To ask how you would feel if your adult child decided to emigrate to Oz or NZ

[CaraBosse1]

Be honest and don't say you'd be "cool" about it if you wouldn't really

To the people who state that they would move to be with their children, of course you wouldn’t. Likelihood is that you wouldn’t be able to due to visa’s and other restrictions

That's not always the case, my Dh is Australian, if DD moved there we could go, we have no other kids and no close family other than my parents in the uk. If Dd moved there and decided to stay long term (have family there) then I think it's very likely we would move.

couldn’t follow them around the world, and how many adults would welcome that anyway?

We don't live in Aus because I won't leave my parents - if they would move to Aus we would have gone, so yes, some adults would welcome it

So strange reading all this. My parents would be HORRIFIED if they thought I would give up scholarships and career opportunities to live near them. I would be equally horrified if my children did that. I think the difference though is that in the UK family structures are much more insular. People, even in the friendlier rural areas, lead much more isolated lives than much of Asia. And hired help is not cheap. My parents are very comfortable. Have a very big circle of friends and family. Both of them actually don’t like visiting the UK for too long. They miss their life and their independence. There was a brief prospect of us moving back to our home country and my MIL put her foot down. She did her research and said that in terms of educational opportunities for her grandkids this would be a huge step backwards and she was really against it. So we’ve stayed in the UK. (There were other factors too).

I guess the comparison with the UK and Australia or the US is false because the standard of living, by and large is the same. Those of us who make huge career moves to the West and work bloody hard for it are not heartless abandoners of our parents btw. In fact much of what we earn will keep our parents comfortable in their old age.

I guess, us non Western ‘immigrants’ into the West just have a totally different mentality about this stuff. Although I do hope that the next time all of you are being treated by immigrant doctors and nurses on the NHS and other public services, you do think about what they sacrifice to look after your elderly relatives!

nts’ into the West just have a totally different mentality about this stuff. Although I do hope that the next time all of you are being treated by immigrant doctors and nurses on the NHS and other public services, you do think about what they sacrifice to look after your elderly relatives!

Can I ask what part of this thread prompted the above?

I guess, us non Western ‘immigrants’ into the West just have a totally different mentality about this stuff

As one of those "non Western" immigrants (well, from a non western family anyway), I don't agree at all.

In my culture it's seen as expected that you're around for your parents in their old age.

I don't necessarily agree with this as a blanket thing (eg if your parents were abusive or toxic), but I can't see how I would ever be able to lead a happy life knowing that my mother was 1000s of miles away ill and/or alone in her old age.

Well I assume you’re able to financially able to provide for your parents without having to move for financial reasons

My DH would actually earn four times his current salary in other places. We financially be much better off.

We have chosen to stay near family as the money would not make me happy. I prefer to have the family support and for my DC to know their grandparents.

Which part of the thread?! ALL OF IT. The sheer horror at these heartless people who ‘abandon’ their parents.
As a border crosser, (and someone who studies border crossing on a professional basis), this hand wringing is utterly fascinating about how people are able to compartmentalise their lives and decisions from broader politics.

My sister, also an immigrant, and a hospital consultant btw was despairing over Christmas. There was a serious bed shortage on her ward in a predominantly white area of the UK because of the number of elderly people who had been dumped there over the festive period by their families.

I think what I find fascinating about the UK is that families are such in groups. You can have friends for years and know little about them. I once asked some good friends who had known each other for years if they knew how many siblings they each had. And most had no clue. Whereas where I come from one bus journey later the person next to me will have prised my life story out of me (not always a good thing). So I think this fear of being abandoned by children and the desperation so clear on this thread has to do a lot with British society and safety nets than it has to do with parenting etc.

And my parents are also able to financially provide for themselves!

I find it odd that some posters think there is no practical or emotional difference in having adult children living a couple of hundred miles away and thousands of miles away.

Has anyone said that? A lot of people have backed up your point - that there is also a big difference between when family lives round the corner vs when they live 300 miles away.

For me, my family has a closer relationship with my parents (a day’s travel) than my husband’s (4 hours). A large part of that is the sort of people our respective parents are - mine are much more willing to put in the effort and meet us halfway. But also, we spend 3 weeks every year to 18 months visiting my family. That’s our absolute priority when it comes to discretionary spending. We plan it well in advance, we get the cheapest possible deals and once we get there, we have no accommodation costs. It’s expensive, but not much more than a lot of people spend on flights and hotels for a summer holiday.

And then my parents spend 3-4 weeks here, which always includes a week away somewhere in a holiday cottage. So the ‘quality’ of time they get with my kids is pretty good, although not the same if we lived round the corner. But if we lived in Australia we would not be round the corner anyway.

My in laws have been to visit us twice since we’ve been married. There is ‘no room’ for us to stay at theirs (their prerogative) and when we’ve tried to do extended stays near them in a holiday let they haven’t that been interested. So we get weekends or long weekends where we visit their house each day, but they don’t get the same one on one time or extended contact with the kids. I know if we lived round the corner it would be really different, but we don’t - DH has not lived there at any point in his adult life. For us, a couple of hundred miles has a greater impact than half a world, because of the relative abilities and determination of people to bridge the distance.

There was a serious bed shortage on her ward in a predominantly white area of the UK because of the number of elderly people who had been dumped there over the festive period by their families

On a side note I was not aware that you can 'dump' an inconvenient relative off at hospital and they will keep them.

Skype and FaceTime is pathetic and no replacement.

It’s transformative compared to what there was when I first left Australia, let alone the reality of when my grandparents were young - or when my forebears left Britain in Victorian Times, when it really was more or less forever, and even letters took months.

It’s not a replacement. But it is such a boon to maintaining relationships when you’re separated by an ocean (or in the case of my PIL, a couple of hundred miles and a reluctance to leave their town). Sure, sneer and deride it as ‘pathetic’. You’ve no clue, have you?

I'd be gutted if either of my kids wanted to move to Oz or NZ. I've been to Australia twice and didn't particularly like it, plus the distance and time difference make visiting and keeping in touch much harder.

We're dual citizens of another country, so it's possible that our kids will choose to live there at some point/permanently. I would cope with that better as it's not so far, but I'd still be gutted if they chose to live there permanently. As we have the right to reside there ourselves though we could buy a property there and spend part of the year there, if we wanted to (but only if they both ended up in the same place, which isn't exactly likely).

No you can’t. But you can admit on the basis of a minor complaint and then disappear and leave the doctors and nurses struggling to find people who will come and discharge frail relatives. Happens every single winter. Without fail. Ask any body who works on a geriatric ward.

I just don't think I could ever do that to my own mother. Not out of a sense of obligation but because I love her.

Pecan, I’m sorry, I missed this, this makes more sense than what I thought you were saying about care/the care system.

It’s a very difficult one for us. I suspect the real crunch for us in terms of where we live/whether we move is if either of our families reach that stage of life. We had a taste of it with my husband’s parents when one of them had (thankfully treatable and in remission) cancer a few years ago; he was able to take some time off to support the treatment but frankly there was resentment from his family that he wasn’t nearby to do more. Obviously if it were one of my parents a few days once a month would be impossible. We can’t know how we’ll juggle those situations until they arise, but I don’t think either of us love our parents less than the other. We’ve simply ended up where we’ve ended up, for now. No doors are closed. I don’t think any immigrant can ever really know that the move is permanent.

Pecan I used to work in a care home with a dementia specialism - most of the residents without visitors had children living in the same town, who never visited, although others had outlived their children (heart breaking how many women in their late 80s had outlived not only their husband but also all of their children). Other people never married/ never had children who lived past infancy, and having outlived siblings if they had them simply have no living relatives.

We had one man in his 90s with two sons - one within walking distance of the home never visited and never answered the phone. One who emigrated in the 1980s sent his father regular care packages, often via Amazon next day delivery when his dad needed something as mundane as new underwear, and had bought his dad a mobile, which he carried around all the time in the basket of his walker, and the son phoned his dad every day after breakfast.

We had another couple both in the home whose only son had moved to America - he visited twice a year for a week and spent four or five hours with his parents every day of his visit - they actually had more time with him than most of the residents with local children.

Obviously some local families visited frequently, but a minority, and very often not the resident's child but a niece or grandchild would be the only regular visitor. One lady's only visitor was her widowed SIL despite living children an hour or so away who never visited.

Emigration isn't the reason old people in homes are without visitors, most of the non visiting children are local or dead (or unborn).

Facetime, Skype and Facebook to a certain degree really helped when we were so far from home. When my parents emigrated to France in the early 70s, my Mum had to send a letter to my Grandma to tell her to be at a neighbour's house on a certain day, at a certain time, so she could call her (my Grandma lived in rural Cornwall and had no phone!) to tell her she was pregnant with me.

I can't imagine how hard that kind of disconnect from family must be, at least when we were away we could see pictures of our nieces and nephews on FB and WhatsApp almost as soon as things happened, and my Mum in law and youngest dc used to Skype every Sunday morning for an hour or two and chat, draw, eat breakfast together. No, it's not the same as being physically together, but it does make it much easier to maintain relationships and helps keep you connected to home, and the effects of that shouldn't be written off as 'pathetic' when they're a valuable link for a lot of ex pats.

My son emigrated to North America 10 years ago and is a Canadian citizen now, it seems only like yesterday that I saw him.

We skype, WhatsApp, text, email, visit, we have a very close relationship.

If the cost of healthcare wasn't so high for senior citizens we'd be there like a shot too.

Embrace it, the grass is greener on the other side for most people. I am the only member of my family in the UK, brothers and sisters are all expats and have been since their early 20's.

Well you can obviously support your family where you live that’s great you are fortunate enough to be able to make that choice, I prefer my children to have a roof over their head and food to eat. As do other families who don’t have the luxury of making the choice.

OldBook - “The Atlantic of the Mind”. Perceptions of distance do differ. Now I’ve been back and forth loads of times the UK feels closer than before and the world feels smaller. Aussies DEFINITELY see Europe as closer, than Brits see Australia. All flights out of Oz take hours so if you want to go abroad it’s all the same really. You will NEVER here an Aussie say “the flight is too long” as an excuse not to go somewhere they want to go - ever. It’s just the way life is here. If you want to travel (and many do!) it always involves a long flight. I was surprised when I first moved here how many colleagues casually said they were going skiing in Switzerland at Christmas, or off the Greek Islands for their winter (European summer) break. UK people will always find an Aussie somewhere when they go abroad. How do they think they got there?! We’re holidaying in Mexico in June and my next door neighbour went to Cuba at Christmas. These are loong trips from OZ but people just shrug and do it. I think Brits sometimes think if you move to Aus you aren’t allowed to holiday anywhere else, or why would you want to go somewhere else hot for a holiday when it’s hot in Australia. Just goes to show how perceptions alter between countries.

Well you can obviously support your family where you live that’s great you are fortunate enough to be able to make that choice, I prefer my children to have a roof over their head and food to eat. As do other families who don’t have the luxury of making the choice.

Sure but do you really think that's the main reason people choose to emigrate to NZ and Australia?

I wouod be delighted.
They would the third generation to have done exactly that (my parents, me and then them).
You can still have a great relationhsip wth your dcs even if they are that far away (and we all moved that far away from each other lol).
It’s even easier now with Skype etc... when it was all telephone call at stupid rates, you couldn’t spend that much time talking to each other like this.

I think a huge part of this comes down to money. I'd be devastated if my children moved overseas because I don't have enough money to visit them, not even once. If I could go once a year and they could come here once a year then it wouldn't be a huge deal.

I would be happy for them. It might be tinged with a little sadness, but the overriding feeling would be that they should do what they want/need and if that is moving overseas then I would support that.

Fir those saying they ‘couldn’t do it to their parents’, do you all live close by?

I wonder if some of you just don’t have any interest in ever moving from where you are familiar with and it is easy to look for reasons to stay rather than want the adventure of trying something completely different?

*Fir those saying they ‘couldn’t do it to their parents’, do you all live close by?

I wonder if some of you just don’t have any interest in ever moving from where you are familiar with and it is easy to look for reasons to stay rather than want the adventure of trying something completely different?*

What a spectacularly patronising response.