78 pensioner arrested for fatally stabbing burglar in his own home

[SShaming]

2 burglars break into a 78 year old man’s home armed with screwdriver.

Forces owner into the kitchen whilst one of them goes upstairs.

A fight ensues, leaving pensioner with injuries to his arm and burglary is fatally stabbed. Perhaps with his own screwdriver although this is TBC.

Police arrest pensioner.

On what planet is this right?

I won't sign it because I don't agree with it. As much as I can sympathise and empathise with the victim's family, I believe passionately in fundamental principles like presumption of innocence and burden of proof - better 10 guilty men go free than 1 innocent man be wrongfully convicted. I don't want our courts to have the freedom to effectively assume someone was e.g. driving dangerously or under the influence in the absence of any evidence and I dont believe leaving the scene of an accident in and of itself merits up to 14 years. Besides, the proposal has a major flaw in it, the criteria applying it specifically to fatal accidents. That creates a legal and logical minefield and would result in very bad legislation if implemented.

Late to this thread, but I was quite shocked that if my dogs attacked a burglar whilst we are at home, we could be charged with having dangerous animals and not keeping them under control.
I know my dogs ( pretty big), would attack a burglar if we were threatened in any way. So to protect my beloved dogs, apparently I should lock them in a room and let the burglars get on with it.....

Ludricous isen't it Susanne, they are under control, and contained in your home. That burglar is trespassing, and has not right to be there!

In a civilized society we can’t take the law into our own hands. And if you have a dog that will seriously injure or even kill a person then it needs to be better trained.

And yet there are people who will enter someone else's home with the intention of harming and terrifying them.

I fucking hate people sometimes!!

alreadytaken I don't agree with the petition either. My FIL died in a car accident and my MIL was angry for years that the other driver wasn't prosecuted. But that was because she couldn't accept that her DH had made a mistake in pulling out into the road when a car was coming, and the driver wasn't able to stop. It really was simply a tragic accident. But she was very angry with the police for a very long time.

So yes, I have huge sympathy for anyone who's lost a loved one in a car accident, it's a horrible thing to go through. But that doesn't mean that the driver of the other car is necessarily to blame just because they're still alive.

Because one's dog mauling a scumbag who broke into your home is uncivilized, whereas smearing an unconvicted man as a murderer is the height of culture. Apparently

And if you have a dog that will seriously injure or even kill a person then it needs to be better trained.

if the dog defend his family and protect his owners, I'd say he is very well trained!

It is under control, in your own private home. It is not out in public. The burglar has no right to be there. All dogs have the potential to injure if threatened.

Exactly ikeep, it's protecting the family against possible harm. Our homes are our safe spaces and sanctuary, if somebody invades that without consent be it at their risk of injury or harm.

Police dogs and security dogs manage to deter and protect without mauling. Or would you be happy if they mauled suspected criminals too?

whereas smearing an unconvicted man as a murderer is the height of culture. Apparently

Only if you don't understand what being "arrested on suspicion" actually means. Nobody was smeared as a murderer in this case, except in the minds of the ignorant.

The thing is though, Lizzie. Burglary is not accidental. It's a deliberate deceitful violation. What was he (Richard) supposed to do let them run and mock and take what they want terrifying both him and his wife in the process. He was armed with a screw driver FGS. He obviously intended to use it.
He lived by the sword. He died by the sword. I'm not playing any violins.

“Only if you don't understand what being "arrested on suspicion" actually means. Nobody was smeared as a murderer in this case, except in the minds of the ignorant.”

Whale is referring to the fact that I said the man had murdered someone. And ignoring the fact that I retracted the word and replaced it with killed. Because it doesn’t fit with her “you’re all pro burglar” narrative.

You also implied he used unreasonable force and said you expected him to be charged.

I agree, I was addressing the issue with the petition re 61 days, that was about a car accident. Burglary isn't the same at all.

Given that the man's dead, that's a fairly reasonable inference.

Not really. He hasn't been charged and there is no evidence yet of unreasonable force.

Well, if the person is dead it does suggest that unreasonable force might have been used. And yes, I do hope he is charged. That way a jury can decide whether or not he is guilty of anything. This is not something I want the police or public opinion to decide.

This is rambling and won't make much sense but I am trying to get at how sad and senseless it all is.

So this man was never going to straighten up, let's face it. He'd grown up in a family of thieves and crooks; he'd done it all his life; he'd been to prison before and come straight back and and done it again. He was also prepared to target the most vulnerable in society, which is just disgusting. He will have left a lot of people with a lot of scars, some mental, some physical.

So you're either left with spending a lot of money to keep him in prison for life, or locking him up for a bit and then waiting for him to do it again. Neither of which is ideal.

But there is no way he deserved to die, whichever way you cut the cake, and he's British, so we can't deport him. So you're left with a non-ideal solution as above.

But then you look at the reports of his family and his upbringing and you think Jesus, he never stood a chance . Talk about "they fuck you up, your mum and dad".

And then what about his own kids? What are they like; what sort of example do the adults in their life set them?

Add that to the mix of social media and all the Stuff that is flaunted around these days which make a quick fix like theft seem more appealing than a minimum wage job and...

Well it's all just a massive massive mess. How does society ever start to unpick it??

TooTrueToBeGood

Nobody was smeared as a murderer in this case, except in the minds of the ignorant.

Au contraire! Here's that "civilized" smear again, for those that missed it:

BertrandRussell Wed 04-Apr-18 22:21:15
Oh of course you can't just kill other people with no consequences. Of course he has to be arrested and charged - he murdered someone!

Who's the ignorant one now?

P.s. Note the crucial word "charged" in the quote above - not just arrested for the sake of due process, not just investigated, but charged with murder. Your own words, Bertrand!

It's interesting that those defending the home owner are told they must be detectives, know more than the police, don't believe in/ understand due process, but it's fine to make assumptions and judgements in the other direction.

Give it a rest, whales. That was retracted pages and pages ago.

Just so long as the burglars don't go to John Wick's house bad move

“It's interesting that those defending the home owner are told they must be detectives, know more than the police, don't believe in/ understand due process, but it's fine to make assumptions and judgements in the other direction.”

Nobody knows exactly what happened, so It is foolish to make any assumptions or judgements. We should leave that to the jury. That’s what juries are for.