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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

The one in which Trump orders his staff to fire Mueller, and they give him the finger

986 replies

PerkingFaintly · 26/01/2018 12:14

Apparently this has already happened, back in July 2017. Shock

But the orange one try again...

Trump Ordered Mueller Fired, but Backed Off When White House Counsel Threatened to Quit
www.nytimes.com/2018/01/25/us/politics/trump-mueller-special-counsel-russia.html

Coverage by Maddow: twitter.com/maddow?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Previous thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3142761-All-Trump-sees-is-green-All-we-see-is-a-traitorous-orange-menace-Who-is-right-Place-bets-now-Trump-continued?pg=1

OP posts:
Thread gallery
25
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 04/02/2018 08:48

Alexandra Erin
@alexandraerin
I really hate the term "tribalism", for a variety of reasons. I'm not going to get into it in depth here and I'm going to block anyone who tries to explain why It's A Good Term, Actually.

The problem in US culture isn't tribes.

It's teams.

Here in the US, which is where I'm speaking about so I'm also going to block anyone who jumps in to explain to me that it's not just the US, we learn about the importance of teams early on. Our schools have them. Your school's team is the best team, because you go there.

We go to rallies for our teams. At some schools, they're mandatory. At some other schools, they're "voluntary" except not really. At my school, we were told (when we asked) that if we didn't want to go to a pep rally, we could choose instead to sit and write papers about why not.

We learn to identify with a team, to feel like their triumphs are ours and their losses are ours, to believe that everything they do is best and right and good, and that everything the other team does is cheap and nasty and underhanded.

We grow up and we get new teams. We buy jerseys and pennants and foam hands, and we cheer the way we learned to cheer and we identify with them the way we learned to identify with our first teams.

We basically become this:

local.theonion.com/you-will-suffer-humiliation-when-the-sports-team-from-m-1819583814/amp?__twitter_impression=true

And then, if we're not careful, we become that for everything.

We forget how to think that someone is in the right about one thing without taking their side generally, without buying their metaphorical jerseys and pennants.

When I see people sitting out a general election or worse because they're mad their guy in the primary was "robbed", this behavior doesn't strike me as "tribal".

It reminds me of team spectator sports.

When I see people who were at the very least sensibly skeptical of the FBI before now proclaiming that real Americans support our unimpeachable law enforcement protection buddies who only have our best interests at heart, I think of team spectator sports.

Can we just forget about teams? The FBI is in the right on this memo thing. We should be supporting them against the Trump regime's attempts to shutdown the investigation and turn them into a partisan political instrument.

We don't have to sit in the stands and lead cheers.

I'm not Team FBI. I don't stand with the FBI. I stand against Trump and I stand against corruption in our government and law enforcement. To whatever extent at the moment the FBI is standing in the same place as I am, we are standing together.

I'm not buying their jersey.

I'll say "vote for the Democrat" in a general election 99 cases out of 100, but that's not because rah rah rah go team, it's because on a pragmatic level that's the best move available. (And part of how we get to a world where we have better moves available.)

We don't need teams. We don't need to decide we're on someone's team to support them when it's right or make the mistake of thinking they're on our team because they are pushing in the same direction as us for a spell.

Imagine if we didn't have that defensive reaction when we find out someone on our "team" did something terrible.

Conversely, imagine if we could process that someone we pull together with did something disappointing and not have to cancel their membership.

I mean, the biggest piece of evidence that the FBI wasn't involved in a partisan push to stop Trump from winning the election is that they actively shielded him and helped torpedo his opponent.

So no, I don't stand with them.

I stand for what's right.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 04/02/2018 09:00

Philip Rucker
@PhilipRucker
Rudy Giuliani warns his Republican Party to “be careful” going to war with the FBI

<a class="break-all" href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/politics/once-the-party-of-law-and-order-republicans-are-now-challenging-it/2018/02/03/98ff3f3c-084f-11e8-8777-2a059f168dd2_story.html#click=t.co/Rv8P0VLTUm" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/politics/once-the-party-of-law-and-order-republicans-are-now-challenging-it/2018/02/03/98ff3f3c-084f-11e8-8777-2a059f168dd2_story.html#click=t.co/Rv8P0VLTUm

Judd Apatow
@JuddApatow
Maybe Giuliani should be careful about how he knew info before it came out and spoke about it on TV and is up to his neck in this scandal.

And

Brian Beutler
@brianbeutler
Meanwhile, there is radio silence on the FBI officials who leaked sensitive information about the Clinton investigation to Rudy Giuliani, and what role they had in FBI decisions.

And

Robert A George
@RobGeorge
Speaking of alleged FBI biases: There was reportedly communication between bureau sources and Trump pal Rudy Giuliani throughout 2016. On May 3, 2017, James Comey testifies that he would look into those reports: www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/fbi-director-leaks-giuliani-article-1.3134676 Alas, he was fired six days later. Hmmm...

And

Amy Siskind
@Amy_Siskind
I still want to know more about Rudy Giuliani’s role in the Comey letter, and why he bragged on Fox News the day before something big was coming on Hillary.

lionheart · 04/02/2018 09:46

I think Giuliani is right to be afraid.

Lweji · 04/02/2018 10:08

I recently read a piece by a Portuguese commentator also expressing that Trump was unwise to pick a fight with the FBI.
I thought it was too optimistic, but maybe it will be his downfall. Fingers crossed.

Lweji · 04/02/2018 10:09

Meanwhile, the truth about Melania on the SOTU day.

lionheart · 04/02/2018 10:15

Good piece from The Atlantic (again).

www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2018/03/america-is-not-a-democracy/550931/?utm_source=atltw

TheNorthWestPawsage · 04/02/2018 10:17

Charles, a Koch brother in Wichita, said he was pleasantly surprised that his pay went up $26,923,076 a week... he said [that] will more than cover the cost of buying several more Paul Ryans.
twitter.com/lolgop/status/959864090670895104

PerkingFaintly · 04/02/2018 10:40

[snort] at that Koch brother tweet! Nice one.

Alexandra Erin's post about teams rings true, too.

OP posts:
Natsku · 04/02/2018 11:40

That SNL sketch Grin, haven't watched SNL in ages, need to start again

Lweji · 04/02/2018 14:47

The weekely update is also good.

This week, two older French actresses, and Nunes.

But Fox and Friends is also worth watching. Only this time. Wink
"FBI's retribution is coming" and a special appearance from a certain viewer watching from his bed, but working hard.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 04/02/2018 14:52

Amy siskind weekly update:

theweeklylist.org/weekly-list/week-64/

lionheart · 04/02/2018 15:15

'Bloomberg analyzed the data from 12 races for open seats and found that Democrats have collectively raised $23.3 million. That’s three times more than what Republicans have brought in.'

shareblue.com/dems-outraise-gop-3-to-1-in-must-win-races-to-flip-the-house-in-2018/#.WnVUow2j2NY.twitter

cozietoesie · 04/02/2018 15:32

Thanks, Pain.

GingerIvy · 04/02/2018 16:44

Scott Dworkin

Verified account

@funder
2m2 minutes ago
More
To avert another shutdown Thursday, the GOP plans on pushing through another bill extending Gov’t funding. This time it would keep the Gov’t open past the DACA expiration date. Democrats must stand their ground & #SaveDREAMers or they’re gonna be deported & imprisoned. #SaveDACA

lionheart · 04/02/2018 17:10

'Leon Panetta, former director of the Central Intelligence Agency, sat down with CBS News Friday to discuss the release of the memo by Republicans on the House Intelligence Committee. The memo details surveillance practices levied against former Trump campaign official Carter Page.'

:www.cbsnews.com/news/leon-panetta-transcript-cbs-news-interview-gop-memo-release

Lweji · 04/02/2018 17:27

What's that expression?
"You can only fool some people all the time or all people for some time, but not all people all the time"

The gaslighing might work but only on some, and even so, for how long?

TheNorthWestPawsage · 04/02/2018 17:38

Poor little rich boy.
Jared Kushner's property empire had to thrive under Trump, right? Wrong
www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/feb/04/jared-kushner-property-empire-trump?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

cozietoesie · 04/02/2018 18:41

Mr M only interviewed him for 45 minutes? Oh Dear. Poor Jared.

lionheart · 04/02/2018 19:30

They have the answers already. Smile

Plus, 45 minutes with Mueller or one of his proxies, will feel like an eternity.

cozietoesie · 04/02/2018 19:44

That was my immediate thought. Smile

lionheart · 04/02/2018 20:17

I'd be rubbish in that situation and confess to the stuff I hadn't even done. Smile

lionheart · 04/02/2018 20:25

I haven't come across this magazine before but I do like a timeline.

www.damemagazine.com/2018/01/26/our-state-of-the-obstruction-address/