AIBU to ask you for signs a marriage won't last?

[Hofty]

m.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/signs-a-marriage-wont-last-according-to-wedding-photographers_us_5a871dfee4b05c2bcaca8db9

I was reading this^ earlier. I think these 'signs' are largely nonsense, but it got me wondering... has anyone got any signs a marriage won't last they'd like to share? Has anyone ever noticed any 'red flags', so to speak, and been right?

DP and I are getting married this summer, but this is not in any way inspired our relationship, I'm just reading a lot on the topic of marriage at the moment.

I'll share first, it's probably an obvious one. I think a sign a marriage won't last is if either party is entering into it through a sense of obligation, for example when my grandparents married (at 16!!) they were expecting a baby and social norms at that time meant that they had to get married. They are the least compatible couple I've ever known and both openly admit they would never have done so if my grandmother hadn't been pregnant.

I'd say a very expensive wedding that's more about the photographs than the promises

I wouldn't say expensive, because I don't think it's about the cost.

But, when a lot of time and stress is put into the details of the day, to detriment of the current relationship.

So when one partner is so focussed on making the wedding favours/ensuring they have the right kind of seat covers/getting the right decorations for the cake etc etc, that they don't have time to go for a meal with their partner. Dont have time to notice if their partner is upset at the moment. Etc.

Money does come into it, if you've spent so much money on a wedding, it puts you in trouble for married life.

Also if it's obvious that one partner is obsessed with wedding day minutae, and the other couldn't give a flying fuck and is sick of the whole bloody thing and their partners obsession with it.

I think that dh and I were pretty much go with the flow for the wedding day - i hate my pictures though and wish i hadn't bought a 'reduced in the sale dress' that the woman talked me into. i was never a bridezilla

• these days its all social media and who can outdo who and all the rest. I know people in huge debt all for one day, but guessing the price of things has tripled since late 80s of course and its a big business.

Also if it's obvious that one partner is obsessed with wedding day minutiae

The fascinating thing about That Sort Of Wedding is that no-one cares anyway. The reason you get a little sewing kit in some hotels is that there are guidebooks for which "is there a little sewing kit" is the difference between two different star ratings; no-one is expected to use it (if you're in a five star hotel and a button falls off, are you really going to do it yourself?) but it's there as a signifier. A lot of wedding stuff is the same: no-one, other than various sorts of -zillas, cares about centrepieces or matching suits or whatever. The last thing smooth old money would do is wear matching clothes or have new matching crockery: it's a variation on "the sort of man who has to buy his own furniture". The guests certainly don't care. "This wedding is terrible, the bridal party's suits don't match and the centrepieces aren't handmade" said no-one, ever.

But a certain sort of couple, or their parents, gets obsessed by this sort of thing. It's a completely mystery why.

There are the marriage vows e.g. sickness and in health, better or for worse, for richer for poorer. It's only the 'be faithful to each other' vow that ends the marriage.

I accept that non-adherence to the other 'sounds nice' vows will break down trust. But the big one, so to speak, is the breaking of the faithful vow.

Sadly, I've come across several marriages that broke down because the wife got breast cancer and the husband couldn't cope with it. These were younger couples too .

Men , generally, cant cope with illness ( not all men, but a lot ) I also know a few people whose marriage hit the rocks if they have a child with a disability - my mums old neighbour's hubby walked out on her and her child with non verbal autism as he found it too much. you have to take the rough with the smooth and some people cant handle the rough either. its very sad and marriage is hard work - my own dh is very much ' don't make a fuss' and cant handle illness. i dread to think what he would do if i became really ill myself or one of the kids.

The average age for first-time marriers is 32 for men and 30 for women in England, beetlejizz why would you think over thirty means it's more likely to be a second marriage?

I know it's a regional thing but I'm 30 and don't know anyone who's gotten married in my friendship circle so far. A couple of them are engaged but with no date set to wed.

It's quite rare to marry before 30 these days.

Because the older you get, the more likely it is to be a second marriage simply because people can't marry before 18. Or 16 with parental permission. And older people are more likely to have been married before.

So for example, given that you need to be married 1 year to divorce, 0% of 16 year olds marrying will be second timers. There is a cohort in the under 30 marriage group who couldn't possibly be second timers, so they affect the stats, whereas that's not the case for people over 30. That 0% figure isn't the same for 30 year olds, or 40 year olds, or anyone older. And eg the percentage of 80 year olds who've never married is quite small, so 80 year olds marrying are much more likely to have been married before. More so than 30 year olds marrying.

This is not the same thing as saying that a significant percentage of marriages of people in their early 30s will be second timers. Just that it will be higher than marriages of people who are in their early 20s and the percentage tends to climb the older people get.

Also, it's not quite rare to marry before 30. Think about those stats. If the average age for women to marry is 30, how likely is it that few enough women marry before 30 for it to be considered rare?

I think the signs aren't always so obvious. The best wedding I've ever attended (apart from my own obviously!) was one of my closest friends. She'd been with her husband 14 years, I lived with them both at uni and their relationship seemed "perfect" even living in the same house with them. Out of all my friends they were the pair I'd have said were least likely to divorce.

As it turns out things weren't as great as it looked on the surface, basically their sex life was absent (the husband not wanting to), this had been an issue before they got married but as they were "best friends" my friend naively still went through with it. They barely made it to their second anniversary, my friend realised she couldn't live in a sexless marriage, they were basically just mates. I only found all this out a few months ago and I've been friends with them since before they were together. I was very surprised and sad when they decided to separate.

Another sign that's more obvious is wanting a wedding rather than the marriage that comes with it! I'm often suss when people marry very young (early 20s) too, I think you still have a lot of growing to do at that age and the chances of you growing apart are much greater than if you marry just a few years later (my personal opinion obviously and something more applicable to today rather than say my parent's generation).

With hindsight I should have noticed that he didn't really listen to me,or even really know me. He only saw the bits he wanted to, not the whole person. I am now very aware that I ignored signs of controlling behaviour and lack of self awareness. However I still think all could have been worked through if both parties had been committed to making it work.

we got married at 24 ( me ) and 26 him, we are still together as we grew up together - i was so naive though about it all, i thought it would be great with roses round the door and all sorts. my siblings married very young , think 19 -20 etc - my sil was barely 19, but they have all lasted.
you cant tell really. its all hit and miss and my friends in their late 40s early 50s , most of them are divorced now.

We got married at 25 him/26 me, in 1992 and we are still together.
We have gone through many changes in our lives, times we've needed to support each other and trying times.
We communicate well and never go to bed on an argument.
Neither of us will allow sulking or ignoring the other, it was seriously a deal breaker for us both.
It's worked for us, and I think it stopped resentment building up and both have had to compromise over the years as it was important for us both to make the marriage happy.

Disagree with a lot of the 'indicators'on here.

I was a teenager when we met , together 5 years before marriage, didn't live together first. Spent a lot of time apart at our reception, making sure that one or other of us spoke to each and every guest. There were more of 'my' side at our wedding. His family consisted of parents, siblings one aunt and one uncle. Mine is bigger and guests included grandparents, aunts, uncles and cousins as well as my dad's new family.
Based on some of these, Dh and I shouldn't have made it beyond 35 days, let alone 35 years! However, despite what people who do not know is May suggest, we are actually very happy. We communicate, we support each other, we have shared views and values for the most part, with just enough differences between us to keep things interesting.

Looking at my friends who are divorced, I'd say family disapproval on one side makes a marriage vulnerable. If that's the only factor, it has a chance, but add in others and it gets very difficult.

Not having come to an agreement about children is another huge risk factor.

A situation where one partner isn't there a lot of the time is also a big risk. Like family disapproval, it can be worked round if that's the only problem, but it puts a big strain on a relationship.

My in laws disapproved of me ‘nicking’ their son. Even I’m amazed we made this far - could still go wrong though I’m aware of that.

Disapproval definitely makes things harder, as would marrying someone who's family you hate - not because there's anything wrong with you or them, but you just don't get on.

Only two couples in my social circle are divorced and both took me completely by surprise as they were both couples I was quite jealous of as they seemed so loved up - one of those couples who believe they're soul mates and meant to be etc etc. One divorced due to one party not wanting children and one due to infidelity. Sometimes I wonder if you're used to being the fairytale couple, it's harder to cope with the dreary days when you're skint & getting on each other's nerves.

They were all quite quirky/punky people yet both had fairly expensive stately home style weddings which while beautiful, didn't feel like 'them' at all.

I also work with a lady who was with her partner 14 years before they got married and then separated 7 weeks after the wedding. I don't know her well enough to know the details though!!

I've been at a couple of weddings where I didn't think the couple would last. One was a big wedding. The groom proposed because his girlfriend had dumped him. At the wedding ceremony, he didn't look at her once. They lasted a couple of years.

Another one was one the couple would have described as 'passionate'. They'd have lots of screaming rows complete with namecalling and hurtful accusations then dramatically make up and be all loved up. That fizzled down to basically a mutually abusive marriage and they've fucked up their kids with the poor role modelling.

Marriage where one party thinks it will change the other, or change their relationship. It won't. It never does.

Only two couples in my social circle are divorced and both took me completely by surprise as they were both couples I was quite jealous of as they seemed so loved up - one of those couples who believe they're soul mates and meant to be etc etc. One divorced due to one party not wanting children and one due to infidelity. Sometimes I wonder if you're used to being the fairytale couple, it's harder to cope with the dreary days when you're skint & getting on each other's nerves.

Or is it perhaps that being so loved up, they knew there was a life beyond their relationship? It is also about self respect, at the end of the day, so many people stay in miserable marriages because they have lost sight on what a good/healthy/caring/considerate relationship is and have given hope life will be better if they leave.

I'm surprised posters are saying NOT living together is a red flag, I recall reading a study that said the exact opposite: living together before marriage increases the likelihood of divorce

I think it used to be the case that people who lived together pre-marriage were considered to be less conventional, and therefore more willing to end a marriage if it wasn't working, whereas more conventional people wouldn't cohabit pre-marriage and then felt obliged to stay in a marriage however unhappy it was. So not that living together caused divorce. More that the sort of people who lived together were also more likely to consider divorce

I think the keys to a successful relationship are -

respect, tolerance and consideration
similar attitudes to money
similar moral codes
similar sex drive

I’ve known marriages break down because of infertility. In one case a couple couldn’t have children together but both went on to have them with other people. It honestly never occurred to me to leave my marriage because we couldn’t have children.

Also sometimes the couple are getting married because they really want to have children, they know their choice of partner isn’t ideal but they think they “will do”. Unfortunately a mutual desire for children isn’t always enough for a lasting marriage.

People who focus on wedding... not marriage. I dont get the cult of marriage... puts a lot of pressure on perfectly happy couples.

Notsure that's an interesting point. I hadn't thought of it like that before.

@aurynne because often the couples in question come back for anniversary/family/maternity/baby Photography. And we are able to see via social media engagement (I'm also a wedding photographer)

Weddings that are expensive and extravagant because the bride is mummy and daddy's spoilt little princess because she's their only daughter and have family money. Daughter had picked a normal, down to earth bloke (because he's fun , normal and good in bed) who has a trade job as opposed to the "well bred" office guy mummy and daddy would have liked her to have chosen.

Things then fall apart because the husband can't give her the lifestyle in which daddy had made her accustomed too and things brake down.

I know of so many "uptown girls" who go for "down town boys" for some reason.

DH and I know a couple who are getting married this year. Unfortunately, I wouldn’t be surprised if it ended badly (obviously I hope it won’t!) one has a very expensive hobby, the other resents then spending money on it and at the moment is convincing them not to. They have a very fiery relationship- one was about to leave the other a week before they got engaged. They were only together a year before getting engaged, and one of them had come out of a long-term relationship a month before they met.

None of those factors individually would cause me to fear the worst, but together...