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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

The one in which Trump orders his staff to fire Mueller, and they give him the finger

986 replies

PerkingFaintly · 26/01/2018 12:14

Apparently this has already happened, back in July 2017. Shock

But the orange one try again...

Trump Ordered Mueller Fired, but Backed Off When White House Counsel Threatened to Quit
www.nytimes.com/2018/01/25/us/politics/trump-mueller-special-counsel-russia.html

Coverage by Maddow: twitter.com/maddow?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Previous thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3142761-All-Trump-sees-is-green-All-we-see-is-a-traitorous-orange-menace-Who-is-right-Place-bets-now-Trump-continued?pg=1

OP posts:
Thread gallery
25
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 01/02/2018 13:25

Interesting thread about roger stone/nigel farage/brexit bad boys

Carole Cadwalladr
‏*@carolecadwalla*
Roger Stone - Trump's advisor - claims he had a 'back channel' to Julian Assange. Last night the Daily Beast's @NicoHines & I met him.
You'll never guess what happened next... 1/

www.thedailybeast.com/roger-stone-says-he-visited-the-ecuadorian-embassy-in-london-where-julian-assange-is-in-hiding?source=twitter&via=desktop

So, there's several fascinating things about this "perfectly legal backchannel" that Roger Stone told @RVAwonk about. Including the question, 'Was it Farage?' But he raised another bigger question about Nigel last night...2/

[Lots of embedded things so best to view it here: twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/959024036352331776 ]

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 01/02/2018 13:30

(I don't know what the the implications are if Farage met Trump a different way to the official narrative but given he has been declared a person of interest by the FBI, it might be another puzzle piece although of course it might be entirely unrelated)

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 14:00

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account
@realDonaldTrump
Follow Follow @realDonaldTrump
More
Thank you for all of the nice compliments and reviews on the State of the Union speech. 45.6 million people watched, the highest number in history. @FoxNews beat every other Network, for the first time ever, with 11.7 million people tuning in. Delivered from the heart!

4:02 AM - 1 Feb 2018
__
Jake Tapper‏Verified account
@jaketapper
Following Following @jaketapper
More Jake Tapper Retweeted Donald J. Trump
Fewer viewers than the first SOTU’s for Obama in 2010, Bush in 2002, Clinton in 1994.

“Which means Trump’s initial SOTU, the third longest in history, is now also the least watched address in nearly a quarter of a century.”

www.google.com/amp/deadline.com/2018/01/state-of-the-union-tv-ratings-donald-trump-barack-obama-1202274787/amp/

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 01/02/2018 14:03

This segment on Maddow about the spy chiefs meeting with Trump officials is good - it really is mind boggling that they are being so brazen

Russia spy chiefs met in U.S. with Trump officials last week www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/russia-spy-chiefs-met-in-u-s-with-trump-officials-last-week-1150948419558

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 01/02/2018 14:57

What a shocker

Manu Raju
‏*@mkraju*
Trump told associates last night Nunes memo will DISCREDIT Mueller probe and shows bias in FBI; WH aides supporting his stance. Trump, meantime, is angry about FBI statement yesterday. per @Kevinliptakcnn @SaraMurray @kaitlancollins

Trump sees Nunes memo as a way to discredit the Russia investigation

edition.cnn.com/2018/02/01/politics/nunes-memo-donald-trump/index.html

cozietoesie · 01/02/2018 15:07

For Lweji. Smile

Lweji · 01/02/2018 15:14

I knew it would come. Grin

BTW, have you seen that Murphy Brown is being brought back?

www.usatoday.com/story/life/tv/2018/01/24/candice-bergen-cbs-murphy-brown-revival/1063075001/

The field is well manured for a political journalists sitcom.

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 16:07

yes, I posted about Murphy Brown a few days ago.I amSOOOOOO glad it's coming back - I LOVED that show!!!

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 16:08

The New York Times

Verified account

@nytimes
1m1 minute ago
A top Senate Republican urged House Republicans to slow their push to release a memo said to accuse the FBI of abuses in the Russia inquiry nyti.ms/2BL3c9r

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 16:09

Sky News

Verified account

@SkyNews
1m1 minute ago
Fake news: Trump wrongly claims ratings for speech were highest ever news.sky.com/story/fake-news-trump-wrongly-claims-ratings-for-speech-were-highest-ever-11232285

__
Anyone surprised at this? Anyone? ANYONE???

Hmm
GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 16:10

Preet Bharara

Verified account

@PreetBharara
13h13 hours ago
Can someone send Rep Nunes the definition of recusal? This is not an episode of Billions twitter.com/repadamschiff/status/958897790469464064

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 16:10

Ed Krassenstein

@EdKrassen
34s35 seconds ago
More
BREAKING: House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (@NancyPelosi) formally asks Speaker Paul Ryan to remove Devin Nunes as the chair of the House Intel Committee!

Lweji · 01/02/2018 16:10

GingerIvy

Ups, sorry. Maybe that's where I saw it. Grin

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 16:18

hahaha no worries.I am looking forward to it!

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 16:24

John Roberts

Verified account

@johnrobertsFox
29m29 minutes ago
More
SCOOP - @FoxNews IS TOLD @realDonaldTrump WILL DECLASSIFY THE FISA MEMO AND TRANSMIT BACK TO HPSCI TOMORROW MORNING FOR RELEASE

___
This is going to get ugly fast - this is the altered memo, to my understanding, that Schumer pointed out has different info than what Congress agreed on.

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 16:24

I should say "voted" not "agreed."

Anniegetyourgun · 01/02/2018 16:53

Anyone surprised at this? Anyone? ANYONE???

To quote the classics (Disney's Aladdin): "I think I'm going to have a heart attack and die from not-surprise".

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 17:07

Annie Grin

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 17:08

Adam Khan

@Khanoisseur
16s17 seconds ago
More Adam Khan Retweeted SnowKnuckles
No Congressional interest in determining whether the 22 million records stolen by the Chinese hacking of OPM played a role in 2016 elections. Data stolen included background checks (drug and sex habits, arrest records, psychological profiles, fingerprints, SSN) - prime kompromat

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 17:09

Stephen King

Verified account

@StephenKing
7m7 minutes ago
More
A trainload of Republicans on their way to a pricey retreat hit a garbage truck. My friend Russ calls that karma.

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 17:23

Interesting.

Axios

Verified account

@axios
3m3 minutes ago
28 Russian athletes had their Olympic doping bans overturned today. www.axios.com/28-russian-athletes-olympic-doping-bans-overturned-d17fc125-c2cb-4ffb-9751-c479464696a7.html?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=organic&utm_content=1100&utm_term=world

GingerIvy · 01/02/2018 17:27

Dan Pfeiffer

Verified account

@danpfeiffer
14h14 hours ago
Which phone did Hicks use to communicate with Don Jr.? If it was her WH phone, the WH has those records. If it wasn’t, she is in violation of other laws? pic.twitter.com/cwBOTQfFHm

Some of you may remember that using personal devices for Government work was once the greatest political scandal since Watergate

AcrossthePond55 · 01/02/2018 18:15

Annie Thanks for the Disney reference. I'm going to watch Aladdin. I could to with a dose of the wonderful Robin Williams as Genie. (Although I know that's an Iago quote)

Trump had the 'biggest audience', did he? I expect that's to go with his 'biggest dick'. Both of which are true only in his own mind.

With the rumours swirling about new sources and witnesses on one side and the 'damaging memo' on the other, it seems as though things are starting to come to a head. But I know we've felt this way before and then the wave that we thought was going to be a tsunami turned out to be nothing but a little ripple on the shore.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 01/02/2018 19:59

So despite reports that Wray threatened to resign possibly causing trump to wait a bit, it appears the memo will be released tomorrow

Monica Alba
@albamonica
NEW: President Trump expected to tell Congress he approves releasing the memo “probably tomorrow,” senior WH official tells reporters on AF1. Official added: “I doubt there will be any redactions.”

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 01/02/2018 20:10

Sorry to do another “look at the parallels!” but, well, look at the parallels!

Garvan Walshe
@garvanwalshe
Steve Baker's and JRM's attack on the civil service and @CER_Grant shows us what Brexitism is really about. Clue: it's not about leaving the European Union.

Thread. /

It's actually a radical movement determined to attack the basic principles of constitutional democracy as we've come to practice it in the West 2/

Over hundreds of years we built political institutions based on what used to be called "mixed government" 3/

It's now most clearly known by the combination of separation of powers, civil rights, the rule of law that we a bit inaccurately call democracy 4/

It's not supposed to answer the question who rules? The people and the king. But says, whoever is in charge, they're constrained by laws another people's power 5/

Another term for these constraints is "institutions" . And institutions have their problems: they can be slow, hard to understand, indifferent to the public mood, be captured by vested interests 6/

Brexitism is about another way to control the powerful. Vote people in, and if you don't like what they're doing, vote them out 7/

That way, the people (or at least a majority of them) are in control. It allows them to wield direct power over their governors (or cashier them, as Edmund Burke would say) 8/

But it has three fundamental problems. 9/

First, bluntness: policies and teams of ministers don't come in neat packages. Most of us like some of the things they do and some of the people doing them but not all. 10/

Second, diversity: not every issue divides into two sides - sometimes there are more, or shades of grey. (And if it's First Past The Post - Single Member Plurality, Americans - it's actually a the most cohesive big minority that holds the power) 11/

Third, longevity: if your instrument of controlling the government is chucking the bastards out: there's a problem: leave the bastards in too long and they could get out of control. Kick them out too quickly and the government's policy veers around like a shopping trolley 12/

Globalisation has sharpened the tension between these two ideas of democratic control - build institutions, or chuck them out. So much of what affects us now happens across borders, and it's harder to see how institutions can control them on our behalf. 13/

But if we can work out who "we" are -- at least we can clearly chuck the wrong people out. That's more than can be done for international institutions where we can't kick out the people in charge, because no single group of people really is. 14/

Kissinger's question about Europe "who do I call?" now applies everywhere. 15/

Brexitism (maybe just Exitism - chuck them out) pulls towards nationalism. There needs to be a "we" entitled to throw them out of office. 16/

And this sets up competition between all the different "we's". Fine for the big ones, but not so good for those unlucky enough to be especially numerous. 17/

The competition is unstable. And it's not only displomatic and economically destructive (through trade disputes or tit for tat tariffs) States have force at their disposal. Violence comes easily to them. 18/

The temptations to protectionism, intimidation and violence are too strong. Too much of our lives now depend on international cooperation to allow it to be governed by a collection of fully sovereign states. 19/

A lot of this is true about domestic policy as well. It takes decades to build a railway line or educate a child. Swings between one majority and another put the success of either at risk. 20/

That's why technical expertise is useful in almost all areas of policy, and why independent civil services are effective. It's even truer of the law. 21/

And all this is without even touching on abuse of power. Voting an all powerful group of people in, in the hope you can vote them out again if they go off the rails is a huge risk. 22/

Power over the state gives you power to corrupt the institutions or make them serve your partisan agenda, so that the next time the vote won't be fair. Don't like the inflation figures, ban their production (as happened under the previous government in Argentina) 23/

Object to the media - make it more "patriotic" as Andrea Leadsom asked for and the ruling parties in Hungary and Poland have achieved. 24/

Brexiters don't like the EU because its institutions get in the way of a national majority. They make radical changes of policy difficult, and government less responsive to the people's temporary will. 25/

That is in fact their intended purpose. To secure peace and wealth in Europe by tempering the people's desires through institutions. They were created after the alternative was tested to destruction. 26/

What matters in the long term is not whether the UK is in or outside the EU, but whether it can operate institutional government outside it. Everything we've seen so far from the Brexit movement suggests it can't. 27/

And just in case their destruction of institutions isn't enough. Jeremy Corbyn's Labour Party stands ready to finish the job. 28/28

David Allen Green
David Allen Green
@davidallengreen
Sadly, there is a lot of force in this thread. Do read.

Perhaps the most unfortunate and counterproductive aspect of Brexit is the Brexiteers' reckless attack on domestic institutions: courts, the civil service, parliamentary representation.

This is not 'taking back control'.

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