To ask if you had your time again would you have been a SAHM?

[DiscoPanick]

I've NC for this because of obvious reasons concerning linking threads and so forth.

What invariably happens if you take time off from your job/career and what if your H/P leaves you? Times had changed since alimony was granted. These days you'd leave with just the clothes on your back. That is if you didn't have personal savings or wealth.

Even if childcare renders you working at a net loss on a monthly basis, is it worth still having a foot in the door versus not.

The feeling of guilt concerning WOHMs is all well and good but will not ultimately put food on the table. (The feeling of guilt that is)

I'm just working through a few thoughts and need to consult with friends and others to see what others have done.

@Want2beSupermum

When you say, We both work very hard and have made many sacrifices beyond what others are prepared to do.

What kind of things do you mean?
From your post, I'm assuming one of them was move abroad.

I also often think this about my husband and I, so I'm genuinely interested in what others consider sacrifices beyond what most are prepared to make. If that sentence makes sense? - Bit tired today!

The sacrifices do include moving away. They also include lots of other small and large sacrifices.

Biggest one was both of us staying employed while running our own businesses. We have a desk in our bedroom which we share and both help each other out with our businesses. We run these businesses on the side (during working hours) as well as after the DC have gone to bed.

Studies: DH completed his MBA and I completed my CPA exams. Not an easy accomplishment. Yes DHs employer paid for the MBA but it was on a reimbursement basis. They also didn't pay for the hefty babysitting bill incurred so we could both focus on our studies. There were plenty of times I went without lunch because it wasn't in the budget to buy out.

The biggest sacrifice is always being available. On vacation my client needed work done. Computer came out and I worked 18 hour days the whole time I was away in the Turks and Caicos. My previous role was extremely long hours. I was seen as a safe pair of hands to manage a difficult client so of course I went from one catastrophic audit/client to another. In a two year period I had 4 days of vacation.

I don't see my short maternity leaves as sacrifices per se but taking an 8 week leave was tough because when I went back I was working for a chauvinistic arsehole. I toughed it out and never worked for him again.

I also went part time and took a sabbatical when DS was having major developmental delays. My PT was FT at 60 hours or so a week.

Not everyone works like DH and I do either before or after starting a family. It isn't for everyone because you really have to carefully manage yourself. I regularly would get 3 hours of sleep a night and carry on. It's better now with my new job. I get 5-8 hours of sleep depending on other factors.

We have made the most of our higher income. We live in a lovely home (which needs to be gutted) but rent half of it out. In 10 years of marriage we have been on 2 holidays, a long weekend to Puerto Rico and a week to Turks and Caicos. We have one car and we clean our own home. Others in our income bracket tend to spend a lot more. I don't need to fly business nor do I need the fuss of a chef at home. We aren't getting ahead if we spend it all.

If my 16 year old self knew what I know now I would not have bothered with a bachelors. Masters nor prof exams. Then when I had my dd I would have given up paid work.

But because I had spent so much blood and sweat on qualifying I felt I couldn’t give it all up. So carried on working full time. Pretty much killed my marriage.

vegas

I've never been afraid to walk away from my profession. I walked away from a very well paid career in investment banking. Had I continued working I would have been very senior at this point but divorced and without my DC. I am happy that I was once given a check for £125k when I was 25 years old but I'm happier I banked it all and left to do the things that mattered more to me.

Very rude I have a brain I never meant offense I was just saying i chose my partner what's wrong with that I did clearly I had a brain or I would have got pregnant by a one nyt stand who I never seen again

@wanttobesupermum as an aside, what on earth is the point of running your own companies (with all the risk and responsibility that entails) and working as hard as you both do for so little return? You do your own cleaning? PT is 69 hours a week? WTF...

It always surprises me that so many clever people slog away like this. You’re missing out on so much, and for what?

My dsis and her dh had an interesting approach, they took turns - she was there for her kids when they were small - she had one child than planned - three, so she spent longer out of the workplace that anticipated. Her dh worked in the city earned decent money, but his soul was not in it.
Then they swapped, he retrained as a financial councillor to work for a charity educating people on how to organise their finances, he doesn't get paid much and works very part-time...so he's there for the kids when they are not in school and my sister got back into her career, buzzing with the challenge, knowing her kids were being well looked after - she missed them of course but she also missed her work and giving it everything she had with no compromises! It took her a couple of years to get back to a senior level - but she is very tenacious. Money was never the motivator for her - it symbolises her success but she's not driven by it!

Your bil is no fool. You dsis did the sah when it is hard and he gets to lower his hours once the gig gets easier.

I don't think either of them saw it like that - their marriage isn't a game of who gets the better deal, I know that's how some people live life with their partners but generally my sis and her dh have a very happy supportive relationship and they were happy with their choices.

It's not selfish to not want a baby. It's fine to be career focused if that's what your DH wants. You knew he didn't want kids and it's not fair on either of you to hold out hope that he will change his mind.

I'm so sorry about your mum's illness. However, it is completely unfair of her to put you in this position. It's wrong. The only question here is what do YOU want?

You sound so undecided and that's why you need time to think. It would be a terrible mistake to rush into it.

Moonandstars- transferable parental leave is available now, but the take up is depressingly low. If it’s that awful being at home for the early months then I’m surprised that more women don’t choose to transfer it.... the truth is (as evidenced by other threads) that some women jealously guard ‘their’ year off work.

As a generalisation I agree with you that being a SAHP or working part time once the children are in school is easier in that the beneficiary of time at home is primarily yourself. No doubt someone will be along in a minute to say all the stuff they do while the kids are in school facilitates their husband being able to do his high powered job! But generally the person who primarily benefits is the SAHP or part time worker who has more free time with no caring responsibilities. I have a number of colleagues my age group with adult children who continue to work part time, and they’re very honest that they are the sole beneficiary.

And once again, I’ll emphasise that’s fine, no one else’s business as long as your partner is happy with that balance and you understand the long term implications of not working / working part time on pensions etc

Ultimately it’s about working as a partnership... not point scoring about who has it easier. And let’s be honest, in any situation where there’s choice, people are likely to be motivated to a large extent by self interest. If you can afford to live on one income and you decide to be a SAHP it’s pretty likely that it’s what you want. There may be other factors coming into play but ultimately it’ll be a choice about how you want to live your life. I include myself in this - I reduced to 3 days a week work when my children were pre schoolers. It could have been dh reducing hours but I very much felt I didn’t want to work 5 days a week at that point and dh was comfortable with that arrangement. So in a way you could say I was motivated by self interest, though of course if dh had had strong feelings about wanting to reduce hours then we’d have tried to do that. Having said that, ML was so short back then and I was still bf when I returned to work with dd 12 weeks old that there were other factors influencing the decision for me to go part time. It’s hard work when you’re still doing night feeds and then going to work in the morning!

But ultimately, to go back to moonandstars point - there is nothing inherently wrong with the father taking time off when the children are a bit older. It seems perfectly acceptable for large numbers of women to work only part time long after the kids are in school or even university or after leaving home, even though you could say it puts more pressure on their partner, so why the issue with a man doing it?

@orangesticker my parents did something a bit like that (although it wasn't planned from the beginning). My mum was the one who went through cycles of SAHM/part time working/freelancing while we were young and all trough our primary school days. When we were older, her employer offered her a fantastic opportunity of a further qualification and potentially a promotion. At this point, my dad had a great post but he didn't want to progress to partner of the firm so he took a step back so my mum could step up. He continued to work but freelancing from home and managed other investments. Although we were almost self sufficient, they both strongly believed in one of them being home when we came home from school. You could argue that he was at home when times were easier but they are both happy with their choices and there is no resentment. He also did much more work when at home compared to my mum in the toddler days as there wasn't much childcare to manage for him.

As @Babbitywabbit said, no one else's opinion matters as long as you are both happy with the decisions you have made. I would absolutely hate the lifestyle @Want2bSupermum describes but as long as she and her family are happy, my opinion makes no difference at all.

littlekiwi Last year between DH and I our income from jobs and DHs business was just over $1m. After taxes it should net to about $675k. Our living expenses are $120k a year (childcare is $36k alone and we pay property taxes of $23k). My business holds 35 properties that I rent out and asset wise it's worth about £10m. I could take an income but I don't need to and reinvest to build more properties.

The money we make gives us real choices. DHs sister lost her DH on Monday. At 5pm DH was on the plane going home and I'm proud that we can give my SIL the money to pay for the funeral he wanted. I fly home to my dad every 3 weeks for a long weekend. Most people living abroad can't afford this. We have been able to pay off SILs mortgage, buy my PIL a home outright and purchase a car for them too. They have a prepaid credit card for day to day expenses which we pay for. We have 2DC with ASD. Yes they are high functioning but we have no idea what the future holds.

Yes we don't have a cleaner and we have 3DC in one bedroom for now. I do it in part to keep everyone with their feet on the ground. DH might be in senior management but he does the DCs lunches. We didn't always make such a high income and I'm well aware it could all stop tomorrow. My DC go to the local public school. We can afford private but I don't see the value because the elder 2DCs disabilities are better supported there than at any of the private schools.

I would absolutely hate the lifestyle @Want2bSupermum describes but as long as she and her family are happy, my opinion makes no difference at all.

I get the impression that its VERY important to Supermum that we all realise that she is indeed super - superior, in fact.

Hahaha!!! I couldn't give a shiny shit what others do. It's about having the choice to do what makes you happy. PP asked why we work like this and I answered their question. If the financial return wasn't there I would change course. I don't work for the sake of working. There has to be a benefit to me and my family which there is.

My username hasn't changed since I joined and I picked it because I want to be a supermum but never will be. I get it wrong more times than I get it right but I keep going and keep trying with the hope that eventually I will get it right. All I can do is try my best for my DC.

I don’t get that impression at all staples. I don’t think Want2besupermum’s lifestyle would suit me either, but it sounds as though she and her husband are very happy; it works for them and their children sound loved and well supported. Surely that’s what matters?

Horses for courses, but I don’t think that’s enough for how hard you both work.

I also don’t know anyone who works anywhere near that many hours and still cleans their own house... sounds like sado-masochism to me.

Definitely not, I’d like to drop from 4-3 days but not really practical. I couldn’t imagine being financially dependent on anyone else. Nearly every divorcee thinks they bagged the perfect man once. I’ve studied a long time for my role why should I give it up. Financially and practically it would make more sense for DH to give up work. Where colleagues wives have become sahm they are all very happy for the first few years but get increasingly resentful as the child gets older that the wife is taking all the money to fund their now established lifestyle (not that they ever tell their wives this)

Dipity - you have no idea through really, about the private spheres of your colleagues or what they say to their wives. I'm sure there are men who may be resentful, just as there are no doubt men who complain their wives don't prioritise the family enough because they're always working. Generalisations and speculation about other people are irrelevant.

Shared maternity is only for the first year though. In our case it was down to economics. I was earning maybe 15k. Dh probably nearer 35k.
So in our case it would have been a no brainer.
As long as everyone is happy with the choices of course that is fine.
There is no denying though that life as a sah gets much easier once dc are at school. Although accept that the situation was different for the couple discussed as he was working part time.

I'm not convinced a man arse who would publicly criticise their wife to colleagues would be able to remain discreet at home, it just doesn't ring true - a big mouth like that would be hard to keep shut!

littlekiwi If I lived in the U.K. I'd have a cleaner. The quality of work here is terrible. I was paying $400 a week for 16 hours. I wanted four hours split over the week in the mornings when everyone is out. Idea being they could do all of the housework. I would think the house would be sparking, the laundry folded and put away, floors clean etc as our home wasn't that big (1200sqft). We went through four cleaners. None of them had a bloody clue. All came with good references. Assumed it was because I wasn't paying enough so upped it to $600 for 16 hours. Still no change. The cleaners preferred to work for American families who generally accept a lower standard.

I gave up, spent $500 on a dyson handheld, $$$ on the nice branded cleaning products and cracked on. Dry cleaning is picked up from the house, I use a stand up steamer for ironing which I do while on a conference call and the DC help with cleaning. We blitz as a family for an hour Saturday and Sunday morning (5 of us doing it together is very effective and keep it up during the week doing bits as we go along.

The men at work who complain about their wives are seen as weak. One of the lower down guys was complaining about his wife and the big boss looked at him over the top of his glasses and told him he should tell his wife and not us. I ❤️ my boss! His wife returned to work when their youngest started school. She trained as a special needs teacher and worked for 25 years before retiring to help raise the grandchildren. She currently looks after 3 under 3 on her own and makes it look easy. She is 61.

Ha! Now I get it!

I loved being a SAHM, but I would have if I could have gone back to work part time. My children are 19 & 17 and the back than the bank I worked for, did not offer part time. I was working 10-12 hours per day. Not great when you have babies. If I had a daughter, (2sons) I would suggest to her to try part time or WFH.