What's with all these transgender threads?!

[pancakequeenisheretosaveyou]

No less than 7 on my active threads?? Is it just me who in real life hasn't encountered any transgender people?? And coming from the professional background that I'm in, I see a pretty varied side of life

Am I missing out on something here??

The other was chatted up by a mate when v drunk didn’t realise until later 🤣 - punched said bloke in a dress in the face

Another point worth making is that the actual real literal violence that trans people have faced has come from men, not women. Being verbally challenged on your identification as a woman may hurt your feelings/ideology but a punch in the face hurts more.

So why is it women who are being told to budge up to make space?

Of course we're not supposed to talk about Ian Huntley. Thats because violent sexual predators who self ID as women in an attempt to get moved to a woman's prison are the thin end of the wedge, and the major sticking point for the general population (along with transitioning children).

Here's my transphobic comment. This would cost me my job.
.
.
.
I believe that a person with a penis and testicles who has not undergone any hormone therapy and declares them self to be a lesbian.....
.
Is a
.
MAN.

.

I would also love to know what "rights" people think feminists are trying to take away from transwomen (because let's face it here, we are talking about TW).

Likewise, wiseoldhag.

I’ve been told that if a child in my school asks me if a transgender child is now the opposite sex, I am not allowed to say no. So my job will require me to lie about biological facts.

Awww yes I see it took until 6.14 for them to start....

I saw one response to that. Apparently men was to retire earlier and get their pension at the same age as women. Yup. That's the only response I've seen. Oh and it will cost the government around £40k per man self-identity information and getting their pension at the same age as women.

Apparently it is an issue.

I find it very weird. I posted about this elsewhere in MN earlier today in fact. I agree with some of the anti-self-ID arguments but I find the obsessiveness and the lack of nuance really off-putting.

I agree it seems to being blown up out of all proportion by people who are now calling themselves "PERFs".

This is bollocks. Shame on you for trying - again - to convince people that this is the case.

I come here much less now because it's full of it, driving me mad.

And yet here you are, posting on the very thread that puts you off posting....

Following, because this issue is important and I am glad there are lots of threads discussing trans issues, OP. It would be terribly odd on a site like MN if any important issue that is likely to affect women wasn't comprehensively and extensively and repeatedly discussed.

All the issues surrounding self identification, etc, have been made far worse by politicians who are too afraid of being called transphobic to use a bit of common sense.

I fully support the trans community but it stands to reason that certain female spaces should be kept free, not from trans women, but from biological male genitals.

Prisons, refuges, medical exam rooms etc, should all be accessible only by those without penises - but arrangements should also be made, so that vulnerable trans women are not housed with male prisoners, have safe places to go to, etc.

It's not about discriminating against a minority - it's about finding a way that enables us all to live safe, equal lives together in the same society, without the rights of one group overriding the rights of another.

The sports debate, I really can't bring myself to get worked up about as I have zero interest in sports!

As for trans women on women only shortlists, true feminism is about giving a voice to all women - minorities included. I would be as proud to stand nominated with a trans woman as I would a woman born female.

Sorry Skippy, I wasn't talking about how a trans person feels as such, I was asking what is this "woman feeling'"? I assume you are a woman, so how do you know you are a woman? What do you feel that makes you think "I'm definitely a woman"?

I am so grateful to Mumsnet management team for this being the only place on the Internet where we can discuss this without fear of being outed.

I read an earlier post asking what we are afraid of. For me there is the real prospect of losing my job. For others there is the genuine fear of being tracked down by violent men.

I think you’ll find if you read the threads that they are not transgender threads, that is they are in no way threads filled with distain or disgust for transgender people in the slightest, but threads regarding TRAs and their actions/campaigning against the rights of women, children and their homophobia.

I liken your OP to saying, “what’s with all the Muslim bashing threads” when referring to multiple threads created about ISIS.

I think it's because for the first time in their lives, white middle class women are not being held front and centre of political discourse. They're losing a tiny bit of their "privilege"* and they don't like it. Not one bit so they're off on a bit of a mad one, complaining to all and sundry just what a vulnerable group all women are just so they can't be called out on their bigotry.

The only argument they have is about "vulnerable" (my arse, if they met these women in any sort of authority position i.e. police, prison officer, probation etc they'd see how lovely and vulnerable they are!) women prisoners and in sports. So this is mentioned every single fucking thread, like some sort of bizarre trump card. This will drag on forever...

*The concept of privilege in England in 2018 is clearly bollocks but since it's a term the trendy left have forced down our throats for years, they're welcome to it back

The only argument they have is about "vulnerable" (my arse, if they met these women in any sort of authority position i.e. police, prison officer, probation etc they'd see how lovely and vulnerable they are!) women prisoners and in sports. So this is mentioned every single fucking thread, like some sort of bizarre trump card

Oh we have plenty of arguments why women shouldn't have to give up their rights to men just because they stamp their feet and say their feelings will be hurt if we don't. Try me.

I have found the trans threads on MN very interesting actually. I've lived and worked in a major city all my life and met lots of people, I think I've met one trans person in my entire life, and it wasn't in the U.K. and she was lovely.

However, there was a thread yesterday about what happens if you google 'women murdered in 2017'. Try it yourself. It genuinely scared me, like actual women don't exist. I completely understand where all the posters on trans threads are coming from. The sports thing too is entirely valid argument and needs to be discussed properly rather than people screaming 'transphobic'.

Women prisoners is a very valid concern. Are you suggesting it isn't? And if it is, how can this be managed via self-ID?

The reason for the outrage is people feel threatened by having "men" in women's only spaces. And what is the reason for that? Sexual preference. And what is the sexual preference of lesbians? The same as straight men. If you're threatened by straight men then surely you should be threatened by lesbians too?

This total misunderstanding is always trotted out. I have seen it used in 'so if you don't want a man to do your smear test, would you also not want a lesbian to do it'.

It's nothing to do with 'sexual preference'. It's everything to do with the fact that 98% of sexual offenders are men.

It doesn't mean that all men are like that, it doesn't mean that all transwomen are sex offenders. It does mean that men are a lot less safe to be around than women, straight or lesbian.

The level of open bigotry is making me really unhappy, to the point that I'm thinking about avoiding the site. I don't think it's that great for my MH being on here at the moment anyway.

Master,

You do make a fair point. As I said uptgread the transgender community have appropriated the silencing language of radical feminism which, to some extent, affords me a wry smile and a thought of ‘hoisted by your own petard’.

On the other hand there are huge swathes of women who will be affected by this and some of the issues really matter. Real safe spaces (refuges, rape crisis centres etc) need to remain female only. Ditto women’s sport. There do seem to be some very cynical men exploiting this to their own ends.

Women don't have penises.

Those who are 'disgusted'... 'wouldn't bat an eyelid' - I suggest you do your research.

@Lovesagin hmm! Good question! I can not answer! Yes I am a woman. I was bornq female. I have no idea how to 'feel a woman' I just accept that I am. I suppose the fact I look down and see a vagina. I see the point you are trying to make. I get it. I can't answer for those who 'feel female' as to what they feel and how the feel it. If that makes sense! I am not a 'feminine' woman. I don't do make up every day, i never played with dolls when I was little, i was more lets go and play in the mud. But that doesn't make me feel a man! You have me thinking now about how you 'feel female'
I have an important meeting today and I know I will feel distracted wondering how I feel female and how a man can feel female! Thanks lovesagin!
Is it because society has said girls play with dolls boys play with cars that has messed it all up!
My nephew has a doll, he also has cars. Does this mean he is both male and female? Is that how we define being a woman, with what tastes we have as children? Am I a man in a womans body? Should my kids start calling me dad?
Is this even how it works! Im very confused!

I'm sorry that you feel that way but that's emotional blackmail. I'm not going to silence my own voice on issue which deeply affect me to make you feel better.