Labour has totally lost the plot wit Identity Politics?

[bambambini]

Labour Youth are advertising posts and have positions ring marked for “self identifying women only” to encourage more women into politics. Just seems a really strange way of describing women and actually means that all the posts could go males instead of females (can’t really use women any more). Can’t wrap my mind round how identity politics has become so prolific and taking priority or biology. The future doesn’t seem to have much place for females. Labout Woman’s officer Lily Madigan on it.?I’d like to see what Labour women think of this.

I hate all identity politics. In the 90s the message was that despite our differences we are humans, we are all essentially the same and equal. We should forget our differences and celebrate our similarities and what we have in common.

Now the message is, not only are we all different, our differences are the most important thing about us and we all separated in neat little group boxes and we are in competition with all the other people in the other boxes who are different from us and we need to gain advantage for our box by pushing all the other people in the other boxes down.

It's divide and conquer and it's making things worse for the weakest in society and better for the strongest and wealthiest.

After all, if you have all your power and privilege because you're white it's not your fault and you can't change it. If people realised it's actually because they have money and connection rather than because of their colour people might start trying to change that. And they don't want to give it up.

Those of you who will not be voting labour because of this particular issue, which party will you vote and on what basis?

I have no idea. I think conservatives for me. Anyone who will keep Labour out tbh.

Identity politics is the natural end result of a society that promotes "diversity" as the highest moral good.

People don't seem to realise that diversity means just that - diversity of thought, behaviour, values, morals. It doesn't mean different fashions and foods. The outcome is a society that breaks down into identity tribes all warring for a slice of political power. And people then wonder why public life and discussion has become so fraught.

There's another thread atm where people are wanking on about the "diversity" in a particular city and whether or not there's enough to make it a "good" choice. It's this unthinking worship of "diversity" which leads us to this current transgender hell which is going to see women's rights tossed into a burning bin.

There's another thread atm where people are wanking on about the "diversity" in a particular city and whether or not there's enough to make it a "good" choice

I haven't read the thread, but my guess is that most are thinking about good restaurants, interesting grocery stores and cool ethnic homewares shops and not so much a mosque next door.

I have no idea. I think conservatives for me. Anyone who will keep Labour out tbh

But they are making the same moves - I mean look at all the idiocy over the GRA!

I don't know, anyone who says they are voting conservatives to protect women is seriously misguided I'm afraid. I mean, for example closures of refuges, as well as of course as usual women tend to bear the brunt of any cuts as they are usually on a lower salary and also tend to be main carers. But maybe some women are better off under conservatives and who can blame them for voting for their own interests. But I really don't think any woman who is a lone parent/has other significant caring duties, is on a low income, or disabled/long term sick, or has mental health problems or escaping an abusive relationship would be in any way better off under conservatives.

I'm open to be proven otherwise.

I really need to hear Stella Creasy, Jess Phillips, Caroline Flints’ views on identity politcs - Lily Madigan, The Labour Youth’s Self Identifying Women, TW in Sports, self identification, GRA reforms etc.

I really NEED to hear what their views are, i want this honestly discussed.

In my circumstances I am better off under the conservatives. But I've always voted Labour for the benefit I perceived to society. Lib dems are probably more in line with how I think but they're never going to get voted in. But I can't possibly vote for Labour when they are behaving like this to women. At least the conservatives have had 2 women leaders. Labour have had none.

I was trying to explain my feelings about this issue earlier and was linked to this meme.

I can't tell you how utterly pissed off this has made me, to be told that being a trans is no different to being tall or having freckles, we're all still women. No.

Sex is not negotiable, neither is height or freckles.

You can't say "I'm short but I identify as tall" or "I don't have freckles but I identify as though I do" and expect to be taken seriously.

Women have been discriminated against throughout history, and this is a further extension of it by men, and sadly by women.

Another friend also linked this quote after that ridiculous cartoon" "A strong woman who recklessly throws away her strength, she is worse than a weak woman who has never had any strength to throw away."

Lets not throw ourselves away.

Nothing about a girl's body makes her more or less of a girl?

Oh FFS. Of course it does. Primary and secondary sexual organs for one thing.

A woman is a woman by virtue of her biological sex. Gender is an idea.

Yet I agree, but apparently "feminists defining themselves by what they have between their legs is feminists behaving like misogynists."

Which is basically another way to try and silence us for pointing out something they don't want to know.

Surely having surgery to create a facsimile of the genitals of the opposite sex is the definition of ‘defining oneself by what’s in between the legs’ ?

*Yet I agree, but apparently "feminists defining themselves by what they have between their legs is feminists behaving like misogynists."

I know, but what terrified me about that visual was the complete absence of anything sexual. It felt very Victorian in many ways.

It is a very creepy and weird little drawing, with a potential for doing great damage to women and girls.

Just posting to say Thankyou for all the information on this thread. We really are under attack and the erudite, well researched posters rebutting this trans propaganda deserve medals

It is a very creepy and weird little drawing, with a potential for doing great damage to women and girls

Yes, combined with the ideology behind it. As well as being Victorian it smacks of men talking about what they find fuckable in women - some prefer blondes or redheads, or brunettes or short, tall, given ethnicity, etc. Coz that's what makes us, not anything else.

hmm, MN deleted my post about murders of women because I cast aspersions on the sacred trans day of remembrance. WTF?

There are labour activists on twitter just now discussing that 'of course' transwomen are included in all-women shortlists.

yeah they've got some bloke with long hair on the all-woman shortlist in Rushcliffe.

A 'lesbian', obvs, who wants to out-#metoo everyone else.

Obviously his Twitter feed consists of nothing but trans stuff.

twitter.com/heatherisone

'transwomen are women' indeed!

He constantly retweets a nasty FB message he received months ago, as proof of how evil women are (the person is called 'Maxine', which he leaves in, just so we know it's a woman.)

Transwomen are statistically more likely to be raped, to be murdered, to be sexually assaulted or violently attacked, to be discriminated against at work, to be homeless, to be paid less than their peers, and to be the victims of domestic violence than ciswomen are. These are facts, available for you to check for yourselves with minimal online research.

Firstly, in the UK, transwomen are statistically more likely to murder than be murdered.

Secondly, being discriminated against doesn't change your sex, funnily enough.

A man in Britain who decides to identify as a woman is statistically less likely to be murdered than before he transitioned.

Try again.

The stats about Transwomen being more likely to be murdered are not correct. They are taken from data about the murder of Transwomen in South Africa which is sadly very high and has a lot to do with their very active participation in an extremely violent prostitution industry.

The murder rates of Transwomen are not comparable anywhere else, but trans activists always dishonestly extrapolate them to the whole world.

I think the data come from South America (Brazil) rather than South Africa.

It isn't just in the UK either:www.flanderstoday.eu/current-affairs/new-law-makes-it-easier-officially-change-gender