All Trump sees is green. All we see is a traitorous orange menace. Who is right? Place bets now!! (Trump continued)

[badbadhusky]

A nod to Banzai there for old timers like me.

Old thread here.

Question is, is it Mueller time yet? Anyone fancy placing a bet on when Trump will exit the POTUS role?

My bet: 20 March 2019.

Dan Rather posted this rather despairingly about an hour ago:

"We are past midnight on the East, and the Shutdown has begun. Echoing across this great land and around the globe is a question of competence (or maybe better phrased proof of incompetence) in our President, our Congress, in the very mechanisms of government. Our friends and allies in foreign lands surely stare in disbelief. Our foes eagerly wish for greater instability and opportunities for their opportunism. And those of us who call this land home, what are we to think?

There will be grandstanding. There will be finger pointing. There will be recriminations. But in our polarized environment, will there be a deal? How long will this last, especially as President Trump seems to revel in defying political gravity? This is less a game of chicken where two sides careen towards each other. Rather we spiral outwards, in opposite directions. The base of each political pole will accept no compromise.

This is the first time there has been a shutdown with one political party controlling the White House and both Houses of Congress. And I think that will be instructive in the ultimate judgement of history. I am not sure how this all ends. But I know how it has begun. It was born out of a cynical calculus from those who seek to maximize their own advantage, achieve their own ends, the rest of the country be damned."

Dan Rather nails it as always.

On the shutdown...

This was said by Obama at a different time (he was giving a speech to young voters at the time)
"If you have to win a campaign by dividing people, you're not going to be able to govern them. You won't be able to unite them later"

Another wise man.

"If you have to win a campaign by dividing people, you're not going to be able to govern them. You won't be able to unite them later"

That should be etched in gold above the doors of every senate and parliament in the world.

As Seth says - it's a matter of 'National Security' as Trump becomes open to blackmail (again).
(Perish the thought that I'm at all interested in the dirty details...)

BREAKING NEWS: Michael Wolff Says Trump Is Having An Extramarital Affair in the White House Right Now (WARNING: NSFW language)
twitter.com/sethabramson/status/954580890130272256

I think they have continually roller over the existing budget for a long time, which isn’t good governance as all the agencies and departments don’t have long term certainty to be able to plan effectively for the future. That was one of the things I took away from this article:

www.vox.com/platform/amp/policy-and-politics/2018/1/19/16908894/shutdown-trump-dreamers-democrats?__twitter_impression=true

In my reporting, I’m surprised by how angry members of Congress are at the endless use of continuing resolutions to fund the government, rather than real appropriations bills. “There’s a level of embarrassment about the ability of the United States Congress to do its job,” Sen. Heidi Heitkamp, a North Dakota Democrat, told Vox. “We’re signaling defeat once again with the CR.”

Absent the DREAMer fight, I doubt there’d be a shutdown. But the anger over CRs is making a lot of Democrats, and even some Republicans, feel better about a shutdown, and a lot worse about just kicking the can down the road again.

On the issue of apparently contradictory actions from the GOP this is my thoughts on it. Possibly a bit rambling, but bear with me.

We are all generally logical people who clearly think things through. It is tempting to assume the people involved are working in a way that mirrors this. We are also assuming that in an unprecedented political situation where everything has changed people are working in the way they have worked before. My impression is that neither of these things is currently the case.

What I see from the GOP, Trump and everyone else at the centre of the mess is pure, unadulterated fire fighting at an individual level. I don't think there is a single gop or even the traditional factions working as they once did. What it looks like is that the GOP has fractured into an everyman for themselves situation. Each member is simply trying to keep their own heads above the water. Any agreement falls apart as soon as someone gets paranoid or thinks they see a better offer. I don't even think most of the individuals have a viable long term plan anymore. They are reacting to events as and when they happen.

This sort of panic driven situation results in exactly the sort of contradictory actions we are seeing. Decisions are being made in the moment, based on short term deals, hunches and fear. You don't see logic because there is none.

That’s far less rambling than my thoughts on the matter bigly and makes a lot of sense. If there’s one thing we’ve learnt to expect from this shithole presidency, it’s chaos.

You're right Bigly - Trump came into this presidency with no plan, no beliefs (other than self-aggrandisement) and no desire to govern. He didn't want it. There is no leadership and like you say everyone around him is either looking out for 'Number One' or they're hopelessly out of their depth.

Per a source familiar: it was Kelly who called Schumer to say that the outline of the deal that Schumer and Trump had discussed was too liberal
twitter.com/samstein/status/954586267538411520

The basic problem is they've called too many of us terrorists in the past and knocked us all off. Their only economic strategy has ever been to steal and destroy.

That's a thought provoking perspective bigly.

I also remember reading something in Nov 16 that none of the times when one party held all three branches of govt had ended in success.

I'm finding the rhetoric and political posturing around the Dreamers to be particularly offensive.

Meanwhile, as a kind of light relief, Richard Ashworth and Matthew Pinsent have adapted Victoria Wood's epic song for Trump times. The full thread is

https://twitter.com/Rashers3/status/954128157187158018
It's long .. but this is the start.

Stormy and Donald sat one night, the sky was clear the stars were bright, the wind was soft the moon was up, Donald drank weirdly from his cup

She licked her lips, he looked confused.
He tweeted as she switched off Fox News.
And Donald cringed in fear and dread as Stormy grabbed his overlong red tie and said...

Lets do it, lets do it, exactly where Obama has;
bring big macs, and Forbes mag,
your iPhone and your bedroom pazaz,
I'm pining, I hanker
If you want to you can pretend I'm Ivanka
Lets do it, lets do it tonight.

I can’t do it, I can’t do it, my schedule is already filled,
check the polls, play 18 holes, I’ve got a biggly wall to build.
I’m planning my fake tanning. You know as well as I do that the Muslims need banning.
I can't do it. I can't do it tonight...

Lets do it, lets do it, cant care about your travel bans,
no left wing, in the WestWing, hug me with your tiny hands,
no wife here, no daughter, under the desk though is that Sebastian Gorka!??
Lets do it, lets do it tonight!

I can't do it. I can't do it.
My button pressing days have gone.
Unless it’s nuclear.
Just to be clear.
I’d love to blow up Kim Jong-un.

It goes on..... and well worth a read

Who's writing the Democrats' talking points? The problem isn't "kicking the can down the road." It's the fact that Republicans took two sets of hostages: DACA young people and CHIP kids and are telling Democrats "pick one to save" or we blow up the building.

"Kicking the can down the road" is Washington speak. Yes a temporary CR for three weeks is weak and silly. But Republicans could pass CHIP funding as a standalone bill ANY TIME THEY WANT. THEY CONTROL THE ENTIRE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. Instead, they've taken 9 million kids hostage.

twitter.com/joyannreid/status/954377747601743873

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jan/20/with-government-shutdown-republicans-reap-what-they-sow

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-russia-bannon-mueller-latest-news-executive-privelege-a8168936.html

You're right Bigly - Trump came into this presidency with no plan, no beliefs (other than self-aggrandisement) and no desire to govern. He didn't want it. There is no leadership and like you say everyone around him is either looking out for 'Number One' or they're hopelessly out of their depth

Too right NorthW and Bigly. Add into that the fact that more than half of the necessary posts haven't been filled and you have a Govt unable to cope. So agree on the fire fighting.

(on a tiny scale, I once had a job with a boss who was awful at managing and a narcissist to boot, and I spent my whole time fire fighting as opposed to doing the actual job. Every day I was reacting to her flip flopping, bringing in ridiculous new things, changing her mind all the time depending on who was 'in' and who was 'out' . It was exhausting)

lion, Lweji.

Yes - the shutdown can be seen as daft and, allegedly Mnuchin, but certainly many others - including Democratic politicians - would rather see a system where there are no such limits. The trouble is that that rather presumes some degree of responsibility from the governing party and right now.............

... not happening, not gonna happen.

So, thought y'all might be interested in this. Pretty good article about the status of federal agencies. Don't get me wrong. This sucks big time. But again, the rank and file US citizen isn't going to be heavily impacted by the shutdown. And the problem with this is that IF they aren't, then they aren't going to be screaming down the phones to their elected officials to 'DO SOMETHING!!'. This could go on a long time.

And so now the federal employees deemed 'essential' (and that would have been me) are working without pay until it all gets settled. They'll be screaming, but no one really cares about the rank and file civil servant. The general public thinks they're all 'fat cats' who should work without pay anyway since they're all so 'overpaid' and 'we pay your salary with our taxes!' (as if govt employees don't pay taxes, too). Politicians don't give a rat's ass as their salaries are exempt. Yes, Congress is still getting paid.

Again, I was lucky. DH worked full time and we had family that could have helped out financially if we had needed it. Our small credit union had low interest 'furlough loans'. And many creditors would allow you to skip payments whilst on furlough (of course interest still accrued). Not sure if that happens these days, though. There are going to be a lot of hurting people. Those deemed 'not essential' may be able to find temp jobs. One year I had lined up work in a friend's office for a few pennies but a shutdown was averted. But those deemed essential won't be that lucky. Yes, they'll be paid eventually, but that doesn't put food on the table tonight.

www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/1/20/16905508/government-shutdown-2018-open-closed-furloughs

"Only federal landmarks and smaller, federally-controlled parks in the city will go without trash collection. In 2013, the district ended up picking up the slack after an accumulation of garbage and rats prompted a rapid response."

Remind me. Which party is responsible for DC's governance?

It must be really stressful, Across.

It is baffling.

The whole shut down situation is so similar to how Brexit is being undertaken. Divided parties pandering to their most extreme partisan bits which inevitably means denying reality and pretending all sorts of things are possibly that patently aren’t.

And when reality hits, it’s those that are most vulnerable that are left even more worse off whilst those in power shrug it off

Very well said, Pain.

We're off to the Women's/Impeachment March is a few hours. It's supposed to be YUGE. Like one of the BIGLY-est crowds since last January's event.

There was a report on TV last night stating that last year's Woman's March, numbers taken in total, was the largest staged event EVER seen, not only in various cities or in the US, but in the WORLD! Second only to Scrotus' inauguration crowd, of course!

Shakespeare:

Oh, when she's angry, she is keen and shrewd! She was a vixen when she went to school. And though she be but little, she is fierce.

Shake that banner for all of us, Across.

Happy marching Across.

Wave a placard for us Acoss!

I was going to go to the anti Trump demo outside the new embassy this afternoon. Clearly I haven't