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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Have I been mean to this child?

435 replies

SureJan · 07/01/2018 19:52

My baby DS is 6mo. My cousin came round to visit with her 4yo DD.
Baby has some toys, obviously nothing really for a 4yo to play with but I didn't mind at all her playing with the baby toys.
4yo started getting a little bit naughty (probably bored) & was snatching toys off the baby. Cousin, her mum, didn't say anything to her about it. Eventually I gently told her not to snatch, he's only a baby etc. Cousin not phased, didn't say a word to her. She didn't stop doing it so I started wrapping up the play date, picked up baby & said he was due a bottle, that sort of thing, to signal it was time they went home.
4yo started making a fuss when cousin said it was time to go & she was flustered. 4yo had baby's rattle in her hand & looked like she wasn't going to put it back. I nicely asked are you going to put the rattle back? They both ignored me. Cousin started saying bye, thanks for having us, 4yo still had hold of rattle. I said (nicely again) I'll take that rattle off you now, & she started kicking off really bad, screaming, crying etc. Cousin said nothing to me, just looked at her DD & looked blankly at me. I tried to tell 4yo it was baby's & baby needs it so it has to stay here - more screaming & crying, still no input from cousin. Then cousin says to 4yo, maybe SureJan will let you borrow it until we come again? I said sorry, no. Cousin rolled her eyes at me & said 'really?' in a very pissed off tone, & I stuck to my guns & said yes really, it's not hers to take!
Cousin cajoled & begged 4yo for a good minute or 2 to hand it over, with her screaming full pelt in her face, & eventually cousin snatched it off her, threw it onto the floor & dragged her out of the house saying 'thanks for fucking nothing' to me!
WIBU? Part of me feels bad because it was just a rattle & baby probably wouldn't have missed it, maybe I was being a bit mean? I'm sure cousin thinks I was just being awkward & making her suffer through an embarrassing tantrum that I could have easily stopped by letting her take the bloody thing.
But part of me thinks no, it's not my fault she won't discipline her DD & why should I just give her stuff to take home so that she gets an easier time? It was a rattle & she's 4yo so not age appropriate for her, I feel she was just pushing boundaries & didn't really want it.
I know it isn't my place to tell cousin how to discipline but I do feel she should have stepped in way before the rattle incident by telling her DD to stop snatching, play nicely, be gentle with baby etc. It annoyed me that she didn't!
Am I mean/unreasonable? I have no doubt that there will come a time when baby is older & tantrumming in similar fashion & I'll be able to empathise more, but I don't think in that situation I'd let him take the toy to keep him quiet.

OP posts:
expatinscotland · 08/01/2018 17:58

Dear god, of course YANBU

CorbynsBumFlannel · 08/01/2018 18:00

Repeatedly letting her dd snatch toys from the baby was not disciplining though.
And yes the op probably could have sacrificed her baby's toy to prevent this one tantrum but the cousin should not be relying on other people giving her kids things. And actually the op may have caused bigger problems in future by reinforcing to the child that if she kicks up enough of a stink people will let her have stuff!

pollymere · 08/01/2018 18:02

In our house we call it "wanting a squirrel". My daughter loves Charlie and the Chocolate Factory and when she was small, a reminder that she was being like Verruca Salt was enough. Four is old enough to understand that you can't just take stuff that isn't yours.

FrancisCrawford · 08/01/2018 18:04

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Mummaofboys · 08/01/2018 18:07

Four year olds do take toys off other children and babies, it’s the grass is greener syndrome, If you feel like the child was being unreasonable I suggest you don’t have two kids, as this is what happens daily. on the rattle situation I think you were perfectly reasonable to ask for the toy back and your cousin was just a bit embarrassed of her daughters behaviour.

Foxjar · 08/01/2018 18:10

My 4 year olds didn't.Hmm

She's old enough to be in school where she would be expected not to take things others are playing with.

The mother snatched it,threw it on the floor and swore.Explains everything,what a dreadful role model.

elmo1990 · 08/01/2018 18:19

Yanbu. I would never let my 3 year old act like that especially not at someone else's home

impossible · 08/01/2018 18:23

As most people on here say YANBU to not to want your cousin's DD to take a toy. Nonetheless you could have perhaps been kinder during a difficult moment for your cousin, maybe letting her borrow the rattle or coming up with a distraction. Instead you seem to have been righteous and crtitical - I can see why your cousin might be annoyed. Parenting a 4 year old is very different from parenting a 6 month old as you will discover.

DP and I were very strict about not letting our dcs take other dcs' belongings but occasionally our dcs or their friends would be tricky when leaving a playdate and a bit of understanding from the host parent would make things much easier. It seemed to me the upset was more often about leaving the playdate than wanting the toy itself. A bit of give and take in those situations generally makes life easier. I used to keep boxes of raisins as a distraction for moments like these, to be given when dcs were out the door.

My dcs and their friends are now teens and lovely people so no harm done from occasionally working round them. Kindness and understanding are also virtues worth learning.

If you want your cousin and DD to vist again (or anyone with older dcs) get in some stickers, pencils, paper, playdough etc so a visit is interesting for visiting DC too. No small child wants to watch a baby play with their rattles.

Blackteadrinker77 · 08/01/2018 18:25

What will she do when she picks up something in a shop and wants it?

You have to teach them they can't have everything they want.

SparklyLights · 08/01/2018 18:25

Not RTWT because 12 pages long but YANBU.

Your cousin is hardly a shrinking violet if she can say "Thanks for fucking nothing" to you. If she's that direct (and rude, and sweary in front of kids - hardly modelling appropriate communication) she can say NO to her kid.

BitOutOfPractice · 08/01/2018 18:32

Toddlers don't always behave rationally or as you'd wish. You will learn that OP. And be a little less po-faced

luckylorca · 08/01/2018 18:32

To Impossible: I don't think it's the OP's job to provide (age-appropriate) toys for any visiting children. It's up to the parent who brings the visiting child to think about that kind of thing and plan ahead.

MadMaryBoddington · 08/01/2018 18:35

YANBU. I had a similar situation when a friend who lives abroad visited with her four year old dc. When they left to go to the airport, I suddenly realised he’d got in the car holding a soft toy belonging to my ds.

I asked him to hand it over, then his mother asked him, he refused and started tantrumming. If that was my child, I’d have simply pulled it off him at that point, but his mother suggested they’d just buy us another. I explained that the toy was one of ds’s favourites and had been brought from Australia for him, by a friend, and so couldn’t be replaced.

To my astonishment, instead of getting it off him, she just started googling, saying “I’m sure we’ll find one”. She did, took twenty quid out of her purse, and sent me the link so I could order one.

I was left with no option but to accept, or look like a dick. It pissed me off royally though. The replacement looks the same, but it isn’t the toy that was chosen with love and brought from the other side of the world by a special friend.

nousername123 · 08/01/2018 18:37

So your cousin would have allowed her child to steal from your child? She has no authority over her own child and clearly doesn't know how to handle her. You were not being unreasonable. Your cousin was definitely being unreasonable! The fact that it's just a rattle that your baby might not have missed isn't the point. It's not on at all. Your cousins child is going to be a major brat as she grows up. I wouldn't want her playing with my baby x

CorbynsBumFlannel · 08/01/2018 18:38

I have 2 kids and when they were younger they did snatch as kids do. It doesn't mean you have to sit by and do nothing about it!

Foxjar · 08/01/2018 18:39

Shock Madmary

Bobbi73 · 08/01/2018 18:40

My kids are a bit older but I hardly ever gave in to a tantrum ( obviously there were times it was the wisest move!) as it sets you up for a world of far bigger problems if you do. The rattle is not the issue, rather the mum's lack of discipline. YWNBU

Biblio78 · 08/01/2018 18:40

Not mean, being an adult and giving boundaries. Sounds like she was bored like you said. Cousin sounds like they're struggling like we all do with the dynamo force of a 4yr old. Maybe broach it in a ' we should plan something for the 4yr old to do next time like homemade playdough.' or 'I realised I only have baby toys, ive got some crayons/paint for next time.

SparklyLights · 08/01/2018 18:41

BitOutOfPractice - but the cousin wasn't rational. OP shouldn't have been put in the position of having a stand-off with the DD over taking a toy belonging to OP's baby.

perfectstorm · 08/01/2018 18:44

I think you did the right thing.

You did this over a rattle? I find that amazing. One of the biggest lessons in parenting is learning which battles to fight, and not to sweat the small stuff.

Teaching a school aged child that they can steal something belonging to another child,. after that child's parent has asked for it back, by throwing a tantrum... is a battle worth fighting. Every time.

The mother didn't need to make a big drama. She just needed to be calm, clear and kind, but consistent. My kids so not pull this shit now because they never got to benefit from it.

My elder is ASD and the 3 yr old who is being assessed for ADHD. They have good manners, and they understand that the world doesn't revolve around them. I wouldn't reward that behaviour - ever - because if you reward tantrums by complying, you teach them to have more. It's just... shitty parenting. As is losing her rag and having a hissy in front of her child because you wouldn't enable it, because that winds a child up, instead of helping her to regulate her emotions. You have to show them things aren't a big deal, distract, engage, move on. Not stand there like a lummock and then flounce when people don't share your wish that the world orbit around your child, but support them in the horrifying realisation that, well, it doesn't.

You don't need to scream or grab or what have you. You just need to be clear and wait out the storm. Small kids are emotional tempests, and that's just how it is. You don't change that, they just outgrow it, but they do it faster if you don't feed the fury by your own, and reward the behaviour by appeasing.

You'd never have seen that rattle again, either.

nousername123 · 08/01/2018 18:46

Not to mention that your cousin sounds like a 4 year old having a tantrum by throwing the rattle on the floor and swearing in front of her 4 year old. Bloody pathetic. I wouldn't entertain them again.

perfectstorm · 08/01/2018 18:46

Should add that the 4 yr old was doing her job. She's a small child; showing her mum up and being all over the place when tired/hungry/yearning for something she has taken a huge fancy to is in the manual. She's not to blame in the slightest.

MadRainbow · 08/01/2018 18:50

Having a 4 year old myself I can say I would never tolerate this behaviour and yes she IS old enough to understand that no matter how much she likes something, if it's not hers she needs to put it back.

Perhaps for a quiet life it would've been easier to just leave it however, life isn't like that and the sooner this little girl learns that not everyone will put up with her crap the better.

Your cousin is the one BU.

DearShirt · 08/01/2018 18:51

MadMary I can't understand why you went along with it?!

OP YWNBU.

I would have taken a bag of toys for my older child to play with and a 4 year old would have been told in no uncertain terms to give the baby's toy back. Your cousin is an ineffective parent.

MadRainbow · 08/01/2018 18:53

Forgot to add the 4 year old isn't to blame - her mother's enabling parenting is

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