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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To arrange a party for a Sunday as it means the morman best friend can't attend?

148 replies

Ieatcake · 02/01/2018 13:41

Just that really. Struggling to find a date that we and the place can all do. Would you consider the best friend vital?

I already have a hard enough time trying to explain why their family can't have tea or coffee due to caffeine but are fine with chocolate and coke. I don't have anything against them they seem nice, but it's already hard enough as it is trying to get a date that suits all.

OP posts:
Monmo2124 · 04/01/2018 01:00

To be honest it seems like you have an issue with his friend being Mormon . Your child is curious and wants to know why they can’t have hot drinks , better to ask directly from his best friends family .

My sons are much older and never had tea or coffee even though we are Muslims , they don’t have soft drinks either. I appreciate if my sons friends ask questions about Islam as kids are curious and why shouldn’t they . My sons best friend for the longest time was a Hindu and he has learnt so many things about his religion from him , we still celebrate Diwali with them .

Arrange the party on Sunday , if they say they can’t come ask say you are sorry about it . Is there a day which suits them for play date / mini birthday celebration where it’s just both of them ? If they say yes good kids will get one on one play time .

squeekums · 04/01/2018 01:54

Your kids party, choose a day that suits you
Other peoples mythical beliefs dont factor into my choice of when and where party is.

Allergies are catered for though

PhilODox · 04/01/2018 02:12

Ahem, I believe it was a fig tree that Jesus cursed, not an olive tree.

All these religious folks on here, and an error in scripture goes unnoticed....

Tea and coffee not drunk by Mormons? Dearie me, I think my Methodist church as a child actually ran on tea and biscuits.... we had a great many "coffee mornings", but I'm sure everyone drank tea at them!

Jenny70 · 04/01/2018 03:02

I thought LDS didn't celebrate birthdays at all, we have friends that will come to a gathering close to a birthday, but not if there is a birthday cake/presents etc. Makes for all kinds of work arounds, such as having candles earlier and then the cake presented after the meal as "dessert" without the birthday assortment.

Personally, I think if you're organising a party you decide what works for you and the majority - trying to accomodate each person is a nightmare, and you can reschedule to a sat a month later and then the kid is ill that day and can't make it, or they go away that weekend etc.

ClaudiaD13 · 04/01/2018 09:05

@Jenny70 I think you may be getting confused with LDS and Jehovahs Witness. LDS definitely celebrate birthdays.

itsonlysubterfuge · 04/01/2018 10:41

I think it depends on how strict the Mormons are. When I was at school and their was a party they would ALWAYS have Sprite as it wasn't caffeinated. Almost all of the sodas were available was non-caffeinated at the grocery store and a lot of things that were caffeinated in other states weren't in my state, for example Root Beer.

Most Mormons I knew just treated Sunday as a regular day, but treated it as a day for being with family, rather than going their seperate ways. My Grandma will happily have people over on Sunday, but doesn't like going out other than church, even picking up fast food on the way home bothers her. So having a party at their house wouldn't be forbidden, but they wouldn't go out iyswim?

LunaMay · 04/01/2018 11:25

Blush I thought they were the same thing, so Jehovahs aren't mormons? We have two clients at work that are Jehovahs Witness, one family is happy for the client to celebrate birthdays and holidays with us where as the other would rather we didnt include them so we come up with similar work arounds with cake/presents etc.

I would just do a party for when it suits you, your son will probably be to busy to notice the absence of his bf on the day. Make up for it with a special treat for the two of them if you feel like it.

mummyhaschangedhername · 04/01/2018 11:50

Jenny, that's Jehovah's Witnesses. Mormons celebrate birthdays, have candles etc.

The spite thing is due to culture not doctrine. I don't drink coke, I was raised not to but it really has nothing to do with doctrine.

As for the tree, yes it was a fig tree. I don't tend to get hung up on technicalities, I wasn't sure it was relevant to correct it? I am just here offering my perspective, not trying to defend or argue anything.

mummyhaschangedhername · 04/01/2018 11:56

Luna; they are different religions, Mormons celebrate but without alcohol.

lynmilne65 · 04/01/2018 11:57

coke has caffeine

mummyhaschangedhername · 04/01/2018 12:07

I know, and I think that that is where the confusion came in with caffeine relating to the tea and coffee thing. The reality was someone in leadership once said at a general conference (which all members watch) to avoid it. It was never a commandment or anything other than one person who time saying to avoid it. There was rumours that it had cocaine in it, google confirms that was the case about 100 years ago (who knew coke was so old?) ... so that is a possible reason for it, also who know it's not great for your teeth. But who knows? Point is someone said it, some members clearly lost their heads and decided it was caffeine that they needed to avoid. I'm sure someone took that seriously as actually avoided caffeine, where as other stated that was the reason without considering the other caffeine laden products they did consume. However, now, there are very few Mormons who don't consume coke. I don't as I was raised that way and have another of a love affair with chocolate to want to add more things to become addicted too 🙈 my kids don't solely because I worry for their teeth, but I have no real issue them having it as long as it doesn't compromise their teeth.

Ieatcake · 04/01/2018 16:03

Thanks so much @mummyhaschangedhername for your replys and helping us learn more about it. I had no idea there were so many in the UK.

If my scatterball questions aren't getting too annoying.

You have to give 10% of net earnings to the church? Is this true? Are there ever any issues with people not giving the full amount they are supposed to pay? What happens to the money? I assume lots is used for good causes or events.

Do many people find their future partners at events for the church?

OP posts:
mummyhaschangedhername · 04/01/2018 17:08

No problem at all.

You have to give 10% of net earnings to the church? Is this true? Are there ever any issues with people not giving the full amount they are supposed to pay? What happens to the money? I assume lots is used for good causes or events.

We are commanded to give 10% of our increase to the church in tithes as well as make additional contributions.

As to what the 10% includes again has an element of discretion although some bishops will be more vocal about what that means. We pay 10% on our gross salary, most in this country I think pay it net. Some pay it on any cash or even equivalent value of item received, such as if they were given a car (perhaps a bit extreme but just to illustrate) they would say on 10% of its value. I don't know any personally that do that but I've seen some say they do on forums. Some pay on benefits, or pensions or other things but others don't. I even know of people who lag after all expenses and deductions. We are required to be full tithe payers to be able to have temple recommends which allows us to go into the temple, and essentially that's the standard expected. But no one would be kicked out for not doing so.

The money is mostly used for building of temples, and administration costs of running the church. All local ministers are lay, no one is paid. It's used for charity work and just the general real running of the church.

In addition, we are required to make fast offering, on the first Sunday of the month (usually) we fast for 24 to draw closer to God, we donate the money we would have paid for the meals of that day. That money is used for local relief of those in need, we call it welfare. So in theory a member in trouble can call to the bishop/minster for help and money is available to help.

We also have other funds, like missionary funds (our missionaries are self funded with help from membership), as well as education funds to help those mostly in poorer countries get an education, and specific funds for other things, like humanitarian efforts, although tithing also covers that. But when there is major crisis in the world members will donate additionally to that fund to help.

The church is well know for its aid, we own store houses and farms to help provide aid at very short notice.

Do many people find their future partners at events for the church?
As for marriage within the church some do, and some don't. I married "within" the church. It's kind of expected because we believe in marriage after death and that can only be down for sealing ordinances and therefore between members. But my husbands family all married outside the church, a lot do, the church is always much more popular with females for varying reasons and therefore it's hard. Some people stay single, other marry outside the church, just depends really.

When I was in my early 20s there was lots of activities held all over the country which kept me busy, I would think nothing of driving 4 hours in an evening to go to a dance and then turn around and drive back home, after a days work. To be honest I had a more active social life than many of my friends who were not members, I met my husband at a weekend convention where we did activities, had dances, had fun fair rides, had doctrine classes, but mostly just socialised.

I think the church does a lot less of those time of activities now, locally we have a camp festival thing once a year but I think it's all a lot less popular and there are no where near the amount of activities there were 10 years ago.

DagenhamRoundhouse · 04/01/2018 17:16

No tea or coffee but they can eat choc and drink Coke? That makes no sense!

00100001 · 04/01/2018 17:57

Dagenham RTFT

PhilODox · 05/01/2018 00:33

Surely all denominations of Christians are supposed to tithe?

AcrossthePond55 · 06/01/2018 14:16

All Christians are expected to 'give back' in the form of tithes or to charity. If one has a 'home church', then one should help support it. If not or in addition to, as a Christian we're expected to give to those less fortunate in the form of charity donations. Jesus taught us that we are to love our brother as ourselves and to help the less fortunate. Conversely, he also made it clear that we cannot 'buy' our way into Heaven by tithing or charitable donations.

The word 'tithe' comes from the Old English 'teotha' which means 'a tenth'. Whether Christ actually said 'a tenth' or if that's what the church 'powers' decided at the time of translation, who knows? All we know is that we are to be charitable and loving of our fellow man.

Ieatcake · 07/01/2018 10:54

@mummyhaschangedhername thanks again, it's been so useful to answer the questions I can't just blurt out irl Smile

With Christians many I've met don't financial obligations to the church and others that seriously. The most deeply religious Christian I've met and lived with ended up scamming me out of money and is hugely wealthy Hmm

OP posts:
mummyhaschangedhername · 07/01/2018 13:17

In all honestly, some of the most horrible and dishonest people I have met were in the church and some of the most kind and honest outside. But equally there is a mix of people good and bad in and out of the church. Religion doesn't make you a nice person. I guess it you really lived it then it would change you and make you a better person, you can love someone and hurt someone at the same time. Yet, it is what it is.

I believe, not because of the people and their actions but because if my own personal experiences with God, I believe because there are things that I can't deny and I believe because I think it makes ME a better person.

AcrossthePond55 · 07/01/2018 15:06

leat

The person who scammed you may have gone to church and may have bleated on about being a Christian, but he certainly was NOT one.

CraftyGin · 07/01/2018 16:05

There are lots of people who have exploited Christian niceness for their own devious gains, including many —RC— priests. It doesn’t mean they were ever Christian but just that they were evil people who exploited weak spots.

CraftyGin · 07/01/2018 16:18

Different denominations/sects have their own ways of raising money. Churches do not run on thin air. They need regular, assured income in order to survive in the secular world (eg pay the gas bill) and to do mission work.

Some churches are fairly authoritarian about their expectations - you’ve got to give 10% and we’ll check your tax returns (eg LDS, Plymouth Brethren and some US evangelicals) to “just drop a few coppers in the plate” (RCC).

I think the COfE has it about right in that the biblical expectation is 10%, but we are not living in biblical times, and discipleship plays a big part. Giving, whatever you situation, should be sacrificial, and in the words of Wesley: earn all you can, give all you can, save all you can.

People should be encourage to plan their giving in a tax efficient way, as church outgoings tend to be very predictable throughout the year.

mummyhaschangedhername · 07/01/2018 16:47

Crafty. They don't ever ask to check out tax return although we are asked if we are a full tithe payer. It's on us to declare if we are or are not and it's not checked up on.

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