Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

WWYD- Lending money

150 replies

jacks11 · 25/02/2018 19:58

I torn- I feel like if I do then I'm being taken for a mug (and perhaps creating a rod for my own back), if I don't then it will have significant negative impact on DB/SIL and their DC.

For background: I don't have a good relationship with DB and SIL. Complex, but they do have a history of piss-taking (to quite breathtaking levels at time). They have 3 DC. DB works but not well paid, SIL hasn't worked for around 3 years- but has been attending college this year on a course with a view to go onto further qualifications (IF she completes this year).

As part of her funding, SIL gets some of her nursery fees paid for their youngest DC whilst she is at college (elder 2 at school). They have received a bill for this months fees- the college have refused to pay their part as her attendance has been so poor (as is in their conditions). Her absence has not been due to illness, from what I can gather. I'm actually not sure what she has been doing when her DC has been at nursery, not that it's any of my business.

DB did not know she was not attending college apparently- but they have called asking for me to lend the money (several £100's) as if they don't pay, the nursery will not take their DC until the outstanding is paid. They don't have the money, and won't have it any time soon. Without childcare SIL will not be able to continue college.

As I said, I don't have a good relationship with DB or SIL. They have behaved badly in the past. Including not paying back money lent to them previously. This has happened on more than one occasion- so more fool me for not learning the first time, I suppose. On the last occasion, I had reminded them several times- always vague promised but nothing forthcoming, so I gave one last reminder and said I wouldn't be constantly hounding them but if I wasn't repaid then I would not lend them anything in the future. And I have stuck to that to date.

I can easily afford to give them the money, that isn't an issue. I would feel like a mug. I also think this would lead to never ending requests for money- they are both terrible with money.

OTOH, if SIL were to complete the course and did get onto the training course then she would have the opportunity of better paid job with some security- clearly a benefit to their DC.

I have said no, but I'm now getting lots of messages from both of them. There is (small) part of me that feels like I should help, given that I can and given the stakes are quite high.

OTOH, I feel like if I give in now when I've previously said I would never lend money again, then I'm being a mug. I think they're reaping what they've sown as they have taken the piss quite a lot, meaning I don't feel especially inclined to help. Even more so as I think this will then trigger lots of requests for money- no doubt all will be "essentials" because they have spent money on the "non-essentials" on the premise that they will be bailed out. This is what happened in the past (e.g. needing for money for school uniform shoes as SIL had splurged on hair straighteners and haircut in a nice salon, for instance- this was several years ago). In addition, I feel like SIL got herself into this situation by her own stupidity and laziness, so perhaps it's a good thing that she feels the consequences of her own actions.

WWYD? I do feel mean, but on the other hand I don't feel I owe them anything given their previous behaviour. And if I give in this time, where will it end? There will always be another "emergency" or a "disaster' with potentially serious consequences if I don't give them money.

OP posts:
lalalalyra · 25/02/2018 21:50

The fact they launched at you about how "unfair" things are says it all. Remember that if you ever feel bad. It wasn't "I've fucked up", it wasn't "this is my last chance to make my children's lives better and I've realised I've nearly wrecked it" and it wasn't even "Please, we'll set up this standing order on x date and these are the payments". It was all about it being your fault. Which it isn't.

jacks11 · 25/02/2018 21:52

don

TBH we have very little contact usually- I only ever hear from them when they want something. Or if they are visiting our parents/at family events. Or very odd occasions when I have looked after their DC.

I know they are being CF's and normally I am very good at ignoring/rising above it. But the reason I was swaying on this one was that I see the huge advantages my DC have when compared to their DC and I can also see the potential benefit to them if SIL was able to get a better job with some security. Obviously, she clearly doesn't want it enough to do the work she needs to get to where she wants to be, so it's irrelevant, really.

But you're right, they are taking me for a mug. I don't even know if the whole story if true- though I do remember them saying when she started college that they were getting financial help with childcare costs as part of the funding package, so I think it is possible. Not that it matters now as I've said no.

OP posts:
li1972 · 25/02/2018 21:55

No chance! Why loan money (insert the word GIVE there because you won't get it back) to enable your sil to continue college when she didn't attend in the first place? Don't enable her. Their mess - they deal with it!

KC225 · 25/02/2018 21:58

Well done OP. You have done the right thing. Their insults and lack of self awareness is shocking. 'Thanks for nothing' when they made a conscious choice not to pay you back last time. Let them wallow in their blame mire.

Thedogsmells · 25/02/2018 22:01

Even if you paid this there is nothing to say she would start going to college again.

Snowysky20009 · 25/02/2018 22:06

Well done OP. Now stick to your guns!

Thymeout · 25/02/2018 22:08

What do your parents think? It sounds as if they've been burnt in the past as well.

If you have the spare cash, you could always set up a child ISA or something to help the dcs when they're older. But I'm pleased you've said no. It wouldn't have led to a better life. Just money down the drain.

lalalalyra · 25/02/2018 22:10

The thing you need to remember OP is this - colleges help their students.

I have a friend who gets childcare help as she's a student. She's had a bit of trouble with her attendance recently for really genuine reasons. She's been catching up on work at night and weekends and because it's genuine her classmates and lecturers have been helping her out. One even met up with her on a Sunday. The college have bent rules and used the hardship fund to help her because they know that it's all genuine (one of her children was very ill).

If your SIL's time off was remotely genuine the college and nursery would be helping her out. For them to get to the point of refusing to take the child/ren then she's obviously been taking the piss and not communicating with them.

Tistheseason17 · 25/02/2018 22:14

Well done, OP.
Stay strong.
I think they'll ask again.

Their issues are self made and not yours. To blame you for their behaviour is more evidence of their feckless, entitled attitude.

Throwing more money at them will not change their attitude - they'll just have nicer stuff when they next insult you.

Frequency · 25/02/2018 22:21

What's the college's attendance target? You should be able to find it online.

The college I attend has a target of 90% which sounds fair enough in theory, but if you're studying p/t it's less than two days off over the entire course. My attendance is 93% and I've had half a day off, due to being on my knees with flu. I am very far from failing my course.

I'm not saying you should lend the money but it might put a different slant on things if SIL only had a few days off.

cherish123 · 25/02/2018 22:21

The fact that she has not been attending and has not been ill means she probably won't finish the course even if you pay the money.

MyBrilliantDisguise · 25/02/2018 22:22

I've been thinking about this. I don't think the nursery would issue her with a bill. It's not like that. As far as I remember, the student pays their bill. If the nursery has been told by the college that the student hasn't been attending, they don't present the student with the entire bill. Most of the students involved would be on benefits and wouldn't be in a position to pay a large bill for childcare.

I'm glad you said no, but I'd question some other friends about how it works so that you get to the truth of it.

BMW6 · 25/02/2018 22:23

Your nieces and/or nephews are disadvantaged because their parents are irresponsible financially and take no responsibility for their piss poor choices.
It's not your fault in any way shape or form. Time they grew up.

If you get any more flack from them tell them to piss off.

Thymeout · 25/02/2018 22:30

MyBrilliantDisguise. I think the nursery invoiced the college and the college refused to pay because SIL, even tho' she had been warned, didn't reach the attendance requirements. So the nursery then presented SIL with the bill instead.

BadLad · 25/02/2018 22:30

Well done, jacks11.

Reading this, I was certain you were going to give in and set fire to another stack of your hard-earned.

Delighted that you haven't.

BewareOfDragons · 25/02/2018 22:36

DB has text to say "thanks for nothing, you know what this will mean for us" and SIL has sent a tirade saying she hopes I am "satisfied" with myself, how unfair it is that I am financially ok whilst they are not and I have no idea how awful it is to be skint all the time. How unfair it is that my DC have nicer lives than hers and this was her way of trying to make things better for them but that I have made sure this will never happen.

Your DB is blaming you for his wife's failure to follow through for herself, her DC and her husband. That is unreasonable.

Your SIL is blaming you for her own failure.

What's not fair in the situation is that they expect you to send them money whenever they make bad choices, don't do what they're supposed to, etc. Your children are in a better position than theirs because you have made and continue to make better choices.

You made the right decision. If your SIL was genuinely unable to attend classes, she school would be working with her. She's taking the piss with all of you. Your brother should probably stop blaming you and the world for her lack of desire to do better for his and the children's sake and take a serious look at why he's with her if this is how she's going to act.

ugghhreally · 25/02/2018 22:39

Apologies if this has already been said, but even taking the financial history out of the equation. SIL opted not to attend her course, she was warned that she was running the risk of losing childcare funding. Despite that, she till didn't attend. Personally I wouldn't loan (gift) any further money either directly or indirectly (to nursery). Your SIL sounds very selfish and accustomed to being bailed out. You have nothing to feel bad about.

Gemini69 · 25/02/2018 22:39

you absolutely did the right thing.. and their response proves they see you as nothing more than a loathsome convenient piggy bank that they envy ... block them Flowers

StripeyDeckchair · 25/02/2018 22:47

Don't give them the money. They still owe you money from the last time you lent them money from what I read of your post so don't make the matter worse.

Don't ever lend them money again.

As adults we make choices and accept the consequences, your SIL & B will have to do that in these circumstances.

jacks11 · 25/02/2018 23:00

Frequency

SIL was definitely not off due to her own ill health or that of her children/other family member. DB told me he didn't know she wasn't going to college and he did say DC had attended nursery as usual. I think he would have been aware if she were too sick to attend college or one of their DC was unwell and SIL needed to stay at home to look after them or something along those lines. Also, SIL hasn't said she was too sick to go in, which I think she would have if that were the case.

I can see a high attendance target may mean even just a few days could put you on the limit of that target. However, I presume if the absence was due to ill-health or ill-health of a child/parent/spouse etc- and this was supported by medical or other evidence- that the college would try/be obliged to make some allowances?

SIL has not contested that she hasnt been attending and hasn't said (to my knowledge) that it was due to illness. I think she would be contesting the college decision if she thought she had a chance. She's not usually backwards about coming forwards, so to speak.

OP posts:
donquixotedelamancha · 25/02/2018 23:03

I've called them to let them know that I definitely won't be giving the money.

Well done OP. It's easy to point out the obvious when it isn't your life, but a lot harder to do in practice.

I always find it hard to imagine how these CFs get to the point of thinking their behaviour is reasonable. Hopefully after a few months of changing the way you deal with them you might start to build a healthier relationship- but you need to maintain proper boundaries first. They may take a long time to get the message.

gamerchick · 25/02/2018 23:07

Do not cave OP! You done good Grin

I had a CF once and I wasn’t financially comfortable. I was on benefits but managed that money quite well. My CF begged me for money for the ‘leccy meter’ and for milk but at that point I couldn’t lend. But I did have a milk token (my last) she could use for milk if it would help.

She cashed it in for the 1.50 the shop gave you and bought cigs. It still rankles all these years later.

If you pay this money and find out she’s yet again took the piss, you’ll remember this thread and wish you hadn’t. Wiping someone’s backside doesn’t help them unless they’re little and ready to take the job over.

BananaInPyjama · 26/02/2018 00:18

Glad you are not doing it.

A relative did this to me- bombarded me with calls about how their life would be not worth living if they could not get money together to move into a flat (knowing I had just been made redundant).

Suffice to say after lending it, relative then went on a holiday and that was the end of my money. We are NC now.

Stick to your guns. Piss takers are always piss takers.

MidniteScribbler · 26/02/2018 06:36

If she truly wanted to work for a living, she'd go and get a job. College course that leads to a college course that might lead to a job is just stalling tactics about having to work. No doubt she saw the 'free childcare' and thought she could wing her way through with getting free childcare and long lunches and no one would question her attendance.

Headofthehive55 · 26/02/2018 06:56

Id be replying saying you had money difficulties yourself. Could they lend you some?
Or you could give your DB some money for his birthday early £20?
Don't worry about the kids, they will have more resolve actually to have a better life and work harder as it's tough for them.