a child. Hated every minute of it, maybe if they had made it more child friendly I wouldn't have escaped at the first opportunity.... But glad I did. Also glad I didn't 'learn anything'... You shouldn't force beliefs, although I get the concept, get them young and they are more susceptible.

It doesn't have to be one of those two options, sinceyouask. Many thriving churches don't have children being excessively noisy and disruptive. Their energy is channeled with age-appropriate groups, a crèche and dedicated child-focussed services. Otherwise young children don't get much out of church and having them there just enables their parents to attend.

Many of the churches that actively involve children are more likely to have enduring church members since they are not the kind of churches people attend with the ulterior motive of getting their child into a particular school.

I attend church regularly and normally go to the family friendly service. The other ones are just too dull.

It is easy enough to tune out a certain amount of children's noise and most parents take their DCs out if they are really screaming. It can also enhance some of the duller parts of the service (why do most priests drone on so long in their homilies? Just make your point and sit down man!) when a child makes a run for the altar.

I love seeing and hearing the little kids at Mass. It's the adults that whisper throughout the service that get on my nerves.

It does seem a bit counter productive to go to a service to listen to a talk, if nobody can hear what's said.

I can't think where else people would do that.

I see the church like the cinema that way. If people are trying to listen then it's rude to block them with your kids non-stop antics.

I actually don't think its your place to tell me if i belong in the church or not, Tringley, don't think you've been appointed that particular role just yet. How very Christian of you
If you're going to quote me, do it properly and include all of what I said, you missed out where I asked why some parents think its ok to let their kids run riot. And I absolutely do not think church is the place to let scooters be ridden up and down the aisles, or for constant shouting and screaming. However, as I said in my second post which you've conveniently ignored, children should be encouraged and having toys, crayons etc at the back is a good thing. But church is not a playground, I don't see what's so hard to understand about that. People go for all kinds of reasons, including to find peace and comfort, and little Isabella on her iPad is not going to assist that....its not about banning children, that would be crazy, but about having consideration for all in the congregation. Hth

I too have been shocked at how behaviour in church has declined in last 20 years

Maybe churches have just changed. My childhood church allowed kids to play in the aisles and had boxes of toys for family services in the 70’s. Admittedly that was fairly unusual for cofe at the time