AIBU or are we all going to be trapped in the UK from next March?

[Clarissalarissa]

So, Ryanair and Thomas Cook are inserting clauses in their booking terms to say that if your flight abroad doesn't go ahead because of Brexit that's your problem. No doubt others will follow. If any deal is ever done, to allow planes to fly, it is bound to be a lot more expensive than it is now.

Is everyone planning many years of UK-only holidaying?

Oh, good the EU as a sinister, evil punisher trope now. Brexiter bingo. I'll have a full house soon.

@scaryteacher You should know that the crossing from Dunkirk to Dover isn't 'many hours'...it's 2 hours. Less time than I spend hanging around at the airport.

You forgot that you have to check in an hour before sailing and that it can take an hour to get off at the other end - no problem if you're only travelling to Dover, but no use to anyone north of the Thames who has at least another 3 hours travel time, whereas Stansted to almost anywhere in Europe is a 90-120 minute hop.

You also neglected to mention the 3-day queues that will build up at Dover, Calais and Dunkirk, and the likelihood that trucks will be given priority - you know that Mrs May has promised Nissan and Toyota that their precious car components won't be delayed, and Airbus needs to get it's wings across the Channel to the factory in France.

FYI - there are no ferries to Denmark from the UK, nor is there any longer 'a myriad of ferry ports' serving UK-EU passenger routes.

we travelled before the EU
Yup, but international standards on passports only finalised in the late 70s

When we joined the EU, many countries dd not have passports
kids could travel based on a photo stuck into a parents' passport
there were no electronic visas
residency was allowed based on handwritten notes by individual border officers (I still have mine)

In fact before the EU there were effectively open borders
YUP
Lets go back to that !!!!

Considering Britain, we will most certainly give up on our dream of holidays in Scotland and Wales after Brexit. Why bother? We will also stop visiting Northern Ireland, at the moment it's extremely convenient but with hard borders, the whole of the Northern Ireland can just focus on American tourists because there's no way I will be registering my car with a foreign state for the honour of spending my money there.

Was it heck as like! hmm It was 44 years ago, not the fecking dark ages!

Well, things were quite different, yes. A third as many people travelled through Heathrow each year. A quarter of current volumes through Gatwick. Etc etc.

This is going to be like the millennium bug isn’t it?

No, it's not. People spent a good few years and shedloads of money upgrading software so that we were prepared and it didn't happen. Not so with shouting "We're leaving" and not having the foggiest idea whether the planes will fly or not.

sigh

Elton, it’s not the EU. We need to have agreements in place to fly our aeroplanes. When we leave the EU we will no longer be covered by EU agreements. We need to negotiate new agreements - with everyone (did you see the news that US are giving us worse terms after Brexit than we had while covered by the EU agreement?) Achieving agreements is not impossible, but it is if we’re doing nothing to progress them.

The EU are not doing this - we are.

Oh for goodness' sake - how do you think people went on holiday before we were in the EU

In my neck of the woods people took the ferry. But the ferries stopped around 10 years ago. The only connection between the UK and Scandinavia is air. Closest ferry is Hook of Holland, which just isn't feasible if you're in Stockholm.

Reading this interesting thread but I just can't get over fucking arseholes calling posters hun and hysterical. Very misogynistic arguing points that can fuck right off.

rufus how about a nice cruise across the Atlantic? If you’re willing to spend the entire time on a static bike (rather than stuffing your face on the 24 /7 buffet) you can claim that you cycled there.

I don’t get remainer logic. If the EU is prepared to behave in such a punitive fashion towards a country who wants to leave that it effectively suspends travel and trade entirely and leaves us all in a position where we’re stranded and eating grass, how can they claim that organisation is some sort of moral force for good that we want to be associated with.

It's the will of the people. Brexit supporters voted to leave the EU and in doing so decided to tear up 750 treaties that the UK has with the EU and the rest of the world. Brexiters voted to leave and are now getting very upset when the consequences of that vote become ever more apparent. The UK is not getting kicked out of the EU and nor is the EU punishing the UK for Brexit. You won, so get over it and start putting some realistic plans in place to ensure that we're not stranded and eating grass.

Peregrines spot on

@Eltonjohnssyrup are you deluded? Like May when she asked Merkel to make Brexit a success? What interest should the EU have in making Brexit a success? Britain wants out, lay out the terms and bloody leave. You realise that there's barely any British owned company left? That most companies traditionally considered British are multinationals,US, German or Swiss owned? Britain is now dependent on agreements with other countries, the likes of the US, China, Saudi Arabia on their terms, not the British ones. Nobody is going to call May memsahib anymore, doesn't matter how hard she is trying to resuscitate Commonwealth. The ship of the Empire has passed long time ago.

Having read these last few threads, it's becoming clear to me that the only leavers still posting on MN are the really really really really really stupid ones. Have we finally reached the stage where we should just stop trying to engage with them? They appear to understand absolutely nothing that anyone says, even assuming that they read it. Either that or it is all a pretence - because, really, now many people, who have been on Mumsnet and reading these threads for the past year and a half, do not have any understanding of why Brexit is not a good idea and is not working out?

GSG, what’s wrong with hun? Have I made a faux pas?

agnes

I am supposed to be using the unused rowing machine in our garage

Maybe i could row to Europe

I recall travelling to Denmark in the mid seventies. From Victoria Station via the channel ports, then across to Germany and the Ferry from Puttgarten to Roedby and on to Copenhagen, it took the better part of 24 hours. Our train was late leaving Victoria, so we missed the ferry we should have caught. A companion travelling on to Finland - ferry via the Oeresund and then across Sweden and ferry to Helsinki reckoned that this 1/2 delay would add an extra day to what was already a two day journey, because of the missed connections. Not all of these ferries run any more.

I have been to many countries outside the EU on holiday. Lots of people from outside the EU go on holiday to countries within the EU. Some I show a passport, some I show a passport and visa, its not overly different or traumatic to have one extra bit of paper.

We are having a transitional extension until 2020/2021, so there is plenty of time to sort this out.

Why would the EU or UK suddenly ban holidays to each others countries? We are not leaving Europe, dropping off the planet or growing two horns. Its just bonkers going around spreading these fears of being 'trapped'.

Michael o’Leary is spreading fear because he is Irish and wants to stop Brexit, because if he can find an excuse to put up prices and make more profit he will and because he is a professional shit stirrer.

220,000 EU nationals immigrating to the UK last year, so Brexit doesn't seem to be putting them off coming here.

This hysteria is whipped up by people to generate fear to cause people to change their minds about Brexit. The ideology of 'if you throw enough mud some will stick'. What they don't seem to realise is that it makes Brexiteers more justified and determined that we are doing the right thing.

Ridiculous. Just like when the world
was going to end in the millennium

Oh, good the EU as a sinister, evil punisher trope now. Brexiter bingo. I'll have a full house soon.

Well, yes, this is exactly the sort of hypocrisy I mean. This thread has been started by a remainer claiming that we’re all going to be effectively imprisoned in the UK and various other apocalyptic scenarios. All of which could only happen if the EU took an incredibly punitive and intransigent position on Brexit.

Yet at the same time they sneer at the very notion that the EU could be some kind of sinisterly punitive organisation.

You can’t have them both luv. It just doesn’t make sense.

So I assume sheasks that you’re prepared to admit most of the threatened scenarios are extremely unlikely to happen if you think the idea the EU would behave punitively is so ridiculous?

This is the problem with remainers, they want people to believe these horrendous scenarios can happen. They also want us to believe that the EU is a wonderful moral and reasonable organisation. But it’s simply impossible for both those things to be true.

Why is this thread in AIBU and not Politics, maybe ask to get it moved

Why would the EU or UK suddenly ban holidays to each others countries?
If the UK brings in visas for Europeans, why would they not ?

Walking you'd think. They've already fannied about getting nowhere for a year!

Mad that one has already been done in here...